Cranky and Moody Girl

Hey guys, it's been a while. I've been busy with college so at best I've just been lurking but I've noticed something strange about Athena.

The past week she's been soaking in her water bowl and acting uncharacteristically cranky. For one, she has always hated water with a dying passion so needless to say I was surprised when I saw her start to soak. And with being cranky, she has always been quite vocal with huffing to let me know when she doesn't like something but this morning she full-out hissed at me and tensed up and away from my touch.

I already checked for mites, I've checked up and down for might. Nothing in her water bowl, nothing on her. She's not shedding either, her eyes are clear, belly is its normal cream, and her color hasn't dulled.

Her temps are the same that they have always been. 80 on cool side, 84-86 on warm side, and 90 on the heat pad. General humidity is has been around 30% but there is a humid hide in cage that she goes into often thats around 60-70% The UTH is hooked up to a thermostat and I measure my temp with a gun.

Shes about 20 months old, 1350 grams, she eats 4 mice a week, (still can't get her on rats.) However for the past 2-3 weeks she's only been eating two.

I honestly have no clue why she's acting like this. I read something about females being able to grow follicles without ever being paired to a male? I don't even know if thats possible let alone if thats what even is happening here. I guess I just wanted to know your guys' thoughts.

I would have initially went straight for mites or shedding. If her temps are spot on too I'm baffled....

Yeah I'd say mites...if not mites then she is shedding and probably soaking cause your humidity isn't right at all..my guy never soaks. Only time he goes to the water bowl is to drink or when he does night exploring,sometimes he takes a dip or he will also on occasion,sit with his head and neck in the hide,mid body on bedding and rest of his body in the water,it's interesting and pretty funny to see,he's a character..anyway sounds like you husbandry is quiet a bit off

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Originally Posted by anwhit

Hey guys, it's been a while. I've been busy with college so at best I've just been lurking but I've noticed something strange about Athena.

The past week she's been soaking in her water bowl and acting uncharacteristically cranky. For one, she has always hated water with a dying passion so needless to say I was surprised when I saw her start to soak. And with being cranky, she has always been quite vocal with huffing to let me know when she doesn't like something but this morning she full-out hissed at me and tensed up and away from my touch.

I already checked for mites, I've checked up and down for might. Nothing in her water bowl, nothing on her. She's not shedding either, her eyes are clear, belly is its normal cream, and her color hasn't dulled.

Her temps are the same that they have always been. 80 on cool side, 84-86 on warm side, and 90 on the heat pad. General humidity is has been around 30% but there is a humid hide in cage that she goes into often thats around 60-70% The UTH is hooked up to a thermostat and I measure my temp with a gun.

Shes about 20 months old, 1350 grams, she eats 4 mice a week, (still can't get her on rats.) However for the past 2-3 weeks she's only been eating two.

I honestly have no clue why she's acting like this. I read something about females being able to grow follicles without ever being paired to a male? I don't even know if thats possible let alone if thats what even is happening here. I guess I just wanted to know your guys' thoughts.

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Husbandry sounds good. Have you noticed any signs of follicle development?

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

Husbandry sounds good. Have you noticed any signs of follicle development?

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People always say there husbandry is perfect,but there snakes show nothing but signs that it isn't...so to the OP how do you measure all these tempertures? What are you using to monitor them? Are your thermometers all set in the right place? Hygrometer in the right place? Pic of your set up?


just to mention,I take most all my temps and hygrometer readings from the lower portion of the tank appx 3-4 inches off the ground surface,cause thats where he dwells,90% of the time.

check for mites

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Originally Posted by anwhit

Her temps are the same that they have always been. 80 on cool side, 84-86 on warm side, and 90 on the heat pad. General humidity is has been around 30% but there is a humid hide in cage that she goes into often thats around 60-70% The UTH is hooked up to a thermostat and I measure my temp with a gun.

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OP measures his temps with a temp gun.

But the thermo gun is good for checking surface temps,it can't check the air,unless I'm wrong on that...

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

Husbandry sounds good. Have you noticed any signs of follicle development?

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Not enough for me to feel at least.

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Originally Posted by NYHC4LIFE8899

People always say there husbandry is perfect,but there snakes show nothing but signs that it isn't...so to the OP how do you measure all these tempertures? What are you using to monitor them? Are your thermometers all set in the right place? Hygrometer in the right place? Pic of your set up?


just to mention,I take most all my temps and hygrometer readings from the lower portion of the tank appx 3-4 inches off the ground surface,cause thats where he dwells,90% of the time.

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I use a temp gun and a hygrometer/thermometer that sits on the ground. Its the AcuRite one from Walmart. I have one at each side of the enclosure.

And guys, I'm telling you, I already checked for mites. That was my very first thought as well, but I checked her water bowl, gave her a soak for good measure to see if I can see any fall off her, and I checked her up and down with a magnifying glass specifically in the most popular places. (vent, chin, eyes, etc). That's why I'm so perplexed. If I did find any sign of mites what so ever I would have put her on paper towels and ordered some provent a mite without an issue.

Theres still a possibly that she will be entering shed. She's not showing any signs now, but whose to say she won't when I wake up in the morning or sometime later in the week.

It's not like she's off feed either, yeah she halved her intake, but she still refuses to, well, refuse. She's still the pig she's always been.

I even checked her for an RI for good measure. Nothing at all.

Are four mice doing it? Might be time to up things.

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

Are four mice doing it? Might be time to up things.

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She actually slowed down as I stated. I've been offering her her original four, but she's only been eating two lately. I deff plan to up it once winter is over though, she a freaking weed.

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Originally Posted by anwhit

She actually slowed down as I stated. I've been offering her her original four, but she's only been eating two lately. I deff plan to up it once winter is over though, she a freaking weed.

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Ohg ok, sorry I missed that. Is there anything around the cage that could be causing any stress? Dog, loud music, bright lights, etc... ?

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

Ohg ok, sorry I missed that. Is there anything around the cage that could be causing any stress? Dog, loud music, bright lights, etc... ?

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Nope. I haven't moved her at all since I got her last year The only changed that occurred was when I got her a bigger enclosure over the summer but it's in the same spot. She's in my room, no foot traffic, dark most of the time. Nothing loud except my sister who lives on the same level but she's never been bothered by her before because I keep my door closed.

My beardie is in the basement at the moment so it's not his presence either. I honestly wouldn't have posted a thread if I hadn't checked for everything.

Right now, its just more perplexing than anything else.

Could she be constipated perhaps? She only pooped 2-3 weeks ago but anything is possibility with her right now.

uhhm, I am stretching it a bit here...but are you wearing any strong perfumes recently?

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

uhhm, I am stretching it a bit here...but are you wearing any strong perfumes recently?

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Not at all xD. I used to be a huge incense and oil burner but I stopped that as soon as I got her considering they only have one working lung.

All and all, I'll just keep an eye on her, as long as she's eating I'm going to try not to worry too much. (Then again, she can probably eat through anything but thats beside the point.) She gets fed tomorrow, (that could explain her being grumpy, not the soaking though), so we'll see what happens.

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Originally Posted by anwhit

Not at all xD. I used to be a huge incense and oil burner but I stopped that as soon as I got her considering they only have one working lung.

All and all, I'll just keep an eye on her, as long as she's eating I'm going to try not to worry too much. (Then again, she can probably eat through anything but thats beside the point.) She gets fed tomorrow, (that could explain her being grumpy, not the soaking though), so we'll see what happens.

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Uhhm, this is perplexing...I am honestly out of ideas.

I'll update if I notice anything else.

Can you get her on rats? It might be a hunger issue even though she's eating 2 to 4 mice at a time. Doesn't explain the soaking but that could be due to a bit of dehydration. Some BPs can get a bit snarky as they age. It could be anything from she doesn't like a certain hide to your curtain was open slightly. You said you had her a year. She might be getting to the I want a boyfriend stage.

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Originally Posted by Phantomtip

Can you get her on rats? It might be a hunger issue even though she's eating 2 to 4 mice at a time. Doesn't explain the soaking but that could be due to a bit of dehydration. Some BPs can get a bit snarky as they age. It could be anything from she doesn't like a certain hide to your curtain was open slightly. You said you had her a year. She might be getting to the I want a boyfriend stage.

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It's pretty much impossible for me to get her on them. I've tried everything from scenting to braining and she still wouldn't take it. The only thing I haven't tried is live but I am very very hesitant to do so. I've got bitten by a rat before and man that's not fun, their teeth are terrifying. I'm too afraid that she'll get hurt.

The hide could be it as well. I had to get her a new cold hide recently because when I had brained the rat to try and feed to her, blood and guts got all over her hide when I left it there for a while. (During winter she's gets lazy and doesn't strike at her food, she prefers it just left in her cage and I usually leave it/them on top of one of her hides.) Even though I bought the same exact one, (about two weeks ago), I wouldn't doubt that she would be able to tell the difference. I haven't seen her in the hide since I got it. Is it possible that she's getting too hot because she's staying in her hot hide all the time and that's why she's soaking?

Try live rats, but make sure to watch her. I have been feeding live for a long time and so far nothing serious has happened to my snakes as for bites. I have seen a couple times a few scratches caused by the rats, but noting bad. Maybe after she eats one alive she may take to them okay.

She could also just be feeling the seasonal change. Reptiles seem very sensitive to barometric changes. Trying a live rat isn't a bad idea, but I doubt that hunger has anything to do with what sounds like very defensive behavior.

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Originally Posted by anwhit

It's pretty much impossible for me to get her on them. I've tried everything from scenting to braining and she still wouldn't take it. The only thing I haven't tried is live but I am very very hesitant to do so. I've got bitten by a rat before and man that's not fun, their teeth are terrifying. I'm too afraid that she'll get hurt.

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You don't grab live rats with your hands, squeeze them to death, then eat them whole for a living. Your snake is well equipped to eat live rodents. Far better equipped than you are.

I have a friend with 40 snakes. They all eat live. No issues.

There are people on here who have done thousands and thousands of live feedings with no issues.

Try a live rat.

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Originally Posted by 200xth

You don't grab live rats with your hands, squeeze them to death, then eat them whole for a living. Your snake is well equipped to eat live rodents. Far better equipped than you are.

I have a friend with 40 snakes. They all eat live. No issues.

There are people on here who have done thousands and thousands of live feedings with no issues.

Try a live rat.

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Woah hey look, I'm not knocking live, at all. There is a huge difference between not agreeing with it and not feeling comfortable with it. I'm not a breeder, nor do I have a big collection, she is a very loved pet. I was just simply saying that if a rat can hurt me, a 5 foot human, it can probably hurt a 3ft snake. I know there are a lot of precautions one could take but not having fed live before you have to understand that I am allowed to be nervous.

And besides, I highly doubt not being fed rats is why she's soaking and throwing a fit. The only reason why I wrote what she was eating was to simply state that she was, in fact, eating.

It sounds like you are doing everything right.

My only thought is about the new hide, since she is avoiding it. Did you wash it thoroughly before putting it in the enclosure? If it has a scent she finds offensive, maybe she's overheating herself to avoid it.

Good luck!

How long has it been since she shed?

I totally understand you not wanting/being nervous to feed live.
As an aside, if you really want to switch her to f/t rats, I personally would wait one or two weeks to feed - kinda wait until she is really hungry, but not starving by any means. Then offer the rat - perhaps close to the same size as the largest mouse you would normally offer her, scented with the mouse - in the exact same way you'd offer the mice.

If she refuses, leave it in with her for several hours. If she doesn't take it, remove and try again in a week. I think if you are persistant enough, she will get hungry and eat. Although I know they can be really stubborn......

I hope you figure out what's been going on though. Hopefully it is nothing.

Best of luck to you!

Alright guys, I think it's official.

She wants a boyfriend.

I caught her laying inverted when I went to check on her. Welp.