My personal thoughts on feeding in the cage making them more "aggressive"

*JUST my opinion, not stating anything out-right, no definite facts. Just observations from my own experience*

Thought of this today when I was feeding the snakes at the pet store I work at, specifically when I was feeding our male pastel we have.(who is in an enclosure by himself).
I was feeding our pastel a f/t rat pup today, in his enclosure, when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner". WHAT I THINK, is that people mistake a good feeding response for aggression. All of my snakes eat in their tubs, which I do believe makes them feel more comfortable, and all are eating machines. Now I just opened the tub to my little butter girl, and when I went to move her water bowl I saw her head poking out of her hide and following my hand everywhere it went. It did look like she was getting ready to strike at me, so i placed my hand near her to see if that's what she was going to do, and nope, no bite. My dumerils will do the same thing. They may get back in the "S" shape looking like they're going to bite (which can be very intimidating to a novice keeper, and can be easily mistaken for aggression) but I think they just LOVE TO EAT. :rofl: And I think when they rear back I think they're just waiting for a rat to pass in front of them.
Just my thoughts on what I noticed tonight while feeding.

totally bogus. I have fed hundreds of balls in their enclosure. Has nothing to do with aggression.

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Originally Posted by West Coast Jungle

totally bogus. I have fed hundreds of balls in their enclosure. Has nothing to do with aggression.

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That's what I'm saying, I believe people mistake a good feeding response for aggression.

i agree, i mean i only have one ball python but i have been feeding her in her enclosure since i got her in july and the only time she was "aggressive" was when i bothered her when she was trying to digest. other than that shes as calm as can be.

people need to realize that snakes function, their whole lives in modes. feeding mode which is also a lot of times resting mode, exploring/thinking mode, defensive mode, ect. any snake, no matter what species is going to first be ready to defend themselves, they are, after all...prey in the wild. so until they realize that they are not being threatened....they are going to be ready to defend themselves. also, not so much with balls, but after almost twenty years working with retics....I can assure anyone, that a big, food responding hungry striking retic is WAY easier to deal with IN their enclosure, than outside it!!!! I know balls are not retics, but a striking snake, that does not want to 'snap' out of the food response, is a lot easier to deal with when you can just slide the tub closed or close the door....instead of trying to get the snake BACK INTO its enclosure. and no offense, but your boss does not know what he is talking about if he thinks that feeding an animal in its enclosure will make it more aggressive. they exist in modes, understanding what mode your snake is in, and dealing with it properly....will result in almost never getting bitten, if ever. if you know your animal, and understand it....then you should not get bitten by a food response. period. snakes do not have the mental capacity or ability to be 'mean', they react to their environment...weather that be food, predators, or what ever.

Yea, I've fed in and out of enclosures before and I can tell you for a fact that the feeding in cage makes them more aggressive is total bull. People misunderstand the simplest things. It's like if you show a picture to two diferent people they're going to see it in their own way. That goes with how people think of bp's. I see some people saying that their bp begs for food when this isn't the case. The bp just happens to be visible and is watching a heat source, or for the many reasons it's just out of the hide.

I've never fed any of my BP's out of their enclosure and the only reason I do for my 3 Rufous is because they live communal and I don't want any accidental feeding incidents.

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

*JUST my opinion, not stating anything out-right, no definite facts. Just observations from my own experience*

Thought of this today when I was feeding the snakes at the pet store I work at, specifically when I was feeding our male pastel we have.(who is in an enclosure by himself).
I was feeding our pastel a f/t rat pup today, in his enclosure, when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner". WHAT I THINK, is that people mistake a good feeding response for aggression. All of my snakes eat in their tubs, which I do believe makes them feel more comfortable, and all are eating machines. Now I just opened the tub to my little butter girl, and when I went to move her water bowl I saw her head poking out of her hide and following my hand everywhere it went. It did look like she was getting ready to strike at me, so i placed my hand near her to see if that's what she was going to do, and nope, no bite. My dumerils will do the same thing. They may get back in the "S" shape looking like they're going to bite (which can be very intimidating to a novice keeper, and can be easily mistaken for aggression) but I think they just LOVE TO EAT. :rofl: And I think when they rear back I think they're just waiting for a rat to pass in front of them.
Just my thoughts on what I noticed tonight while feeding.

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Agree 100%

You just cant "fix" some people

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

You just cant "fix" some people

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Who's this directed to??

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner".

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Originally Posted by Mephibosheth1

Who's this directed to??

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Didn't think I would need to explain myself, I don't have a problem directing my comments when I want to :confusd::rolleyes:

Sorry; that's what I get for reading this at 5AM:rolleye2:

The only time I've ever had issues was when I was an OTR truck driver and my collection was down to one snake and a tortoise. The wife would feed and care for the tortoise, but the snake had to wait till i got home. So after a few years of almost no interaction and just getting tossed a rat every couple weeks, he became very "feed mode" any time the cage door got opened. Made cage cleaning rough to say the least, anything moving was a target. I have managed to calm him down some again, but I still get him out with the hook, once out he is fine.
This is just what some would mistake as aggression when in reality it's just feeding response. All my snakes are still fed in the enclosure.

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

*JUST my opinion, not stating anything out-right, no definite facts. Just observations from my own experience*

Thought of this today when I was feeding the snakes at the pet store I work at, specifically when I was feeding our male pastel we have.(who is in an enclosure by himself).
I was feeding our pastel a f/t rat pup today, in his enclosure, when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner". WHAT I THINK, is that people mistake a good feeding response for aggression. All of my snakes eat in their tubs, which I do believe makes them feel more comfortable, and all are eating machines. Now I just opened the tub to my little butter girl, and when I went to move her water bowl I saw her head poking out of her hide and following my hand everywhere it went. It did look like she was getting ready to strike at me, so i placed my hand near her to see if that's what she was going to do, and nope, no bite. My dumerils will do the same thing. They may get back in the "S" shape looking like they're going to bite (which can be very intimidating to a novice keeper, and can be easily mistaken for aggression) but I think they just LOVE TO EAT. :rofl: And I think when they rear back I think they're just waiting for a rat to pass in front of them.
Just my thoughts on what I noticed tonight while feeding.

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Agree 100% - I never have fed out of the enclosure and I never will.

I haven't ever fed outside of my enclosure. I don't think I ever would either. My girl has a KILLER feeding response, so it wouldn't make sense for me to change anything.

Honestly, she probably would freak out and NOT eat if I moved her to a separate feeding tank.

When I first got her, I read a lot on the subject, and I couldn't find any LOGICAL reasons for feeding outside her normal environment.

It really doesn't matter whether feeding them in a specific spot makes them agressive in that spot or not. As NERD has pointed out with their retics. It is better to have a very hungry snake inside a cage then outside it. It is far safer to receive a feeding response inside the cage then when you are taking them out and putting them in a tub to feed.

If they look like they are going to strike at you inside the cage, simply close the lid. However if you turn on their feeding response through repetition by placing them in a tub outside the cage, your taking a hungry snake, moving it, feeding it, exposing the room to all the smells of rats, and then handling it again to put it back in its cage.

When I had my first ball python, back in the 90's, I fed in its enclosure. No one told me any different, and it never occurred to me that I should do anything different. I never had a problem with any kind of aggression. He had a great feeding response, when it was time to eat. When he wasn't hungry, he was as docile as ever.

With my snakes now I have a routine that tells them when it's feeding time and when it's not. I generally don't handle them too much in the evening, which is when I do feed them. I handle them in the day time, including cleaning out their tubs and changing their waters. I also take the lid off their tub entirely when it is time for handling. Unless they are VERY hungry, they seem to realize the difference between these routines. Only one snake has ever acted like he was going to bite during the handling routine, and that was a feeding response type behavior because he skipped his last meal due to being in shed. (Only other threatened bites were from the axanthics when they were tiny and afraid of everything.)

I feed in the enclosure... so far no issues. I take the mouse into the room in a critter keeper about 10 mins before I feed her. She gets the smell and sticks her head out of the hide by the time I go back in.
I figure she'll know it's feeding time, considering when its handling/cleaning time obviously the mouse smell is not there :)

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 4

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

*JUST my opinion, not stating anything out-right, no definite facts. Just observations from my own experience*

Thought of this today when I was feeding the snakes at the pet store I work at, specifically when I was feeding our male pastel we have.(who is in an enclosure by himself).
I was feeding our pastel a f/t rat pup today, in his enclosure, when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner". WHAT I THINK, is that people mistake a good feeding response for aggression. All of my snakes eat in their tubs, which I do believe makes them feel more comfortable, and all are eating machines. Now I just opened the tub to my little butter girl, and when I went to move her water bowl I saw her head poking out of her hide and following my hand everywhere it went. It did look like she was getting ready to strike at me, so i placed my hand near her to see if that's what she was going to do, and nope, no bite. My dumerils will do the same thing. They may get back in the "S" shape looking like they're going to bite (which can be very intimidating to a novice keeper, and can be easily mistaken for aggression) but I think they just LOVE TO EAT. :rofl: And I think when they rear back I think they're just waiting for a rat to pass in front of them.
Just my thoughts on what I noticed tonight while feeding.

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Originally Posted by decensored

Agree 100% - I never have fed out of the enclosure and I never will.

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Couldn't agree any better, I totally agree with the snakes going into the strike position because they're waiting on food. I actually have done the same thing with my Pin, putting my hand near him when he follows my hand... nothing not bit once by him. Hes just a very aggressive feeder same thing goes with my Ivory and BEL.

I use to feed outside the tub when I had just one BP and I quickly learned from my wife who told me that's a no no. Especially if I was ever going to move up to larger snakes or eventually a giant. She had a huge female Burm growing up. :rolleye2:

The only time I ever got tagged was while I was feeding out of his enclosure. He wasn't out of feeding mode when I went to transfer him back into his tank. It's more stress than it's worth to have to move them back into a tank while adjusting to their meal. In the enclosure, they can just crawl back into their hide and relax.

Yeah, as Brian said. Feeding outside the cage with large pythons is asking for trouble. Moving a 10-20ft hungry giant out of a cage hopeing it doesnt nail you in the process, then feeding it, then picking it back up after its all hyped, and moving it back is just insanity :colbert:.

I am learning a lot from working with my little dwarf retic and I definitely can tell you that I have no plans of moving him around when its feeding day and hes 10ft+.

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Originally Posted by OctagonGecko729

Yeah, as Brian said. Feeding outside the cage with large pythons is asking for trouble. Moving a 10-20ft hungry giant out of a cage hopeing it doesnt nail you in the process, then feeding it, then picking it back up after its all hyped, and moving it back is just insanity :colbert:.

I am learning a lot from working with my little dwarf retic and I definitely can tell you that I have no plans of moving him around when its feeding day and hes 10ft+.

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I can tell you from working with retics for over twenty plus years, that sometimes you cannot turn off their feeding response like you can most other snakes, even after they are done eating, a lot of times...they are looking for more. they are very smart in terms of a snake...but they are nuts when they are on full food mode. sometimes there is simply no breaking the response until the snake decides its done trying to eat.

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Originally Posted by rickm

I can tell you from working with retics for over twenty plus years, that sometimes you cannot turn off their feeding response like you can most other snakes, even after they are done eating, a lot of times...they are looking for more. they are very smart in terms of a snake...but they are nuts when they are on full food mode. sometimes there is simply no breaking the response until the snake decides its done trying to eat.

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I agree!

When my adult BP is in Mega Feed Mode and wants more, he stays in that mode until I bring another rat the next day. I mean I can't get near him at all! He stays in a strike position.