Could Really Use Some Help! New Owner!

Hi guys, I'm new to this site and new to owning a BP. So I just got my baby ball python last friday. He is about 9 months old and around 16-18 inches. He is so perfect for me! Atlas, is active and adorable. But I want to give him the best possible and so I need help with a few things. I have him in a 20 gallon long glass tank which already puts me at a disadvantage. I have a UTH on the right side with a hide and on the left (cooler) side I have a water dish and another hide. I also have a heat lamp I use throughout the day but I know that dries out the air. I stupidly bought the stick on dial to gage humidity and temps. I'll be buying something else because I know how innacurate those are. About humidity..I'm not to worried about it because i've been wetting a washcloth and draping it over the top..plus my room is small and it gets stuffy and humid naturally. And lastly...I got him from the local CountryMax where there are some snake experts who work there. They were very helpful and really took care of their snakes. They told me he had to he assist fed which I know is a last resort. Last night I tried to get him to eat (he eats frozen thawed) and I first dangled it infront of him..no interest...I had watched videos and watched the guy at the store try to feed him so I know what to do but he freaked out when I held his jaw and I didnt want to stress him out that badly so I put him away and left the food for him. Its now morning and he didnt eat it. I know pythons are finicky eaters also. So I'm wondering if because hes new here and maybe my temps are off is why he won't eat.
My questions are
1) Should I use a different overhead heat source?
2) What exactly should I use to monitor temps?
3) Eating? Any advice or tips would be greatly appreciated.

I just want to do right for him so any tips about anything I would appreciate. Thanks!

First of all, you do not need to be assist-feeding if you've had him one week, unless he hasn't eaten at all with the pet store and in that case they shouldn't have sold him until he was eating. Give him some time to settle in, then try feeding an appropriately sized prey item by leaving it in the tank and putting a blanket over to give him some privacy. Make sure it's good and warm, so he'll be able to pick up its heat signature.

Second, you'll want to invest in a thermostat for your UTH asap. Hydrofarm makes a perfectly functional AC-powered thermostat, it's about 35 bucks online and is worth the money to keep your animal from getting burned. It'll keep your hotspot at the appropriate level.

I agree... I don't know why they sold it if it wasn't eating on its own.
What type of heat lamp are you using? And yes a thermostat is a must!!


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First, assist-feeding should not be done at all in my opinion. Unless it is emergency. Plus, no offense but you do not have experience to do so. These things can potentially hurt them.

Second, what is your temperature and humidity level? And what is temperature on the basking spot?

Third, why are you using two heat source? What temperature are you trying to reach?

Fourth, DO NOT use UTH without a thermostat! That will definately burn and be lethal to bp. Get a Hydrofarm thermostat. It is less expensive and very good.

Finally, let him/her get settled. Let it be for awhile until you feed him. Also if you can, please ask the feeding schedule and feed to the place where you bought from.

"Snakes don't bite. Just humans."

Yes, thermostat ASAP! (example http://www.amazon.ca/Jumpstart-Digit...rds=thermostat)

This worked for another member on the forum to get his BP to eat, maybe it will work for you as well (copied and pasted):

"Mine wouldn't eat the first week or two, but what I ended up doing (which worked) is I thawed a rat, put it in a baggie in HOT water, left the zip open and the cup right beside the tank for 15 mins. This usually gets my BP out and hunting, if he isn't already. I would then turn out all lights but one in a back corner so I could see, and get the tweezers and grab the rat in the middle, then slowly put it in the tank (not near my BP). I would jiggle it a bit, then slowly go a bit closer to the BP. When he noticed it (so he'd be about 6" away) I would start to entice him with it. Normally that got him to come closer. I would not move the rat closer to him, but wait for him to move towards it. I kept jiggling it, kind of acting like it was alive still. It could take a few minutes sometimes, but he always struck. When he coiled, I would give it another little jiggle for 5-10 seconds after, so he would coil tighter.

Now he knows the whole routine and it really doesn't take him long at all. Usually as soon as I lift the lid after scenting he's ready to go.

I also thawed the rat in with a mouse the first couple of times. I don't know if that made a difference or not though."


It should at least give you some ideas anyways :)

Good luck!

They said he was eating on and off. I agree I Dont want to assist feed. Well according to these dials..humidity is at 60% and ambient temps are 80. I'll be ordering a thermostat today I have two heat sources because when I Dont have the heat lamp on it drops to like 70 which I thought was a little low.

You did get the ambient temperature and humidity level correct or I would recommend that too. I have 2 seperate temperature gauge for cold side and one on the middle (not necessary but I love over-killing) and humidity gauge at middle also.

Now to measure the temperatures, there are two ways. Which one is purchasing electric thermometer (I forgot the brand at this moment) or just using gauge that any pet store would carry (I use zilla which comes with humidity level gauge)

I use gauge although it does not give accurate temperature but I dont like having bunch of wires inside the enclousure so I use gauges and also little aquarium wall sticker? Thermometer is "okay" to use but that is worse than gauge since there is a chance it might measure substrate temperature rather than measuring actual cold-side temperature. So I use it anyway.

Hydrofarm thermostat comes with a little probe that attatched on the actual thermostat that must be inserted inside the soil to get the temperature if that is what you are asking.

So in summary,
it is my set so some might not agree but I would say ambient temperature at med. 80's fahrenheit. Cold side at high 70's F (ex. 76-78F). Basking, thermostat set as 91-92F with (+- 2F), with +94F seem bit high but in the basking spot of mine is about .5-.75 inch deep and top covered with bit wet moss so my bp never got a burn or never had a problem. It maybe bit too deep some may say actually. I hope my advice helped you a little!


"Snakes don't bite. Just humans."

Are you feeding mice or rats? You should move to rats if not already doing so. A couple of mine were on mice when I got them and after moving to rats they have never missed a meal. I have four young ones that are currently taking rat pups.

I get all of my feeders out about two hours before feeding time to thaw. I place a couple pups per baggie. About 10 minutes before feeding time I place a couple baggies in a large bowl with the hottest tap water possible. I use a butter knife to hold the baggie down in the water. I refill the bowl with hot water again at the 5 minute mark. I take them out of the baggie and roll them up in a per towel to dry. I can feel the warmth of the rat through the paper towel so i know they are ready.

Usually by this time the snakes can smell the rat and are already moving around looking for the meal. As soon as I open the cage and dangle the rat with the tongs they usually strike right away. Occasionally if one doesn't strike right away and just sniffs the rat I warm it up with a hair dryer for a minute or so. This always does the trick and they take it the second time. I'm not sure if they get teased with the rat being removed and brought back or if it's the additional heat from the hair dryer.

Hopefully somebody's tips help your snake to easily feed. Good luck!

So if I buy a thermostat to control the UTH heat....that comes with a probe I stick inside the cage directly on the glass above the UTH? And then I also need to buy a digital thermometer from wal-mart for like 12 bucks and stick that on the cool side with a probe on the warm side? I'm just very confused as I get conflicting answers on different sites and thermometer amd thermostat and all the other vocabulary is confusing

The probe of the thermoSTAT goes directly between the uth and bottom of the tank. The thermoMETER probe goes on the glass directly above the uth on the inside of the tank. The body of thermometer goes on the cool side of the tank.

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Originally Posted by Crazymonkee

The probe of the thermoSTAT goes directly between the uth and bottom of the tank. The thermoMETER probe goes on the glass directly above the uth on the inside of the tank. The body of thermometer goes on the cool side of the tank.

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Thank you thank you thank you. That really helped clear things up. What kind of ThermoSTAT should I buy? Like brand wise. And also if my uth is a stick on one does thats matter?

Yes, you need a thermostat to control the UTH. (The UTH just plugs into the thermostat.) It will have a probe on a cable that you place directly over the heat mat. This will keep the UTH from getting too hot and injuring your snake.

In addition the Acu-Rite indoor/outdoor thermometer hygrometer works very well. I place the unit on the cool side and run the small probe to the same location as the thermostat probe. Be sure and scrape the little sticky pad off of the temperature probe. This will prevent the snake getting stuck to any adhesive (a related word of caution - never use tape or anything with adhesive inside the tank).

To prevent the snake from bumping the thermostat and thermometer probe away from the UTH I secure it in place with clear silicone sealant. It's the same thing that's in the corners of your tank so is harmless when dry.

Thermometer/Hygrometer http://www.walmart.com/ip/Acu-Rite-I...mometer/896347

My choice of thermostat http://lllreptile.com/store/catalog/...re-controller/

The best type of thermostats are called "proportional". They adjust the power going to the heat device according to need, not just on/off like the more economical one in the link. The proportional one's are, however, significantly more expensive.

That is thermostat I use, due to the fact I ordered my rack from C Serpents and on their website they say they use these. The Zilla that was mentioned above.

There is also the Hydrofarm found on Amazon

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Read through this, if you haven't already, it should answer most of your questions:
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...-With-Pictures!

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Originally Posted by Saber402

Yes, you need a thermostat to control the UTH. (The UTH just plugs into the thermostat.) It will have a probe on a cable that you place directly over the heat mat. This will keep the UTH from getting too hot and injuring your snake.

In addition the Acu-Rite indoor/outdoor thermometer hygrometer works very well. I place the unit on the cool side and run the small probe to the same location as the thermostat probe. Be sure and scrape the little sticky pad off of the temperature probe. This will prevent the snake getting stuck to any adhesive (a related word of caution - never use tape or anything with adhesive inside the tank).

To prevent the snake from bumping the thermostat and thermometer probe away from the UTH I secure it in place with clear silicone sealant. It's the same thing that's in the corners of your tank so is harmless when dry.

Thermometer/Hygrometer http://www.walmart.com/ip/Acu-Rite-I...mometer/896347

My choice of thermostat http://lllreptile.com/store/catalog/...re-controller/

The best type of thermostats are called "proportional". They adjust the power going to the heat device according to need, not just on/off like the more economical one in the link. The proportional one's are, however, significantly more expensive.

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Okay this is exactly what I wanted thank you!

You're getting a lot of mainstream advice, which is accurate, but a bit overkill here and there as well as a few major "Do nots, in my" opinion. I have two specimens of python regius right now, one that I have had for going on 8 years (my first snake actually) and my newly acquired 2013 pastel. One I am mainly concerned about is your use of a towel, you are just begging for some mildew there bud, my adult ball python has shed successfully for almost a decade with a heat lamp over his head and me watering the substrate every week. My pastel also just shed this morning and humidity was provided by the moist substrate in her tub. I personally do not use thermostats on any heat pads I use simply because my specimens know when it's too hot and I will happily adjust things when I go through with the temp gun. I do not record humidity via a gauge, I go by what I see,smell, and what I know my animal's require. For example, I mist my pair of Morelia viridis daily and allow it to dry completely in 24 hours. For my retics and balls, I allow slight condensation to be maintained on the sides of the cage, I do not reapply moisture until all the condensation is gone. My boas are avid soakers so I simply mist them heavily twice a week...same schedule for my scrub pythons as well. You need to find your own niche and methodology, you have started with a fine species and it's good that you can ask for help but at the same time do not let your husbandry become too much of a laundry list. Good luck and hope that helps. I will also include a picture of my young one's cage if you need something to bounce ideas off (notice the condensation soon after I misted the cage)...
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-j...141403_945.jpg

I have a 20 gallon long and my set up is as good as I believe it will get...i have 2 hides( one on hot side one on cool side),i use a 75 watt bulb overhead for heat,cover 80% of the tank with a damp rag!have one large water bowl and a small bowl filled with very damp sphagnum moss..and in this tank I have no UTH because it's a 20 long and have overhead heat.. Hot side is around 90 and cool side is around 82 and humidity stays at average around 40-50 always.

http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/...psf740e76b.jpg

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

You're getting a lot of mainstream advice, which is accurate, but a bit overkill here and there as well as a few major "Do nots, in my" opinion. I have two specimens of python regius right now, one that I have had for going on 8 years (my first snake actually) and my newly acquired 2013 pastel. One I am mainly concerned about is your use of a towel, you are just begging for some mildew there bud, my adult ball python has shed successfully for almost a decade with a heat lamp over his head and me watering the substrate every week. My pastel also just shed this morning and humidity was provided by the moist substrate in her tub. I personally do not use thermostats on any heat pads I use simply because my specimens know when it's too hot and I will happily adjust things when I go through with the temp gun. I do not record humidity via a gauge, I go by what I see,smell, and what I know my animal's require. For example, I mist my pair of Morelia viridis daily and allow it to dry completely in 24 hours. For my retics and balls, I allow slight condensation to be maintained on the sides of the cage, I do not reapply moisture until all the condensation is gone. My boas are avid soakers so I simply mist them heavily twice a week...same schedule for my scrub pythons as well. You need to find your own niche and methodology, you have started with a fine species and it's good that you can ask for help but at the same time do not let your husbandry become too much of a laundry list. Good luck and hope that helps. I will also include a picture of my young one's cage if you need something to bounce ideas off (notice the condensation soon after I misted the cage)...
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-j...141403_945.jpg

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i know plenty of ppl that don't use thermostats for her UTH pads...there snakes never were affected either

Well I for one would not want to take the chance. For a couple extra bucks I KNOW my snake will not get burned

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Originally Posted by Crazymonkee

Well I for one would not want to take the chance. For a couple extra bucks I KNOW my snake will not get burned

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And then then the thermostat fails (lol). This is all fine and dandy but in all honesty if a machine absolutely needed something watching it 24/7 I honestly would not use it...just my perspective though.

With beginners, the mainstream straightforward advice is much simpler than trying to get into the nuances of husbandry technique. Imagine how confusing it would be if everyone said something different. "Well, this is what I do, but others do this, and still others do that..."

Better to start off with a basic standard of quality and change it as you become more accustomed to the hobby. This is the life of an animal we're talking about, not just putting a cake in to bake.

P&s I agree.. Like I said my buddies a few don't have thermostats attached. Me personally I do..my 20 gallon has no UTH but my 29 gallon high has a UTH and overhead heat bulb ( reason is if I use higher than 100 watts y tanks drys out like crazy,so I have to use a 100 w which sent hot enough and use the UTH to give him heat under his hide)..under his hid is regulated at about 88degrees now and the air temp hot side is 85-88. Usually I keep under his hide around 83-85, but he ate today so I upped it to help with digestion... I take care of my boys

plus the hide in the 29 gallon is made of some thick resin or something,s heat don't get through enough,yet my 20 gallon got them re thin black plastic hides and they warm up real nice...

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

And then then the thermostat fails (lol). This is all fine and dandy but in all honesty if a machine absolutely needed something watching it 24/7 I honestly would not use it...just my perspective though.

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That's the point of a thermostat though... it doesn't need watching 24/7; it is there so you don't need to worry about it, nor do you have to constantly check it. You yourself said that you adjust your temps when you pull out your temp gun. That sounds like a lot more work than setting a thermostat and leaving it. :P That's not to say you shouldn't be keeping an eye on temps.
If how you do things works for you, then that's great! But maybe that wouldn't work for someone without as much experience, you know?
For example, I know that if I didn't use thermostats my snakes would suffer because I don't have years of experience in keeping snakes and other reptiles. Even so, I would still use thermostats personally because I am a busy person - as I'm sure many people here are in their daily lives - and I do not want a pet that requires constant supervision. So I agree with you there, that if something needed watching all the time I would not have it either.

I think that's why everyone else is giving "mainstream" advice though. Even if someone doesn't take that advice and use it exactly the same, at least it's there to support.

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Originally Posted by NH93

That's the point of a thermostat though... it doesn't need watching 24/7; it is there so you don't need to worry about it, nor do you have to constantly check it. You yourself said that you adjust your temps when you pull out your temp gun. That sounds like a lot more work than setting a thermostat and leaving it. :P That's not to say you shouldn't be keeping an eye on temps.
If how you do things works for you, then that's great! But maybe that wouldn't work for someone without as much experience, you know?
For example, I know that if I didn't use thermostats my snakes would suffer because I don't have years of experience in keeping snakes and other reptiles. Even so, I would still use thermostats personally because I am a busy person - as I'm sure many people here are in their daily lives - and I do not want a pet that requires constant supervision. So I agree with you there, that if something needed watching all the time I would not have it either.

I think that's why everyone else is giving "mainstream" advice though. Even if someone doesn't take that advice and use it exactly the same, at least it's there to support.

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I make adjustments if needed of course, but this is rare for I find most of my enclosures are established. If your machines are doing all the work for you, how are you to learn? My advice was for the OP to keep his husbandry not too mainstream, we all have things in common between our individual methodologies; however, we also have glaring differences. Every hobbyist must learn the animal, not the machine. I know my specimens are getting a bit warm when they are on the cool side too much, my temp gun is simply to eliminate the possibility of a coincidence. I check my animals daily and I am also a full time college student with a part time job...there is no excuse to not be able to check on your specimens at least every other day. Traveling? then yes, you need a high quality thermostat like those produced by Spyder Robotics, but as long as you can spare 45 minutes a day, then routine check ups are sufficient. If an individual cannot think abstractly to a point of understanding "nuances" then I do not think it is time for them to enter this hobby. If the OP or anyone is having some minor difficulties in the process of fully developing those cognitive assets then some good reads...
The Art of Keeping Snakes
On the Origin of Species
Any work on mendelian genetics
Reptile Medicine and Surgery
Any college level Biology textbook.

What works for you, will work for you in the end though, just do not be someone that walks into the snake room and looks at the thermostat before the actual specimen...few things are more depressing in my eyes.

I check the snakes before I check the temps, and yes even with a machine to do it for me I check them every day.


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Okay thank you guys. All of you. All your advice really was helpful and yes all of you are right I may not use that advice but I can build off it. Me personally I work a lot and I'm a junior in school taking advanced classes. I would prefer a thermostat just to know hes safe when I'm away. I do spend time studying him..I know he likes drinking at night lol. As for humidity i think i may get some moss and a climbing stick or something. My point is I thank you all for helping and giving your thoughts.

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Originally Posted by Cloud Atlas

Okay thank you guys. All of you. All your advice really was helpful and yes all of you are right I may not use that advice but I can build off it. Me personally I work a lot and I'm a junior in school taking advanced classes. I would prefer a thermostat just to know hes safe when I'm away. I do spend time studying him..I know he likes drinking at night lol. As for humidity i think i may get some moss and a climbing stick or something. My point is I thank you all for helping and giving your thoughts.

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I took AP and dual enrollment starting sophmore year, my GPA>4.0...do not try to tell me you do not have as much free time bud, admit it, you've got a lot more than you want to admit ;) .

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Originally Posted by Physician&Snakes

I took AP and dual enrollment starting sophmore year, my GPA>4.0...do not try to tell me you do not have as much free time bud, admit it, you've got a lot more than you want to admit ;) .

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I do have some free time which I spend with my snake. But what I'm saying is 1) I'm always worrying about the UTH being to hot or temps being low 2) I was dumb and bought stick on dial gauges I need a actual thermometer set up so I know my temps are accurate.. so I would like a thermostat to control the uth better

You can have all the free time in the world, but if you don't happen to be checking on your animal the moment the UTH fails, the consequences can be disastrous. I'd much rather err on the side of caution and have a thermostat to prevent such occurrences. Just my .02.

I have yet to see a good reason not to have a thermostat.

You will never kick yourself for having one, you may kick yourself for not having one.

Get a good thermostat, a good thermometer and a good hygrometer. You will not regret having any of them.

I enjoy when these threads become more about the person than about the animal. Sheesh!

Take the information you feel comfortable with and go from there!

Enjoy your BP. At least you are concerned enough to ask questions. That is step #1

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Originally Posted by Saber402

I enjoy when these threads become more about the person than about the animal. Sheesh!

Take the information you feel comfortable with and go from there!

Enjoy your BP. At least you are concerned enough to ask questions. That is step #1

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Thank you! I do plan on using a lot of this info especially about feeding. I just want the best for Atlas