Snakes and the Military

I got into snakes just over 2 years ago, from someone I met online. Half a year later I got a ball python (pinstripe) named Yuki, and just a month ago (August 17) I got a cute little 50% Super Dwarf Retic male (so he will stay 8-9 feet max which is a size I am quite comfortable handling) that I named Loki because I wasn't supposed to get any more snakes. At the time, though, I planned on staying in the area and continuing to try and get on at the local paper mills, which would allow me to move out and get more snakes. Eventually, I would like to get into breeding ball pythons.

Over the last couple weeks, though, things have changed. My hours have been cut back even more from the dismal that they previously were and it has led me to seriously consider something that has been floating around in the back of my mind for a year now: Air Force. At this point, there really isn't much that could change my mind from joining (I haven't taken the ASVAB yet, but I am not worried about being unable to pass it). If possible, I don't want to get rid of my snakes, but I also understand that it could be in excess of 2 years before I am able to take them back. Currently the plan is to show my little sister (13) how to take care of them. One of my mom's concerns is that she isn't sure if she will catch if there happens to be something wrong with them, and me, well, they're my babies, so of course I will worry over their care. As much as I don't want to, I'm really starting to think that it might be in the best interest of the animals to find them new homes (I will most likely be able to return the Retic to his breeder), but I wanted the online herp community's opinion on the matter. If at all possible I would like to keep my Pinstripe at least (and would love if it is possible to keep Loki as well). I got her January 2012, so I've had her a year and a half now, but do understand if you guys don't think it is in her best interest. In the end, I have to think of her over me.

I do have one other question, and this is mostly out of curiosity. As stated above, I would like to eventually breed ball pythons. Not sure at this point if I will make Military a career or just join for 4 years, but if I do stay in how many people have had success with such a hobby while in the armed forces? By success I don't mean "how much do you make off of it?" (I understand most people only break even or are in the red), but "have you managed to balance military career and snake hobby?"

And now, since I'm sure you want to see them, here are some pictures of my two babies:

Loki:
[IMG]http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/...psdf0adb74.jpg[/IMG]
Picture taken at the time I first got him home. Last time I weighed and measured him he was two inches shy of four feet and 458 grams (about 3 weeks ago). He is a 2011 baby she had been thinking of holding back.

Yuki:
http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/...psd58e9f7a.jpg

http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/...psdf23772c.jpg

I got her January 21, 2012 at 94 grams and about 16 inches long. Now she is about 3.5 feet and weighed 1300 grams last I checked (also about 3 weeks ago)

Ok....where to start! I was in the Army back in 87'-91'. I raised ball pythons back then also, but when I joined luckly I only had 2 at the time. While I was away for Basic and AIT I had to have a friend watch over them. I also had concerns about them while I was away, but all I could do was hope for the best that he would be able to take care of them just as well as I did. They did fine for the 4 1/2 months I was gone. Now afterwards when I got done with the trainings, I was able to get them back from him because I had a home where I was stationed, here near Ft. Hood Texas. Which is where I served my whole 4 years. Now as for having them on post in the barracks....Animals were not allowed, well except fish. There were a few people who would sneak a small reptile in as long as their bunkies didnt mind, or get caught by upper command, but the orders for on post said "No". I hope this helps a little for you. Maybe others can chime in on this subject.

Thanks, Roach!

What I am planning on doing is showing her at least a month in advance and actually having her take care of them while I am still there (as if I am not) so I can correct anything she might not be doing quite right. The thing is, though, if I do manage to get in where I want the Technical Training for that is 1-1.5 years, and I would most likely have to wait until I could move off base (recruiter said earliest for moving out of the dorms was 6 months after first duty assignment). Not sure if Air Force is different from Army or if the policies have changed over time, but he said there was a slight possibility I might be allowed to keep them in the dorms, but definitely not to count on that, so I am not, and I would probably have a heart attack or something if I tried to conceal one just because of the stress. But with basic training, technical training, and then waiting to move off, it could be 2.5 years or more.

Keep in mind that in addition to Basic and Tech School, Airmen are often not allowed to move off base for a while (unless they're married) and you are not allowed to have pets in the dorms. So it could be a bit longer than 2 years.

edit: Duh. I just saw your last post ;)

Do yourself and your country a favor and join because you want to serve your country not as a last resort please.

lol, no problem Spitzu. If I wasn't already aware of that information it would have been extremely helpful, so thanks. :)

And Rigan, while it could be considered a 'last resort', it is something I had been considering for at least a year now. I am making sure to weigh everything so that I can be a valuable member and not regret my decision later. I am not taking this lightly, which is kind of how I perceive your comment towards my attitude. If it is not, I am sorry and please forgive my accusation. I just want you to know this is not some whim, but a choice I have been looking at very carefully.

Our experience has been great in the military but we are married so a lot of the rules are different.

Here are some facts as I know them though
You can not keep pets in the dorms. You are inspected regularly so trying to sneak them will not work :colbert:
You have to live on base unless you are married or have achieved E5 in rank.

Now if you are married....I just packed up all of our scaled kids in tubs and moved! 3 times so far in 2 years. We have been lucky to get base housing that do not count scaley friends as pets! We have made some serious mistakes and some not so serious ones. But overall, our military life has been a very enjoyable one.

Oh we are Navy!!

Thanks Wapadi. I was told it was at least 6 months to move out of the dorms, but no required rank was given either so I'm not sure if it was simply forgotten/not mentioned or if the policy is different with the Air Force. I am still doing more research to figure out what would best to do with my snakes. As I said above, if possible I want to keep both of them, or at the ball python since I have had her the longest, but do understand if it is not in their best interest.

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Originally Posted by Himitsu

Thanks Wapadi. I was told it was at least 6 months to move out of the dorms, but no required rank was given either so I'm not sure if it was simply forgotten/not mentioned or if the policy is different with the Air Force. I am still doing more research to figure out what would best to do with my snakes. As I said above, if possible I want to keep both of them, or at the ball python since I have had her the longest, but do understand if it is not in their best interest.

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This was over a decade ago but E-4 was the rule at my first base, though some got out of the dorms before that due to space limitations. It will vary at each location.

I was in the Marine Corps for 5 years... Rule number 1 dont' believe anything your recruiter says...they will tell you what you want to hear to meet their quota, its sad to say, but it is true. You can't have pets in the barracks and I have never seen anyone get BAH and move off base 6 months after completing training unless they are married. I don't know how often you change duty stations in the Air Force, however in the 5 years that I was in the Corps I moved 6 times. There are times that you move and have to live on base. We had a Gunny that was married with 3 kids and was moved up to Lemoore Naval Base and was given Geo-Bachelor orders meaning that he lived on base and his family wasn't able to move with him. Expect the unexpected.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jclaiborne

I was in the Marine Corps for 5 years... Rule number 1 dont' believe anything your recruiter says...they will tell you what you want to hear to meet their quota, its sad to say, but it is true. You can't have pets in the barracks and I have never seen anyone get BAH and move off base 6 months after completing training unless they are married. I don't know how often you change duty stations in the Air Force, however in the 5 years that I was in the Corps I moved 6 times. There are times that you move and have to live on base. We had a Gunny that was married with 3 kids and was moved up to Lemoore Naval Base and was given Geo-Bachelor orders meaning that he lived on base and his family wasn't able to move with him. Expect the unexpected.

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Enlisted in the AF will generally move every 3-5 years or so. But that is another good point... you don't know where you'll get stationed. You have some say in the matter, but it isn't guaranteed that your preferences will line up with the AF's needs (and you'll lose if they don't). You could very well end up overseas for 4+ years for your first assignment. You may enjoy that, but you definitely won't be bringing snakes with you.

Thanks everyone for the input.

One thing, just as a side not for your well being, if your recruiter promises you ANYTHING make sure it is documented in your file in writing and signed off. I can't tell you how many people including me that I know first hand that have a sour taste in their mouth reguarding their recruiter. I even have a coworked that recruited for the AF and still gets sick to his stomach knowing how he had to manupulate certain recruits.

Thank you guys, and I know this is going to sound bad, but I think the full weight of everything kind of finally hit me this morning. My parents aren't much for the military, so I know they would only look at the bad they hear, and maybe that was why I could convince myself so easily it would be alright, but hearing it from those in the military right now (or previously in) and getting better estimates of time... I don't think I could handle it... It sounds like it would be too long to have my sister care for them, and flat out getting rid of them would be like dumping my kids (if I had or wanted any) on the side of the road, I would be abandoning them and I really wouldn't know just what kind of care they would get... Not to mention my dog is already 6 and that would be a long time away from him, and I get homesick easily... I kind of had a mini mental breakdown... Not entirely sure what I'm going to do now, but sadly military is most likely out. I just don't think I have the mental discipline for it... Sorry for wasting your time, and thank you for giving me more information on this...

well i'm currently in the army, so the rules are probably slightly different for AF. anyways, the rules here are "NO" pets in the barracks, no exceptions. and you can't live off post unless you're married or in the rank of e-6 or above. and trying to smuggle something into the barracks is probably a bad idea, not only would you get in a lot of trouble but you'll still have to remove the animal(s) they found. now, theoretically, if when you get to your base, you find a person who lives off base willing to let you keep your snakes with them, that is possible.

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Originally Posted by Himitsu

Thank you guys, and I know this is going to sound bad, but I think the full weight of everything kind of finally hit me this morning. My parents aren't much for the military, so I know they would only look at the bad they hear, and maybe that was why I could convince myself so easily it would be alright, but hearing it from those in the military right now (or previously in) and getting better estimates of time... I don't think I could handle it... It sounds like it would be too long to have my sister care for them, and flat out getting rid of them would be like dumping my kids (if I had or wanted any) on the side of the road, I would be abandoning them and I really wouldn't know just what kind of care they would get... Not to mention my dog is already 6 and that would be a long time away from him, and I get homesick easily... I kind of had a mini mental breakdown... Not entirely sure what I'm going to do now, but sadly military is most likely out. I just don't think I have the mental discipline for it... Sorry for wasting your time, and thank you for giving me more information on this...

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If this post is any indication of your mind set, you'd never make it through boot camp. The drill sergeants would destroy you. Good or bad, you probably made the right choice.

We're military. He's currently overseas in South Korea. He's spent 3 1/2 of the last 5 years overseas, with another year+ to go.

When he's back, and we are living together again, we cannot live on post because the only animals we have that are allowed are the two dogs. Military housing bans a lot of animals. Because he's paid very well, we can afford to live off post, but the pay for someone just starting in the military isn't much, and living off post often isn't an option without roommates, or not an option at all when you're somewhere for only 3-6 months for training.

The military is not an easy life, and I can't say I'd steer anyone in that direction unless they had made the decision to join long before you did.

yeah, it sounds like you really weren't certain of this, and it isn't just a job it's a life style. just do what makes you happy.

It sounds like you've already made your decision, and that's fine, but I'd like to clear some things up based on my current experience. (And by the way, you could certainly consider going Reserve, it's basically a part-time job with many of the benefits of joining the military, with fewer sacrifices. However, I don't have any experience with this personally, as I am active duty.)

First a bit about me. I am 29 years old, and I joined the Air Force when I was 27. I went from never having considered the military before, to starting the process to join within two weeks. And yes, it was because of the economy and I needed to make a change in my life. But I have a strong work ethic, and I wanted to finally have a job I could be proud of, and I work just as hard at this as someone that joined "to serve". (And frankly, you'd be hard pressed to find someone that genuinely did join just to serve. Most are here for the benefits, like education. IMO it doesn't make our sacrifices any less important, as long as we still do the job well.) Forgive me for getting off topic, but one of the earlier comments struck a chord with me.

I have given up almost everything I had as a civilian. I lost my home when a family member illegally evicted me and stole/destroyed my belongings, and I've lost touch with all but one friend I had before. I've been fortunate enough that my parents have been able to take care of my pets (two cats and two horses), and I'm anxiously awaiting the chance to get them back. I've had a rougher time than some, but be prepared that it can be a huge sacrifice in ways you don't expect.

I am in the Weather field, which has a particularly long tech school (8 months; most are less than that, though a few careers are even longer). I was held up in basic training for an extra 10 weeks due to a knee and lower leg injury. Weather was my last choice on the list of jobs; the base I'm at was also my last choice. So "dream sheets" count a little, but not much. The AF will put you where they need you, first and foremost. Tech school, for me, was worse than being a teenager again; you have curfews and much stronger restrictions placed on you (frequent room inspections, mandatory pt, no pets/houseplants, no alcohol in your room even if you're of age, and no guests of the opposite gender). If one person screws up in a squadron of 800 people, you'll ALL be punished. But I digress..

I'm at my first base now, and because I'm single, I'm living in the dorms. I'm allowed a fish tank of less than 10 gallons, and a turtle if I fill out paperwork. That's it for pets. At this particular base, and many others, you're required to live in the dorms if you're E-3 or less, with less than 3 years time in service. When you hit E-4 with more than 3 years in, you're allowed to move off base. The exceptions are: if the dorms fill up, they will start moving the most senior airmen out early; also, you can fill out a "hardship package" to get approval to move off base if you have extenuating circumstances that other airman don't have (for example, if you joined later in life and have a household full of goods that you're paying to store, or if a family member needs to come live with you for health, financial, or other reasons). I'm in the process of doing that now; my first sergeant instantly approved me when he found out I was 29, because he believes at my age I don't need to be treated like a child. Every base and every person in your chain of command will be different. There are no guarantees. If you get desperate, you can "ghost", which involves unofficially moving out and paying for your apt or whatever on your own dime; some people do this, but it's frowned upon and not very practical, IMO.

I'm sorry for rambling so much but I wanted to clarify the current rules of the Air Force (at least at this base), because other branches are different and regulations are always changing. Only you know what's best for you. It takes a lot of strength to get through the rough times, but even with everything I've gone through, I'm still glad I did it. I'm not rich but I'm making more money, with better job security and benefits, than I did after 8 years in the civilian work force.

I hope this helps. Please feel free to ask if you have any other questions. :)

I would again like to thank everyone for the input.

To Sho: I knew that drill sergeants and the like were really strict, and it might be a bit of a shock, but I did get the feeling that I would be able to suck it up and take it. My dad wasn't the most lenient, so I kind of learned the shut up and stand straight.

To Bugmom: That was the impression I got the more I listened to people with experience not only in the military but with these animals as well. I had spoken to some people locally that gave it a good impression (not just the recruiter, but people from a local grange I volunteer at that have/had family in the AF).

To Serpent: I was confident I could handle most aspects of it, but I am a very family oriented person. I think what really ended up hitting me hard was the thought of having to get rid of my snakes (essentially abandoning my kids because I knew very well when I got them that I was signing up for 20+ years with them, and I don't regret my decision to get them for a second!) and the fact that my dog is already 6. If I was unable to see him for another 4 years, when I got out of active duty, then about half of the rest of his life would be gone... My animals are part of my family, and losing them like that would impact me the same as if my mom or dad died, you know?

To Surrealle: First hand experience and such about the current AF is very helpful. As has been mentioned, I have come to a decision, for now at least. Maybe (and this is a very light maybe) when I find a life partner I might consider it again, since I will have someone to take care of them while I'm gone and will be more likely to be able to move off base and keep them, but I'm not sure. It seems that my reasons for considering it were pretty much the same as yours.

Again, thank you very much for the input.

You're welcome. I wasn't trying to talk you into or out of it, but I just wanted to share [what I think is] relevant information. I figured it might help someone out there.