Is this playing? Dog and Puppy (both males)

Here is a video of my Nans 3 year old Staffordshire bull terrier (Red) playing with my 6 month old puppy which is a Staffordshire bull terrier x Border collie (Caesar)

Is this playing? as Caesar just always seems to want to bite Red, Thanks :)

this was them playing after a walk.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQEYa8qnM2w

Yes, it's playing. :) Red is also taking advantage of Caesar's antics to remind him of who's boss by pinning him like that.

I didn't watch the video, but border collies are herding dogs. They play by nipping and trying to direct the other animal/person/toy to where they want them. The result would look like they are running in circles biting.

Yes they are playing. Tails are going and their general demeanor is that of a playful dog, trust me you would know if they were fighting.

The lighter one is definitely playing. The darker one looks like he's tolerating it, but the way he's jumping on and pinning the the other is a dominating behavior. As long as the younger one tolerates it, you won't have problems, but if the younger one decides to challenge it, a fight could possibly break out. For now they are alright, but I personally would watch those behaviors closely.

When Red has had enough, he'll put Caesar in his place with a sharp nip and growl I'm sure. Looks like they are both enjoying themselves.

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As long as Red can put Caesar on his back he will feel secure. Someday the point will come that he feels like his Alpha position is threatened and he will get serious. Caesar will either back down (which would cast their roles for life) or Caesar will give Red what for (which will lead to years of excitement for you).

I don't know if we are all watching the same video here but I'm seeing straight dominance with lil play if at all any here. He is trying to establish his position/role with him.

Yes one male rolling another on his back is a dominance thing however, their ears are perked, tails are wagging and they are bouncing and running around, when my pit, shepherd, or wolf get serious they ears go back, tail goes down, hair on the neck gets raised barking goes to snarling and there is no bouncing or running it becomes a straight standoff. I just watch the video for a second time and I don't see any indicators of aggression, they aren't even vocalizing.

The thing is, ears up and tail moving isn't always friendly. Tails will move (not true "wagging" as a happy dog does) even during moments of tension. Ears may be up during moments of tension too, especially in dominant dogs. There's much more to it than just ear and tail position or movement. You need to also look at where the eyes are moving, and subtle changes in facial muscles. You also need to look at the whole body, and see if it's loose or tense. The Red dog is tense during much of the interaction, where the younger dog is much more loose and jubilant.

A lot of dog fights can be prevented if people knew more of what to look for. They see two dogs "sniffing" eachother with ears up and tails moving, and assume the dogs are being friends. All of a sudden a fight starts. I have a staffordshire mix, and when meeting other dogs she gets very stiff and may move her tail, but I guarantee that is not friendliness. She's waiting to see what the other dog is all about. I make sure it doesn't escalate to that and separate her and the other dog until both can calm down and relax. When she's relaxed and friendly her ears and tail are down, tail moving loosely, and body relaxed. I'm not an expert, this is only based off my experience and observations living with and working around dogs.

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Originally Posted by sorraia

The thing is, ears up and tail moving isn't always friendly. Tails will move (not true "wagging" as a happy dog does) even during moments of tension. Ears may be up during moments of tension too, especially in dominant dogs. There's much more to it than just ear and tail position or movement. You need to also look at where the eyes are moving, and subtle changes in facial muscles. You also need to look at the whole body, and see if it's loose or tense. The Red dog is tense during much of the interaction, where the younger dog is much more loose and jubilant.

A lot of dog fights can be prevented if people knew more of what to look for. They see two dogs "sniffing" eachother with ears up and tails moving, and assume the dogs are being friends. All of a sudden a fight starts. I have a staffordshire mix, and when meeting other dogs she gets very stiff and may move her tail, but I guarantee that is not friendliness. She's waiting to see what the other dog is all about. I make sure it doesn't escalate to that and separate her and the other dog until both can calm down and relax. When she's relaxed and friendly her ears and tail are down, tail moving loosely, and body relaxed. I'm not an expert, this is only based off my experience and observations living with and working around dogs.

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I agree, you need to know how to read your dog, I like you am going off my experience with my dogs and how they act when tensing up.

I just watched the video again, and this is my play-by-play interpretation of what's happening:
Up to about 0:10 Red is very tolerant toward the puppy behaviors. He's accepting it, and relaxed, but also dominating toward the puppy (see where he puts his head over the pup's back and tries to mount). After 0:10 he is redirected and distracted by the toy, then play resumes between the two dogs, with the pup being even more rambunctious. At 0:25 Red becomes less tolerant, and again tries to assert his dominance over the pup by pushing and mounting. The pushing you see between 0:30 and 0:32 is not really play, that's an aggressive move, and probably the only reason it doesn't turn into a fight is because the pup rolls over onto his back and submits. If the pup stood up to Red, it would have most likely progressed into a fight. (These are the exact behaviors I see between my two dogs before they get into an argument, I am usually able to split the up before it gets too serious.) Pay close attention starting at 0:34 where Red is standing over the pup. Look at how tense his body is, and even though his tail is moving, look at how stiff it is. This is not relaxed play. He is trying to dominate the pup, and while the pup is mostly accepting it, he's not completely submissive either. See at 0:43 the pup breaks free and starts running around. He's excited, nipping, and jumping. To an older more dominant dog that is not in a playing mood, these may be perceived as challenging, annoying behaviors. In fact this "puppy play" is a way for the young pup to learn his place in the world, and try out dominant behaviors without getting into too much trouble. As he gets older though, if he keeps it up it can escalate into a fight. At these moments look at how stiff Red is. His tail is no longer wagging, any movement is stiff, and while his ears are up, his body is tense. At 0:53 he again tries to mount the pup, again trying to assert his dominance. At 0:57 he again pins the pup, and though is tail is moving, it is not a loose, relaxed, happy, playful wagging, it is tense and stiff. He's not playing, he's asserting his dominance over the pup, and the only reason there isn't a fight at this point is because the pup allows himself to be dominated.

They are playing. I run a cage free grooming salon. And that is what we look for relaxed body language, tails up, ears up.

If their tail goes down or ears are pinned back then it has moved beyond playing. However this is also how puppies learn boundaries. Don't be alarmed if an older dog puts a puppy in its pace.

90% of the time a dog fight is just noise. If your older dog tells off the younger one let it happen. They need to figure out who is the boss. If you are really nervous keep a pale of cold water handy and if anything gets a little heated, cold water over the head will be enough to distract them for a minute, allowing you to break up the fight.