Feeding issues

Hey,

so my snake has stopped eating and it has been three weeks. I feed her frozen rats and the preparation has remained the same each time. she was doing very well and then this happened again. Her temps are 88-90 hot side and 77-80 cold side. I have also noticed she has been spending all her time on the cold side; literally she hasn't gone to the hot side for all this time. She has gone from 1286 (weighed the day after feeding and the rat was 105g), so technically 1181g to 1166g (now). I am worried but she won't eat and i also noticed she moves funny. this happened once before but it was nothing but now its back so I'm not sure. rather then slither she shimmies by lifting parts of her body up and back and then continues to move that sort of way rather then just slither. I'm getting worried about her. I don't want to force her to eat cause in the summer she went a month and 2 weeks and finally got back onto her scheduled eatings. What i was thinking of doing was waiting a week and trying the frozen again and otherwise if that doesn't work, ill get her a live rat. I wanted t hear any suggestions and am open to ideas. I know they are finicky eaters so I'm border-lined concerned.

where is her water bowl and how big is it?
Her not eating is not a huge deal with a ball, that is not a huge weight loss either.
I wouldn't be worried but keep an eye on her.

If she doesn't wanna be on her hot side at all,well I'd think your hot side is to hot...I keep my hot side of my tank warm,not hot... Definitely I'd think feeding live can cause a trigger to get her eating. Just spoke to a few buddies of mine,they have had similar problems and live usually gets them going. I'm sure your pet will be fine :)

Your girl sounds just like my girl Eva! She's around 1350g and will be 5 years old in January. She's such a picky eater but she's even more picky in the winter. Today was her feeding day and she didn't want to eat. So I'm going to have to put her back on a two week schedule for the winter. Does your snake eat consistently in the warmer months? Eva eats well when it's warmer, but since it's breeding season she may just not want to eat. I know Eva has been skimping on her feeding this winter. But at her size she has enough weight to go months without eating so she will be okay :) and that's weird about her movement. Does she just move weird in her enclosure or when you take her out? I'd take her out and see how she moves outside the enclosure. Hope this helps a bit. I know how it is to worry when they stop eating.


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I wouldn't worry too much about her not eating yet. My normal girl eats when she wants, she just had a 3 week strike. I wouldn't over think it.
As for staying on the cool side.. I would first check your again, what are you using to get your temps? How is your enclosure heated? Is there a thermostat on the heat source?
If that's all Ok I would say she just wants to be cooler... maybe the time of year...

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it kinda just happens sometimes my pastel just stopped eating for about a month and a half she was on pre killed mice, and one day just didnt eat and showed no interest for a while. then randomly i put in a live one and she was fine. i would give it a try the worst that could happen is she doesnt eat again

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

where is her water bowl and how big is it?
Her not eating is not a huge deal with a ball, that is not a huge weight loss either.
I wouldn't be worried but keep an eye on her.

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Her water bowl is in between both her hides slightly closer to the cold side but not a huge marginal difference. It's big. It's one of those Eco terra corner dishes. Sorry not sure how to describe how big it is

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Originally Posted by AlexisFitzy

Your girl sounds just like my girl Eva! She's around 1350g and will be 5 years old in January. She's such a picky eater but she's even more picky in the winter. Today was her feeding day and she didn't want to eat. So I'm going to have to put her back on a two week schedule for the winter. Does your snake eat consistently in the warmer months? Eva eats well when it's warmer, but since it's breeding season she may just not want to eat. I know Eva has been skimping on her feeding this winter. But at her size she has enough weight to go months without eating so she will be okay :) and that's weird about her movement. Does she just move weird in her enclosure or when you take her out? I'd take her out and see how she moves outside the enclosure. Hope this helps a bit. I know how it is to worry when they stop eating.


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She eats better in the summer but she did this same thing closer to the end of the summer. Yah the movement thing happened once before also and then went away. It's very weird cause it happens in the enclosure and outside of it. It's like she doesn't want to move her body she just moves her neck out and then that's the extent. Otherwise she moves like that. So weird, but I do think that's a contributor to the eating thing.

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Originally Posted by Crazymonkee

I wouldn't worry too much about her not eating yet. My normal girl eats when she wants, she just had a 3 week strike. I wouldn't over think it.
As for staying on the cool side.. I would first check your again, what are you using to get your temps? How is your enclosure heated? Is there a thermostat on the heat source?
If that's all Ok I would say she just wants to be cooler... maybe the time of year...

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I use a digital thermostat and a temp gun for a double check. She has a UTH and I have a canopy that goes across with two 15W daytime heat bulbs from exo terra, but those aren't on all the time. There is a thermostat on the heat source and both digital probes are inside the corresponding hides

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Originally Posted by Megz

I use a digital thermostat and a temp gun for a double check. She has a UTH and I have a canopy that goes across with two 15W daytime heat bulbs from exo terra, but those aren't on all the time. There is a thermostat on the heat source and both digital probes are inside the corresponding hides

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I would suspect possibly the time of year then.

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i dont understand this snake. Like she is clearly hungry she comes slithering right out of her hide the minute she smells the rat. I fed her the live and she ate it right away. I go to feed her the frozen and she acts as if she is scared of it. she comes out and then she will stick her tongue out a bunch and then back away and not move. I don't understand if its my preparation or maybe she doesn't like that I'm holding it up or time of year. but i have all these frozen rats and am at school so don't have the ability to get her a live one every week. its been 12days since she ate last and she still isn't eating same freaking routine every time. I don't understand if I'm doing something wrong or what to do at this point. Any suggestions :confusd: She use to eat so well and then all of a sudden nope. on and off with her ugh :( :(

her bad happens all started in september and she has been like this on and off ever since. she's a year and a half old by the way

Some will only take live. I have 4 that will eat anything... my first normal female will only eat live. Sometimes they don't alwagree with what we want them to do. I'd keep offering your f/t and get live whenever you can.
Have you tried getting the f/t really warm and just leaving it in her enclosure?

what's odd is she use to eat frozen no problem and she goes back onto frozen its just on and off with her. i typically dethaw in warm water then put it in hot water (from the tap) to heat it up offer it; usually she eats it this way, if not ill blast it with a hair dryer which then seems to work. Now she is going back to her kind of scared of it routine. Usually i hold it up by the tail and she will take it. I tried doing the leaving it in the warm side hide, method, but that never worked. tonight I'm trying to just leave it in the tank lying outside her hide and hoping she takes it. Any other methods? I'm very open to suggestions and/or to try new methods.

What i worry is whether she will starve herself if she doesn't have live. like if i were to keep offering frozen at some point will she eat it or are bp's really that picky that they would starve themselves?

Some people will say no they won't starve themselves, I believe otherwise after having my picky white live mouse only eater!! She went 2 months as a hatchling when I first got her because people said wait her out, she'll eat. Well she was loosing weight noticeably so I finally went with live and never looked back. Even now when my supplier of live was out I got all 5 f/t that week, she wanted nothing to do with it, the other 4 ate no problem.
That's why I started breeding my own :)

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Originally Posted by Crazymonkee

Some people will say no they won't starve themselves, I believe otherwise after having my picky white live mouse only eater!! She went 2 months as a hatchling when I first got her because people said wait her out, she'll eat. Well she was loosing weight noticeably so I finally went with live and never looked back. Even now when my supplier of live was out I got all 5 f/t that week, she wanted nothing to do with it, the other 4 ate no problem.
That's why I started breeding my own :)

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crud, of course i get one of the picky ones :P hopefully it turns around. how do you prepare your f/t for your other ones?

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Originally Posted by Megz

crud, of course i get one of the picky ones :P hopefully it turns around. how do you prepare your f/t for your other ones?

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My first girl definitely broke me in fast with the pickiness issue :P
I do it the way do, with the water then the hot tap water, fortunately I don't deal with it often lol
Now my hognoses are on f/t pinkies and those I just thaw in frig for a couple hours then hit them with blow dryer for a minute.

I heard one way to do it is drop the rat (after thawed) into boiling water for 2 seconds (literally one dip in and out). Is that a method that anyone else uses, i have never used it just something i heard but am willing to try it. I just want to get some opinions on it first because I know your not suppose to cook them

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I heard one way to do it is drop the rat (after thawed) into boiling water for 2 seconds (literally one dip in and out). Is that a method that anyone else uses, i have never used it just something i heard but am willing to try it. I just want to get some opinions on it first because I know your not suppose to cook them

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Personally, I wouldn't use boiling water. You run the risk of it being too hot. I use hot water from the tap and let the rodent soak for several minutes so it holds the heat. I then hold the rodent to make sure its not too hot before offering it to the snake.
I've found that if I hold the rat by the body with tongs and move it around like a live rodent, it helps. Also I tap the enclosure with the tongs as I move the rodent. This seems to stimulate interest. I also play 'catch me if you can' with the rodent. I never let the snake get upclose and personal with its food. I make the snake strike.
With the age, size and weight of your snake, I wouldn't worry too much. She has lots of reserves and should eat when she feels everything is right.
On my smaller neonates, I put them in an incubator at 87F with 80% Humidity and a hide. This usually works getting THEM to eat.
This time of year MOST of my adult BPs are fasting.

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Originally Posted by Andys-Python

Personally, I wouldn't use boiling water. You run the risk of it being too hot. I use hot water from the tap and let the rodent soak for several minutes so it holds the heat. I then hold the rodent to make sure its not too hot before offering it to the snake.
I've found that if I hold the rat by the body with tongs and move it around like a live rodent, it helps. Also I tap the enclosure with the tongs as I move the rodent. This seems to stimulate interest. I also play 'catch me if you can' with the rodent. I never let the snake get upclose and personal with its food. I make the snake strike.
With the age, size and weight of your snake, I wouldn't worry too much. She has lots of reserves and should eat when she feels everything is right.
On my smaller neonates, I put them in an incubator at 87F with 80% Humidity and a hide. This usually works getting THEM to eat.
This time of year MOST of my adult BPs are fasting.

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Thanks I'll definitely try that :D Do you move into a separate enclosure for feeding or the same enclosure they sleep in?

I feed in the same enclosure they live in. Less stress on the snakes.

I have never done the water either, I wouldn't try it though, after the water maybe the blow dryer??

just keep offering every week she will eat when shes wants .. u can always but the rat back in the freezer if she declines .. thats what i do.. 4 of mine have been not eating as much since the season started so i offer if they dont take with in the first min or 2 i pull out and just leave them

On a side note, is it odd that she spends all her time on the cold side? Temps remain as stated and two identical hides but she is consistently sleeping on the cold side all day and night and I'm not sure if thats odd behaviour. Anyone else have this?

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Originally Posted by Megz

On a side note, is it odd that she spends all her time on the cold side? Temps remain as stated and two identical hides but she is consistently sleeping on the cold side all day and night and I'm not sure if thats odd behaviour. Anyone else have this?

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GENERALLY that's a good sign that your hot side is too hot, although your earlier posts don't look that way. I'd check ground temp in a few different spots with a temp gun just to be safe. Make sure you check inside the hot hide as well. Temps inside there can be a bit higher because it's somewhat enclosed and right over a heat source. Kinda like an oven.

If your BP is staying in cooler areas of the cage, that could have some impact on feeding frequency as well. With constantly cooler temps, metabolism and digestion are slower. Just out of curiosity, if she's willing to eat live, shoot a temp on one of her live feeders. Next time you try to feed frozen, try to get the prey at least the same temp, maybe a few degrees warmer. I'm going to agree with the "no boiling water" crowd. I'm sure someone has done it successfully, but getting it that hot that fast runs the risk of cooking the rat. That's not healthy, AND if you've never smelled boiled rat...it's every bit as bad as it sounds. You might also consider her size and weight. She's only about one good meal over the 1000g mark, so you could be seeing the notorious fast that seems to happen.

The movement thing is odd. Check her belly for any signs of burns or injury. It almost sounds like that might be a possibility, especially if she's avoiding the warmer side of the cage and not eating.

I'm just brainstorming here, but if none of those are a problem, at least we've ruled some things out.

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Originally Posted by patientz3ro

GENERALLY that's a good sign that your hot side is too hot, although your earlier posts don't look that way. I'd check ground temp in a few different spots with a temp gun just to be safe. Make sure you check inside the hot hide as well. Temps inside there can be a bit higher because it's somewhat enclosed and right over a heat source. Kinda like an oven.

If your BP is staying in cooler areas of the cage, that could have some impact on feeding frequency as well. With constantly cooler temps, metabolism and digestion are slower. Just out of curiosity, if she's willing to eat live, shoot a temp on one of her live feeders. Next time you try to feed frozen, try to get the prey at least the same temp, maybe a few degrees warmer. I'm going to agree with the "no boiling water" crowd. I'm sure someone has done it successfully, but getting it that hot that fast runs the risk of cooking the rat. That's not healthy, AND if you've never smelled boiled rat...it's every bit as bad as it sounds. You might also consider her size and weight. She's only about one good meal over the 1000g mark, so you could be seeing the notorious fast that seems to happen.

The movement thing is odd. Check her belly for any signs of burns or injury. It almost sounds like that might be a possibility, especially if she's avoiding the warmer side of the cage and not eating.

I'm just brainstorming here, but if none of those are a problem, at least we've ruled some things out.

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definitely some really interesting points you make. I double checked the hot side and it remains at 87 and humidity 70%. her cold side is 73 at the moment. The belly thing is something i didn't think of for sure although when i handle her or sometimes when i catch her roaming she does slither normally. The fasting i know happens I just worry about her weight dropping too much but i know they eat when they want to. The last feeder i gave her was 84 isn so I made her frozen rat 88 of course it began to cool down and what not. What is very interesting that i have started to notice is that she seems quite afraid of the rat. I tried the tongs idea and such but if the rat comes close she will back away fast and coil up. if it touches her she does the same and will bury her head under her body or just try to coil up tight. She really avoids it to be honest. So I'm not sure if something is wrong with her or what to do. This feeding I just did today was two weeks since my last attempt, also a refusal, so should i just keep trying?

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Originally Posted by Megz

definitely some really interesting points you make. I double checked the hot side and it remains at 87 and humidity 70%. her cold side is 73 at the moment. The belly thing is something i didn't think of for sure although when i handle her or sometimes when i catch her roaming she does slither normally. The fasting i know happens I just worry about her weight dropping too much but i know they eat when they want to. The last feeder i gave her was 84 isn so I made her frozen rat 88 of course it began to cool down and what not. What is very interesting that i have started to notice is that she seems quite afraid of the rat. I tried the tongs idea and such but if the rat comes close she will back away fast and coil up. if it touches her she does the same and will bury her head under her body or just try to coil up tight. She really avoids it to be honest. So I'm not sure if something is wrong with her or what to do. This feeding I just did today was two weeks since my last attempt, also a refusal, so should i just keep trying?

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My best suggestion would be to bring the humidity down to 45-50% to start, assuming she's not going into shed. With the weather being cooler, higher humidity can trigger mating behaviors, even in sexually immature snakes. That could explain the odd feeding changes. Seasonal barometric changes may play a part as well, although I don't know that it's been conclusively proven. When you're feeding frozen, try to mimic the behavior of a live rat when confronted with a predator. Get it close enough for her to smell, and then move it away. It's goofy, but it sometimes does the trick. Another possibility is that she's just not interested in frozen anymore. No explanation for it, wierd stuff just happens sometimes. You might just have to switch to live.

If you check her belly and find nothing wrong, consider changing your substrate. It's a long shot, but snakes have sensitive bellies. I had to get some faux wool blankets from some paramedics because Ajja freaks out if she's cruising around on one of my soft fuzzy ones. Of course, she IS a bit of a diva. She also won't drink warm water. Room temp or she's not having it.

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Originally Posted by patientz3ro

My best suggestion would be to bring the humidity down to 45-50% to start, assuming she's not going into shed. With the weather being cooler, higher humidity can trigger mating behaviors, even in sexually immature snakes. That could explain the odd feeding changes. Seasonal barometric changes may play a part as well, although I don't know that it's been conclusively proven. When you're feeding frozen, try to mimic the behavior of a live rat when confronted with a predator. Get it close enough for her to smell, and then move it away. It's goofy, but it sometimes does the trick. Another possibility is that she's just not interested in frozen anymore. No explanation for it, wierd stuff just happens sometimes. You might just have to switch to live.

If you check her belly and find nothing wrong, consider changing your substrate. It's a long shot, but snakes have sensitive bellies. I had to get some faux wool blankets from some paramedics because Ajja freaks out if she's cruising around on one of my soft fuzzy ones. Of course, she IS a bit of a diva. She also won't drink warm water. Room temp or she's not having it.

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lol i had actually just increased the humidity because it was at 55% and i heard increasing it may help. I'll try bringing it back down and mimicing behaviour again. How many times do you think i should attempt frozen before making a switch? She's on aspen shavings but I'll definitely try switching for a change

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Originally Posted by Megz

lol i had actually just increased the humidity because it was at 55% and i heard increasing it may help. I'll try bringing it back down and mimicing behaviour again. How many times do you think i should attempt frozen before making a switch? She's on aspen shavings but I'll definitely try switching for a change

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I don't know that there IS a correct answer to when you should switch. I CAN tell you that I've used a 2 week fast every time I've made a change to Ajja's feeding routine. If your snake has a specific behavior that she does when she's hungry, you can use that as a gauge. Ajja gets restless during the day and starts trying to tunnel her way out of the tank if she has to wait.

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So I go get a love feeder put it in and she couldn't care less. She went up to it and sniffed its body and face like literally touching faces and nothing. Zip. So now I have a pet rat and now I don't understand why she won't eat. I'm actually really worried and on a side note does anyone know what to feed a rat?

In a pinch any hamster/ rodent type food will do. If you plan on keeping it I'd invest in some quality food.

Quite frankly I just want my BP to eat it. I don't want a rat and now I'm increasingly worried about her because it's almost been a month and it's almost like she's scared of rats or something. She literally went right up to it and just didn't care

I mean she is horrified of this rat. I tried again (last time was 8 hrs ago) and she just hides from it. I don't understand how a snake can be afraid of a rat. The last time she ate was December 23rd and since she has been refusing all frozen so I get a live and still nothing. Any thoughts on this because she is losing weight and I'm getting worried if she's afraid of rats of all things

She could just not be hungry. If she weighs around 1200g, she can miss a few meals without issue.

How much weight has she lost?

Incidentally, around 1kg is the proverbial "I'm gonna mess with your head and fast until you go nuts" wall. If she's right around that weight, that might be what you're up against. In that case, I have two suggestions...

1. Offer f/t, but less frequently. If you feed every 7 days, cut back and offer food every 10 days or so. If she takes food, go back to the normal interval.

2. Get a nice Boa. Whatever the BP refuses, I bet the boa will eat it!

I haven't had any feeding issues of my own yet (knock on wood), but I have also heard that varying the intervals between feedings can help decrease the likelihood of fasting issues. I vary my feedings between 5-7 days, with the occasional extra day or two, depending on my work schedule. You could also try dropping a thawed and warmed prey item into the cage at a completely random time of day.

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Originally Posted by patientz3ro

Incidentally, around 1kg is the proverbial "I'm gonna mess with your head and fast until you go nuts" wall. If she's right around that weight, that might be what you're up against. In that case, I have two suggestions...

1. Offer f/t, but less frequently. If you feed every 7 days, cut back and offer food every 10 days or so. If she takes food, go back to the normal interval.

2. Get a nice Boa. Whatever the BP refuses, I bet the boa will eat it!

I haven't had any feeding issues of my own yet (knock on wood), but I have also heard that varying the intervals between feedings can help decrease the likelihood of fasting issues. I vary my feedings between 5-7 days, with the occasional extra day or two, depending on my work schedule. You could also try dropping a thawed and warmed prey item into the cage at a completely random time of day.

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I started a once a week feeding then I went to two weeks then I tried three days later etc. so I have been caring but the 1000g thought may be it. So right now I have the live rat living with me and my BP (separate tanks of course). I think it's too funny but at least ill have it to offer her which will be good.

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Originally Posted by Megz

I started a once a week feeding then I went to two weeks then I tried three days later etc. so I have been caring but the 1000g thought may be it. So right now I have the live rat living with me and my BP (separate tanks of course). I think it's too funny but at least ill have it to offer her which will be good.

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If worse comes to worst, you can always thaw and warm an F/T, then crack open its skull and smear brain matter on the live one's head. It sounds brutal, but for some reason they go NUTS when they smell brain.

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Wow seriously?! That's crazy

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Originally Posted by patientz3ro

Get a nice Boa. Whatever the BP refuses, I bet the boa will eat it!

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This is why I love my boas, kings, corns, etc... they are little garbage disposals!

Not really crazy at all.....I believe it is called pithing....

Ok well I'll try that. How do I wash brains off my snake though if they get on her? I tried again today and I watched don't worry but the rat scurried around and sniffed her even climbed on her and she was so not interested. I don't get it. She got scared of it and then went back to roaming and trying to get out of the enclosure. I guess she must not be hungry but she is roaming the way she does when she's hungry. I will try this pithing on Wednesday. So just defrost a frozen rat and smear the brains on the live one? What happens if she still doesn't eat it what should I do :-/

Do you think it could be the enclosure. It's a wild card but the last time she are was when she was at her other enclosure at my house. Although she has never had a problem eating here before. The 1200g rebellion/fast makes sense cause she's 1162g right now and it started at 1234g so I suppose that's what it is. How long do those fasts typically go for or is it completly dependent on the BP?

How long have these fasts lasted for some of you? I just thought I'd get a rough average so I can maybe get some reassurance from it if this goes for awhile

Regarding the pithing....I don't think you should end up with brain goo anywhere. From what I understand you simply pierce the skull with something like a sewing needle. You don't want the brains all over....just the smell.

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Originally Posted by h20hunter

Regarding the pithing....I don't think you should end up with brain goo anywhere. From what I understand you simply pierce the skull with something like a sewing needle. You don't want the brains all over....just the smell.

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so i don't put brains on the live rat?