I did something stupid...

...and am sharing my stupidity hoping others will learn from it. I had two leftover live jumbo mice after feeding the BPs today (first time with jumbo mice and I bought too many) so I decided to feed them to Wee Nake, and tossed the first one in her cage, on her fresh bed of fluffy aspen. I don't know what went wrong, but she missed, and grabbed a huge mouthful of aspen, then immediately struck at it again, which implanted the aspen in her mouth.

I am very thankful for several things tonight 1) I own, and remembered to put on the heavy leather gloves before picking her up (first time she's bit me, was angry/food frenzied) 2) I live 500 yards from my local reptile store which has a kind and experienced staff 3) she was mostly angry rather than actually injured.

They were able to use a little tool thingy to open her mouth and get the 4 splinters of wood out that were stuck. Luckily none were very deep, though I'll be keeping a close eye out for infection over the next couple days and ordering a set of those little tools. I will be feeding her in the bath tub from now on also.

Sorry you had a bad experience - but Im glad it all worked out :)

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Originally Posted by Badgemash

I will be feeding her in the bath tub from now on also.

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lol...sorry...that made me chuckle. I've heard of people feeding in spare tanks, spare tubs, cardboard boxes, etc...but never in the bath tub...

lol I fed my monitor in the bath tub a couple of times. You could always switch to using a paper towel as substrate... That way you can be sure nothing will get in anyones mouth ;)

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Originally Posted by sho220

lol...sorry...that made me chuckle. I've heard of people feeding in spare tanks, spare tubs, cardboard boxes, etc...but never in the bath tub...

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I can't forget where I put the bathtub (good boxes always seem to disappear), and it's pretty easy to clean afterward.

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Originally Posted by Melody

lol I fed my monitor in the bath tub a couple of times. You could always switch to using a paper towel as substrate... That way you can be sure nothing will get in anyones mouth ;)

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I think I will, my whole BP collection is on fancy paper, but for some reason I've kept Wee on aspen. Really going to have to reasses my "logic" lately.

This happened to my boa as well. I had him on reptibark though.

Ever since that happened EVERYONE is on paper towel. Even those in display cages.

It almost gave me a heart attack when it happened.

Or just put paper or paper towels over the aspen when you feed ;)

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Another option is to put news paper down in the cage a few hour before you feed. I do it and it works very well. The snake usually feed from a perch right over the top of it. However I see you are feeding LIVE which changes things a bit. I know in the wild these animals ingest all sorts of things and do fine yet like you I totally prefer to avoid it and take extra steps.

That said, instead of making your nice looking setup into another news print jungle, maybe consider coconut husk. It's as fine as sand and will not cause the issues chunks of wood will.

IF you can somehow switch to frozen thawed even batter but that may be totally one of those non options.

Ya gotta do what ya gotta do but feeding is an enjoyable experience and watching it happen in a natural setting is cool IMO.

Try the coconut husk, I think you'll be pleased.

Glad it worked out.

Good thread!!

I've used coco husk, and a misdirected strike can certainly give a snake a mouthful of substrate. No injuries there though, Magnus was just a very crabby snake until we managed to scrape all of it out of his teeth. Now I feed on a paper towel to avoid it. :)

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Don't feed in a separate location. You are asking to get bit. Do you really want to try and pick up a boa in feed more right after it eats? Just change your substrate to a finer grain aspen. I use Sani Chips. It's so small I never worry about it.

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Originally Posted by SlitherinSisters

Or just put paper or paper towels over the aspen when you feed ;)

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Awesome simple solution!

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I'm with Mason on this one. I never would have reached my hand in my boa's cage on feeding day. You called the pieces "splinters", but were they actually imbedded in her flesh, or just stuck to saliva? A few swallowed pieces of aspen weren't going to do any damage. I'd be more worried about her grabbing a mouthful of paper towel, which WILL kill a snake if it gets ingested, since the whole sheet would get swallowed.

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

I'm with Mason on this one. I never would have reached my hand in my boa's cage on feeding day. You called the pieces "splinters", but were they actually imbedded in her flesh, or just stuck to saliva? A few swallowed pieces of aspen weren't going to do any damage. I'd be more worried about her grabbing a mouthful of paper towel, which WILL kill a snake if it gets ingested, since the whole sheet would get swallowed.

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Yep, there is a photo floating around of a dead snake and a regurgitated paper towel. I believe it's on the Deviant Constrictors blog page.

I don't want to make light of any of this and I DO take every precaution to avoid ingested substrate. But snakes are fairly hardy animals and they scoop garbage up in their mouths in the wild all of the time. The digestive acids in their systems break down bone and I don't think coconut husk or some fine shredded other sub will be the end unless we are talking about a table spoon full of it. Impactions are rare but if they happen to you, "rare" sucks LOL!

A flat sheet of news print does not ball up like a paper towel so if you want, drop it down a day prior to feeding and go from there.

Any chance you can switch to frozen thawed?

Oddly enough, the ONLY time I've been bitten by my snake was when I tried to remove the news paper after he was 3/4's of the way done with his rat. Lesson learned.

Good luck.

Wow, I did not expect this thread would be on a second page, let alone in 12 hours! I'll try to answer the questions posed and apologize if I accidentally forget to answer one.

One "splinter" was between her teeth and lip, parallel to the lip, but not stuck. Two were embedded in the roof of her mouth, and a smaller one in the fleshy part of the lower jaw near the trachea, that one took more of a 'tug' with the tweezers to remove. I'll be watching closely over the next week for any indication of infection.

She's a piggie, she will eat mice or rats, live, fresh killed, or f/t, she does not care. She usually gets whatever the BPs don't eat, supplemented as needed. Since I take her out pretty regularly, she doesn't seem to associate my hands coming into the cage with food, however I do use the gloves if I have to pick her up during feeding (like taking her out of the bathtub). She had never struck directly at me until last night, which I'm putting down to pain and confusion about what happened to her (she struck at the cage a few times when we moved her into her big house a few months ago, but settled down after that).

I think I will be changing out the aspen (I'm at the bottom of my super gigantic bag anyway), probably to coco coir, and go back to feeding all her meals in the bathtub. I feel like such a jerk that my laziness (just throwing her food in there instead of taking the time to move her) led to my animal getting injured.

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Originally Posted by MasonC2K

Don't feed in a separate location. You are asking to get bit. Do you really want to try and pick up a boa in feed more right after it eats? Just change your substrate to a finer grain aspen. I use Sani Chips. It's so small I never worry about it.

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

I'm with Mason on this one. I never would have reached my hand in my boa's cage on feeding day. You called the pieces "splinters", but were they actually imbedded in her flesh, or just stuck to saliva? A few swallowed pieces of aspen weren't going to do any damage. I'd be more worried about her grabbing a mouthful of paper towel, which WILL kill a snake if it gets ingested, since the whole sheet would get swallowed.

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I totally agree with this and with what Gio said. I would never in a million years move an adult boa to a separate container for feeding then back again. That is just asking to get bit and bit HARD. I'm not afraid to be bit by my boas, but I know what it feels like and I'll do whatever I can to minimize the chances. Moving your boa on feeding day is setting up for disaster.

The safest substrate you can use is newspaper or corrugated paper. This is stiff enough that your snake should have no issues swallowing pieces of it (like she could with paper towels). Coco fiber and sani chips are also pretty darn safe. Snakes swallow debris in the wild all the time with no ill effect. I understand that your snake actually appeared to have splinters embedded in the mouth, but this is extremely rare. But paper, coco fiber, or sani chips would solve that problem and would also mean you wouldn't have to move her.

Trust me on this one. When your boa is pushing 8 feet long, I don't care what kind of gloves you are wearing, you are going to think twice about moving her. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Badgemash

I feel like such a jerk that my laziness (just throwing her food in there instead of taking the time to move her) led to my animal getting injured.

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lol...you're being much too hard on yourself. It's not that big of a deal...it happens, you dealt with it, learned a few lessons...and you're a better keeper for it. :gj:

And this is a good "fyi" thread for beginners...

Thanks sho, that's why I wanted to share what happened even though I'm upest/embarrassed.

Evenstar - wow, I really am having a problem thinking things through, I hadn't thought at all about what that would involve when she's full grown. That settles it, coco coir and feeding in the cage from here out.

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Originally Posted by Badgemash

Thanks sho, that's why I wanted to share what happened even though I'm upest/embarrassed.

Evenstar - wow, I really am having a problem thinking things through, I hadn't thought at all about what that would involve when she's full grown. That settles it, coco coir and feeding in the cage from here out.

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Good choice!! And don't worry - boas are actually pretty smart and they learn quickly when you are reaching in to feed and when you are reaching in to touch or clean. I'm sure you've already experienced that. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

Good choice!! And don't worry - boas are actually pretty smart and they learn quickly when you are reaching in to feed and when you are reaching in to touch or clean. I'm sure you've already experienced that. :gj:

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This is so true. You would be beside yourself if you kept multiple large snakes and had to take each one out to a separate feeding cage.

It's one of the BIGGEST myths in the hobby.

I could easily say the snake will "think" it's time to eat every time you take it out of the cage. Then how could you ever take it out to play? You still have to reach into the cage, so the food association that everybody thinks comes with reaching in is still there, then its out and the same food association is still there??

The big snake keepers will hook train their animals. Cody from the large python board knows quite a bit about feeding responses with retics. Most retic keepers will rub the snake with a hook to get it's attention. When there is NO smell of food and the snake should not see you as prey. Don't smell, move or act like prey.

Now if the snake is defensive, that is a whole different story. I have worked with my male boa who used to strike and hiss, then just hiss before I would get him out. He was not hungry, but simply was not digging me or play time. I continued to work at it and now I reach in and pet the tail end a bit and when he moves a bit I just pick him up.

I know this got long and the substrate was the main topic, but this good thread ties into many other areas.

Being good pet owners we all do our best to keep these guys safe. In reality they live like kings and queens with us and deal with far more hardship in the wild. And guess what?? They've been around for MILLIONS of years. They are pretty hardy animals.

Coco husk,, YES!!

Frozen Thawed if it takes it,, YES!!

Feed in the cage,, YES!

Enjoy your snake,, ABSOLUTELY!