Talk to me about tarahumaras

Looking at one, but I know nothing about them other than 1) they're supposed to be small 2) it looks greyer and more speckled than what I'm used to seeing RTB-wise (not looking for an argument about what officially counts as RTB locality wise, just making a general comparison). Anything beyond my limited knowledge would be appreciated, thanks!

I don't work with them so I'll leave this link for some great info on them via Rio Bravo:

http://www.riobravoreptiles.com/boas_mexico.htm

I was not expecting a response that fast! Especially such a helpful one. :gj:

It makes sense now why I haven't seen many, and why I've only seen them here (AZ).

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Originally Posted by Badgemash

I was not expecting a response that fast! Especially such a helpful one. :gj:

It makes sense now why I haven't seen many, and why I've only seen them here (AZ).

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Gus (Rio Bravo) had a litter drop just earlier this month: if you're still looking around I'd shoot him an email :gj:

There are actually two in my local reptile store that I'm considering, the price seems very reasonable, they may even end up as part of a trade. But I'm uncertain since I don't know anything about them.

Be very very careful about buying a Tarahumara from a pet store. Pure TMs are rare and not too likely to end up in a pet shop. Those in pet shops labeled as TMs are usually a mix - which means they won't likely stay at their small size. Personally, I would only pick up one of these localities from a well-known reputable breeder who works with them like Rio Bravo or Legacy Reptiles. Gus or Joel and Orlando Diaz with Legacy won't steer you wrong.

:gj:

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Originally Posted by Badgemash

There are actually two in my local reptile store that I'm considering, the price seems very reasonable, they may even end up as part of a trade. But I'm uncertain since I don't know anything about them.

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For many years people sold sonorans as tarahumaras. The assumption was made that since the Tarahumara Mountains are in the Sonoran Desert that they were one in the same.

Most of the claimed tarahumaras I've seen (outside of what Russo and Rentfro sell) are either sonorans or some other mixed mexican locality.

Thanks everyone, this is the kind of info I need! :gj:

I do trust the owner of the store, and spoke to him about them today. I actually missed one when I was picking up hoppers the other day, it's a 1.2 group. He's tracking down their original info for me since they came from his buddy in CA (who was not the original breeder). I'm not sure I'll go for them, but they sure are cute little buggers, although the male is already producing good looking sperm (can't believe I just typed that) and is only around 18 inches. Not something I was expecting to see.

Ok, I'm really not trying to diss the store owner or cause any offense whatsoever. But I trust the store owner and manager of our local pet shop too, but if they got a "Tarahumara Mountain Boa" in stock, I would seriously doubt it was the real thing no matter what they said. And that isn't to say I'd think they were lying to me deliberately, just that they wouldn't KNOW or be able to VERIFY with absolute certainty the history and origin of that specific animal.

Pure Tarahumaras just do not show up in pet stores. Vin Russo, Gus Rentfro, and Joel and Orlando Diaz are the only breeders I am aware of who are working with pure TMs and their animals just do not end up in the retail market.

If you don't really care whether or not these animals are pure TMs and you really like them, then go ahead and get one. I am sure it will be a spectacular PET for you and you will certainly enjoy having a boa! But if you want a pure TM with accurate and known lineage, and be able to breed them and in turn market the resulting babies as pure Tarahumara boas, then please reconsider a pet store animal and stick with one of the reputable breeders mentioned.

Again, no offense is intended! S'all good! :gj:

I totally understand and agree with what you're saying, and no offense is registered whatsoever.;)

To be fair, it's not a typical local reptile store, but if he can't get me the appropriate documentation, I'm not doing it. I just have a fondness for obscure sorts of animals, so they caught my eye with their cute little heads.

Hiya! PLEASE listen to the advice you’ve been givenso far. I can promise you…you won’t besorry.
I justrecently picked up a pure Tarahumara Boa, and it took me a couple months ofsolid research to make sure I did it right, the first time. I spoke to a lot of people, read a lot ofarticles/books, and went with a well known and well respected breeder oflocality Boas.
In my huntfor the right animal, it became clear that there are tons of folks who sellhybrids (crosses), and that can result in a not-so-dwarf Dwarf boa. The last thing I wanted was to wake up oneday and own an 8-foot Tarahumara…but with all the cross-breeding going on, itIS possible, if you’re not 100% sure of the lineage.
Vin Russo,Gus Rentfro, and Legacy Reptiles are a REAL good way to go.
GETONE!!!! YOU’LL LOVE IT!!! J
Good luck!
KD

For some reason...the spacing is off on my posts...but you get the idea.

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Originally Posted by Badgemash

I totally understand and agree with what you're saying, and no offense is registered whatsoever.;)

To be fair, it's not a typical local reptile store, but if he can't get me the appropriate documentation, I'm not doing it. I just have a fondness for obscure sorts of animals, so they caught my eye with their cute little heads.

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But how will you know that documentation actually goes with that particular snake??

I totally understand your fondness for obscure animals - I am the same way. But you CAN get TMs from reliable sources if you have your heart set on one. They are not one of the more expensive localities either so why NOT buy from a reputable breeder to be safe?? And if you really want one, then you want a good pure one from traceable bloodlines. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

But how will you know that documentation actually goes with that particular snake??

I totally understand your fondness for obscure animals - I am the same way. But you CAN get TMs from reliable sources if you have your heart set on one. They are not one of the more expensive localities either so why NOT buy from a reputable breeder to be safe?? And if you really want one, then you want a good pure one from traceable bloodlines. :gj:

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Exactly. Compared to what I spent on some of my BPs, my TM Boa was a steal of a deal...and as pure as you could ever possibly find. Vin Russo was great to deal with, and his reputation speaks for itself. I am thrilled with mine, and I have no doubt I got mine the right way. It just so happens that I was on the hunt for something different. Something that everyone else in town didn't already have...or have a variation of. I was sold on the TM Boas once I did all my homework, and I knew right away that I was going to get one from a top-tier breeder.

I promise I won't do anything silly guys, as far as I'm concerned "paperwork" needs to include photographs that I can confirm with the original breeder, who needs to be one of the reputable people listed earlier in the thread as well as an established chain of custody all the way back to them in order for me to move forward.

I honestly had no intention of getting more boas in the near future, but these little guys stood out to me for some reason. But I also learned my lesson about impulse buys and due dilligence as a twelve year old when I talked my mother into getting me a burmese. I like them, but if I have any qualms about their lineage, I'm okay with walking away too.

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

Pure Tarahumaras just do not show up in pet stores. Vin Russo, Gus Rentfro, and Joel and Orlando Diaz are the only breeders I am aware of who are working with pure TMs and their animals just do not end up in the retail market.

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Although I understand TMs need to be approached with a critical eye, there are others successfully working with these wonderful little boas. I haven't seen them in stores yet, but there are good folks breeding TMs from the RB line and there is no reason these can't hit the market.

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Originally Posted by danojeno

Although I understand TMs need to be approached with a critical eye, there are others successfully working with these wonderful little boas. I haven't seen them in stores yet, but there are good folks breeding TMs from the RB line and there is no reason these can't hit the market.

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Of course there are. BUT unless they can document the lineage all the way back to Cutting Edge, Rio Bravo, or Legacy, and/or unless that person is already a highly respected and well-known breeder, I would not trust that those animals are pure Tarahumara boas. And again, these are rare enough still that it is highly unlikely a pure TM will show up in a pet store - not impossible - just very unlikely.

Update: The previous owner didn't hold onto the paperwork, so I passed.