feeding in rack or in separate area

To feed in rack or not to feed in rack lol. I done both

I feed all of mine from their enclosures :)

I now feed all of mine in their enclosures but have in the past (on advice to "prevent cage aggression") fed outside in boxes, but its all enclosures now.

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Originally Posted by dgring

I now feed all of mine in their enclosures but have in the past (on advice to "prevent cage aggression") fed outside in boxes, but its all enclosures now.

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the pythons seem to be more aggressive about than the boas

Enclosure.

I feed in the enclosure. I wouldn't want to move a large boa after she had eaten. My boa stays in a feeding mode for a long time after eating, and her bites are nasty.

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Originally Posted by Shann

I feed in the enclosure. I wouldn't want to move a large boa after she had eaten. My boa stays in a feeding mode for a long time after eating, and her bites are nasty.

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yea haha

I feed my snake in his enclosure. I'd say the secret to not getting bit is establishing a procedure with your snake. If it's feeding time, I do not touch him at all unless absolutely necessary. When it's not feeding time, I tap on the top of his hide and give him a few rubs before picking him up.

Cage aggression is merely people confusing their snakes with their own actions.

I have been feeding outside of the enclosure. I'm just scared of cage aggression from feeding in the enclosure.

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Originally Posted by Shann

I feed in the enclosure. I wouldn't want to move a large boa after she had eaten. My boa stays in a feeding mode for a long time after eating, and her bites are nasty.

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Exactly, there is no way I would want to handle my female BCI after she eats - she will tag you quicker than thought if she thinks you are food, and it doesn't matter if she's inside or outside of the enclosure. Feeding is in the enclosure is easy - don't mess with the snake beforehand, put the feeder in if it's live, zombie dance if f/t, and leave the snake alone after it eats. For handling I agree, use a different routine like a touch/rub first, and the snake will quickly learn the difference between feeding time and handling time.

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Originally Posted by kingkung

I have been feeding outside of the enclosure. I'm just scared of cage aggression from feeding in the enclosure.

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Try to think from a Pavlovian standpoint, if you are getting the snake out of the cage for both feeding and handling then how is the animal to know the difference until you get to the feeding enclosure? That little window is were your trouble is most likely to occur in my experience. Feeding in the cage means you do not have to move the animal after feeding, and the specimen understands that being picked up is not a time for feeding.

I feed in the enclosure, and am actually adding "trap doors" for my larger constrictors in order to further reinforce a dichotomy between chow time and play time. The trap doors will only be used for distributing prey.

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Originally Posted by kingkung

I have been feeding outside of the enclosure. I'm just scared of cage aggression from feeding in the enclosure.

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If you ONLY open the cage at feeding time, then yeah. They're going to associate opening the cage with food. If you open the cage to handle them regularly, then one out of what, five times they get fed? They're not likely to develop a conditioned response to feed.

Another REEEAALLY often overlooked behavior that's mistaken for cage aggression is what I call the "Nap Time Hair Trigger." Basically, when a python is asleep, it isn't like a human, where we're basically oblivious to our surroundings. Even asleep, a python's brain processes sensory stimuli, because they're opportunistic feeders. If something warm happens to pass in front of a sleeping snake, they're almost certain to strike. If they're a day or so overdue for food, it's even more likely.

If you want to avoid being mistaken for a mouse, make sure the snake is alert and consciously processing information. You can tell, because they don't flicker their tongues unless they're awake and alert.

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Originally Posted by patientz3ro

Another REEEAALLY often overlooked behavior that's mistaken for cage aggression is what I call the "Nap Time Hair Trigger." Basically, when a python is asleep, it isn't like a human, where we're basically oblivious to our surroundings. Even asleep, a python's brain processes sensory stimuli, because they're opportunistic feeders. If something warm happens to pass in front of a sleeping snake, they're almost certain to strike. If they're a day or so overdue for food, it's even more likely.

If you want to avoid being mistaken for a mouse, make sure the snake is alert and consciously processing information. You can tell, because they don't flicker their tongues unless they're awake and alert.

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Exactly. To negate this problem, tap on their hide a bit to stir them awake before you even lift the hide up from them. That way they know what's going on rather than the hide they were in suddenly disappearing into the sky and they are all exposed.

I feed all mine in the rack.


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I house two of my BPs together so feeding them in their enclosure has never been an option for me. I have three in total and I feed them all in separate tubs and never had a problem. Also, since I feed live, I don't feel comfortable in having mice go into the snake's snug cave and biting or chewing on them. Another thing about feeding live is that if you have the mice roam around the terrarium, they will crap on merely everything and I don't feel that very sanitary for my pets.

At the end of the day it's a personal choice whether you feed in the terrarium or in a separate tub, I've been feeding in separate tub for quite a while now and it works for me very well. I bought a couple of semi clear tubs from Target and I just throw my snake in there, then throw the mouse in, and call it a day. That way I can observe the feedings and make sure my babies are safe. If the mice poop in the feeding tub, I just shake it out and that's it. No mess. I know some people here won't agree with me, but there's more than one way to do something. It just all depends on your preference.

enclosure

Feed them in their tub for many of the reasons talked about here but one more reason is time.
Having to move each animal and then waiting while they eat then doing it again, thats fine for one or three,
but once your over ten, wow your talking hours.

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Originally Posted by ViperSRT3g

Exactly. To negate this problem, tap on their hide a bit to stir them awake before you even lift the hide up from them. That way they know what's going on rather than the hide they were in suddenly disappearing into the sky and they are all exposed.

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I have front opening doors, so I'm usually standing right in front of her when I open them. By the time I unlatch the doors, she's already on her way out of the hide to see me. If she's not, I'll just stand there for a moment until she gets the tongue moving.

If you can learn to read and understand their natural behaviors, you'll be amazed at the ways they'll interact with you.

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I feed in their enclosure. It's just more simple for me and less stressful for the snakes. Not to mention most of mine probably wouldn't eat in a separate area anyway. The more picky ones wouldn't be comfortable enough or were too distracted in trying to explore than eat. I'm just speaking for my personal animals, not in general. It just seems so unnecessary to move them.

I don't really handle my snakes regularly other than for cleaning. I'm not much for recreational handling either. I only open the enclosures to feed or check up on them and never have any of my ball pythons displayed some sort of aggression. I have one big female that will come right to the front when I open her enclosure sometimes. She'll be totally in your face expecting food, but she doesn't strike or attack. She's just hungry. When she's not hungry, she doesn't usually do anything but sit on her hot spot.

Topic has been beaten to death. Feeding in the enclosure will probably win long-run in the poll, there might even be an attempt to address and dismiss the concerns of 'cage aggression' resulting from feeding in the enclosure if anyone's feeling up to it. In the end people will have opinions, and yeah. That's pretty much how this question goes.

That said.

Rack. :D

"Cage Aggression" is mostly mistaken for a good feeding response.
My snakes are all comfortable, perfect husbandry, etc. Whenever they just ate, they are all curled up in their hides, and after a few days I can pick them up with no hissing, striking, etc. BUT if it's close to feeding day they are much more alert. Following my hand if I move it in front of them. In reality they're just hungry :D and they LOVE TO EAT. lol

In the rack and in my hoggie's enclosure

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I don't have a rack. I have all-decked out snake houses (see my Avatar) which has a lot of perfect hiding spots for rats. And I even have a Snak-Shack as a hide which the rat would just love to eat. And I really don't want to have the rats peeing and pooping in the substrate...

Oh yeah, I feed live because I raise my own rats.

So, I feed in a feeding bin.

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

"Cage Aggression" is mostly mistaken for a good feeding response.
My snakes are all comfortable, perfect husbandry, etc. Whenever they just ate, they are all curled up in their hides, and after a few days I can pick them up with no hissing, striking, etc. BUT if it's close to feeding day they are much more alert. Following my hand if I move it in front of them. In reality they're just hungry :D and they LOVE TO EAT. lol

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This, my BCI's are in Boamasters and two have regularly struck at my hands on feeding day when I'm working the latches on the enclosure doors. They can smell the rats and know what's coming next. If it's not feeding day they don't even twitch when you open the door.

Tali knows when feeding day is and what a plastic tub in front of her doors means. She's usually sitting in the strike position before I even open the doors, and I barely have to have the rat in the tongs before she strikes it. No way am I handling her to get her to a seperate enclosure.

Weird pool :) Some of us have snakes in tanks and not tubs but let's just say we all feed in the housing enclosure regardless of what it is :P

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Originally Posted by Shann

I feed in the enclosure. I wouldn't want to move a large boa after she had eaten. My boa stays in a feeding mode for a long time after eating, and her bites are nasty.

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This is the exact reason feeding in a separate enclosure is a myth. The only time I've ever used a separate enclosure was when two snakes were housed together. In 22 years I've been bit maybe a half dozen times because of snakes expecting food. I have to either leave the snake or do something to get it out of feeding mode EVERY TIME I feed in a separate enclosure. Another consideration with Ball pythons is that it's hard enough to get them to eat sometimes without putting them through handling stress right before a feeding attempt.

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Originally Posted by treeboa

This is the exact reason feeding in a separate enclosure is a myth. The only time I've ever used a separate enclosure was when two snakes were housed together. In 22 years I've been bit maybe a half dozen times because of snakes expecting food. I have to either leave the snake or do something to get it out of feeding mode EVERY TIME I feed in a separate enclosure. Another consideration with Ball pythons is that it's hard enough to get them to eat sometimes without putting them through handling stress right before a feeding attempt.

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That, and that the notion of cage aggression disregards the animal's biology and normal feeding behaviour, and fails to distinguish that there's a pretty discernible difference between an aggressive/defensive strike and a feeding strike.

Safe to say unless you've been handling rats, your snake knows you aren't food.

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Originally Posted by treeboa

This is the exact reason feeding in a separate enclosure is a myth. The only time I've ever used a separate enclosure was when two snakes were housed together. In 22 years I've been bit maybe a half dozen times because of snakes expecting food. I have to either leave the snake or do something to get it out of feeding mode EVERY TIME I feed in a separate enclosure. Another consideration with Ball pythons is that it's hard enough to get them to eat sometimes without putting them through handling stress right before a feeding attempt.

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We've only had our bp's since 2008 so we don't have the extensive experience you have. But we've always fed in a bin (see my reasons above) and beside the usual winter fasts for some of them, they're pretty consistent feeders and we've never had a regurge and never been bit either. My 2 kids ages 10 and 12 (they were 5 and 7 when we got the snakes) are in charge of feeding the snakes. We even have one snake that the kids have nicknamed "Rat Bane" because she would fly out of the bin before the kids could let go of the rat, sometimes ending up with the rat coiled with her body halfway hanging off the side of the bin. The kids are in charge of changing out their water bowl everyday too. They can change out the water bowl without getting bit either.

I believe either method is good because after a while the snakes and keepers get used to the routine so it's just another day in the life. Neither one is generally more superior than the other. It's just whatever works for your house.

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Originally Posted by anatess

We've only had our bp's since 2008 so we don't have the extensive experience you have. But we've always fed in a bin (see my reasons above) and beside the usual winter fasts for some of them, they're pretty consistent feeders and we've never had a regurge and never been bit either. My 2 kids ages 10 and 12 (they were 5 and 7 when we got the snakes) are in charge of feeding the snakes. We even have one snake that the kids have nicknamed "Rat Bane" because she would fly out of the bin before the kids could let go of the rat, sometimes ending up with the rat coiled with her body halfway hanging off the side of the bin. The kids are in charge of changing out their water bowl everyday too. They can change out the water bowl without getting bit either.

I believe either method is good because after a while the snakes and keepers get used to the routine so it's just another day in the life. Neither one is generally more superior than the other. It's just whatever works for your house.

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if it works for you keep doing it. I would advise any newbie with a BP not to, though. I see literally hundreds of my new BP won't eat threads and a large percentage are due to handling stress. There are definitely aggressive feeding BP that will eat no matter what, but many are shy feeders. Once you deal with a large snake that's an extremely aggressive feeder by nature like a Burmese, Carpet, or Boa that you have to put back after feeding, you will change your mind in a big hurry! Believe me!

I let my snake choose, most of the time he doesn't like to eat in his home. I have a bin that i let him feed in.

All of mine eat in their enclosures. Never had a problem so far.

I dont think BPs are capable of this association. Retics are though. However I'd much rather have a retic that is "aggressive" in the cage then in some bucket in the middle of a room where it can freely move. Then you have to move this hyped up animal back to its cage after feeding. Feeding outside of the rack/cage is one major ingredient in the recipe of producing a SFE(stupid feeding error) and getting yourself killed if your working with animals that are capable of it.

I've always found the cage aggression thought interesting for two reason.

1. Opening the enclosure puts him in feeding mode.

You feed him once a week. You presumably change his water every day, or at least a few days a week. Why doesn't opening the tank kick off a response of "Here comes fresh water!".

2. The idea that opening the enclosure prompts the snake to bite you because it thinks your human smelling hand is food.

These are animals with such a good sense of smell some will eat only mice and not rats. Obviously, they can tell the difference in scent between types of rodents. However, stick your hand in there (without previously handling a rodent) and the snake is suddenly confused to the point that it will bite you immediately because it's mistaken you for food.

Not a mouse. Not a rat. I know what they smell like. I don't know what this is so I'm gonna GRAB IT because it's food!!

If it was that easy to confuse the snake and it's sense of smell, there would be no mousers anywhere.

I don't care that people feed in a separate feeding tank (to each his own and if it works for you, don't change it), but aside from you keeping multiple snakes together and they need to be separated so they can eat, the reasons make no sense to me.

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Originally Posted by OctagonGecko729

I dont think BPs are capable of this association. Retics are though. However I'd much rather have a retic that is "aggressive" in the cage then in some bucket in the middle of a room where it can freely move. Then you have to move this hyped up animal back to its cage after feeding. Feeding outside of the rack/cage is one major ingredient in the recipe of producing a SFE(stupid feeding error) and getting yourself killed if your working with animals that are capable of it.

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lol yea taking retic out to eat would be death wish in the making for sure