King Cobras- How?

There wasn't a forum for venomous snakes that I could find, if there was I overlooked it and I apologize!

This is just a general question- some people breed and handle king cobras... and I don't understand how. Pretty positive they don't devenomize or defang them... so what are they just relying on being EXTREMELY careful? Gorgeous and regal animals, but I wouldn't risk keeping one... Just wondering how it's done. There are few king cobra caresheets online and what I do find, they don't really discuss how to "safely" handle them.

There is a venomous forum. Some people do think its ok to handle venomous, but the majority of the responsible community does not think so. Now that depends on what you mean by handling, by hook and tail, or even tailing? Is there a specific person or video you are referring too?

The simple answer is yes.

Venomous animal threads = http://ball-pythons.net/forums/forum...nomous-Animals

Some info on keeping hots.

http://www.snakegetters.com/hk/handling1.html

http://www.snakegetters.com/hk/handling2.html

Just get a false water cobra! Lol

Generally, the method to handle large Kings is to hook and tail. Although, you'll get some idiots who like to free handle.

I'm quite lucky, 3 good friends of mine keep king cobras. Due to go to one of their houses in two weeks, il see if I can get a few nice pictures.

Keeping hots is. It for beginners or anything like that. I myself have a few. I choose to keep Bitis because they arent super spastic. They are pretty lazy like fat little pigs and they ride a hook or two very nice. I know that if one gets dropped it's not going to be on the other side of the room in 2 seconds like a cobra or something like that. And your probably saying to yourself yeah but they have the fastest strike in the world and thats why the only thing i ever put in their steike radius is a hook. That being said I am by no means complacent nor do I get into that comfort zone that you can have with normal snakes. I don't free handle and I'm not much for pinning hots and grabbing them by the head either. Just unneeded risk in my situation because I don't need to milk them or anything like that. Keeping hots is something that has to be thought through and you should never just go to a show and buy a hot.

I guess I meant I saw pictures of someone free-handling. They took a picture with the cobra basically three feet away from their face, and it made my hairs stand on end. I've seen videos of people handling hots with snake hooks though, but this guy looked like he just grabbed his by the tail- seems like they could just whip around and tag him.

See, I KNEW there was a venom forum but naturally, when I need it I can't find it. Very interesting links, I love the "school learning" set up. Cute and educational.

Mike- thanks for mentioning that! I'd never heard of them but now looking at them they're very cool.

What reward do you get out of keeping your vipers? Just the knowledge you can handle them, or do you like to breed? On a side note, it kind of surprises me you don't need any paperwork to own venomous snakes. That seems like that'd be another league of keeping exotics.

The only reason I have ever kept and worked with hots, was for education. I kept and raised CBB local species (Western Diamondback Rattlesnakes, Southern Copperheads, and Western Cottonmouths) and took them on a tour in various parts of Texas using them as teaching tools, displaying them in a locked cage within a larger cage, but still allowing for ample viewing pleasure, and discussion of their importance. It does take a proper keeper to work with hots. You will get many people, especially in the US, that will keep hots for the sake of masculinity or being the "king" by pocession such things. Many of the best keepers, do not disclose their hots to many people outside of the community.

It's like being a Dr. If you try to do it for the wrong reasons, things will not go well. . .

Let me guess, the man you saw free handling the cobra was Albert Killian

In Florida, to keep venomous, you must complete 1000 hours of training with the species you want to own, show you have proper facilities, etc.

I think a lot of venomous are beautiful animals and for many the reason to keep them are the same reasons to keep any snake.

Tailing can be a very responsible method of needed handling(i.e. when a snake MUST be handled) IF the keeper is experienced.

Any handling is a risk. Many keepers even have a cage set up to block the snake in one part so the other empty part can be cleaned, etc. So no handling at all for regular duties.

Conversely, here in Oklahoma you just have to apply for a special license and show a warden your cage meets "standard". But, if you don't tell anyone, no one knows...

There was one guy selling sidewinders a while back, wouldn't sell to minors and anyone who didn't have the license.

Haha in South Carolina you just have to be 18... Nothing else

1000 hours is ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Crotalids

1000 hours is ridiculous.

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I don't think it is ridiculous. I think all states should have some sort of restriction like this. Maybe not 1000 hours, but at least 500. It's easy for people to forget that these animals are dangerous and need to be respected.


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Originally Posted by missriss2012

I don't think it is ridiculous. I think all states should have some sort of restriction like this. Maybe not 1000 hours, but at least 500. It's easy for people to forget that these animals are dangerous and need to be respected.


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50 hours is more than enough, unless you're brain dead.

Keeping venomous reptiles can be a huge pain just due to red tape and no consistent laws.
Between federal, state/provincial and local by-laws there is a lot of hoops to jump through that have no influence of safely keeping or handling these animals.

Granted this might cut down on a number of fools keeping them because they are "bad a**" animals, it doesn't help serious herpetologists, venom collectors(for antivenin production), or add to safety of the community or the handler.
The best models I've seen are the jurisdictions that run an "apprentice" type of program.

Venomoids are also occasionally available but, a snake or two has been known to re-grow the severed ducts to transport venom to the fangs.
Even a venomoid should be treated the same as a true "hot" herp.

Heh Texas you simple go to Walmart pay $20 for your controlled snake permit if you don't have one. And boom. Legal to own any venomous as long as its not protected / endangered


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Originally Posted by reptileexperts

Heh Texas you simple go to Walmart pay $20 for your controlled snake permit if you don't have one. And boom. Legal to own any venomous as long as its not protected / endangered


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And how many innocent citizens have been killed by a captive venomous snakes that escaped? I guess none...

Which means there is nothing wrong with the system. A system should be in place, only to protect the public.

Who cares if a keeper is bitten and dies? If someone is stupid enough to buy a venomous snake, that they know full well they cannot handle confidently, it's their own fault.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by missriss2012

I don't think it is ridiculous. I think all states should have some sort of restriction like this. Maybe not 1000 hours, but at least 500. It's easy for people to forget that these animals are dangerous and need to be respected.


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Easy to forget? I don't think so. Who forgets their cobra or rattlesnake is venomous and decides to free handle it? I think that goes back to being brain dead.

I think 1000 hours is a bit much and I wonder how well they are finding people keeping hots without the proper permits. Its kinda like the banned snakes. Its left to the keepers themselves to follow the law. If I move from one state to another who will know, its not like they have snake check points. I also know you will have a hard time finding law enforcement that will know what snakes are banned or even what the banned snakes look like.

They are feel good laws that make people feel like they have accomplished something. Just like outlawing guns only takes them out of law abiding citizens hands but not the criminals. I bet you even the law makers couldn't pick out the banned snakes from a line up.

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Originally Posted by Crotalids

And how many innocent citizens have been killed by a captive venomous snakes that escaped? I guess none...

Which means there is nothing wrong with the system. A system should be in place, only to protect the public.

Who cares if a keeper is bitten and dies? If someone is stupid enough to buy a venomous snake, that they know full well they cannot handle confidently, it's their own fault.

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Lol ok - my statement was just a statement calm down crot ;)

But yes there should be no need for deep permit systems since the endangerment comes to that of the keeper first. Should I say, natural selection?


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Originally Posted by zach_24_90

Keeping hots is. It for beginners or anything like that. I myself have a few. I choose to keep Bitis because they arent super spastic. They are pretty lazy like fat little pigs and they ride a hook or two very nice. I know that if one gets dropped it's not going to be on the other side of the room in 2 seconds like a cobra or something like that. And your probably saying to yourself yeah but they have the fastest strike in the world and thats why the only thing i ever put in their steike radius is a hook. That being said I am by no means complacent nor do I get into that comfort zone that you can have with normal snakes. I don't free handle and I'm not much for pinning hots and grabbing them by the head either. Just unneeded risk in my situation because I don't need to milk them or anything like that. Keeping hots is something that has to be thought through and you should never just go to a show and buy a hot.

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If you don't think that Bitis are capable of being super spastic then you haven't spent enough time around Bitis. They are ALL capable of mind bending feats of athletic behavior. I have seen many large "fat"' gabbons, puff's, rhinos do things you would never believe them capable of. If you don't believe me I've got a young male puff adder right now that would be happy to show you exactly what these animals are capable of. Don't underestimate these guys. Trust me you will regret it.

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Originally Posted by jason_ladouceur

If you don't think that Bitis are capable of being super spastic then you haven't spent enough time around Bitis. They are ALL capable of mind bending feats of athletic behavior. I have seen many large "fat"' gabbons, puff's, rhinos do things you would never believe them capable of. If you don't believe me I've got a young male puff adder right now that would be happy to show you exactly what these animals are capable of. Don't underestimate these guys. Trust me you will regret it.

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True. They can be. But at the same time are are no mamba. I never said I was underestimating them. In fact I said quite the opposite actually. Don't try to come on here and bash everything I said. Your not contributing to the conversation at all that way. I was only stating my opinion. I don't need you telling me I'm wrong about this and that. Obviously they can freak out. What snake can't. But I've met 100 cobras and mambas and who knows what for every 1 bitis that acts crazy.

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Originally Posted by zach_24_90

True. They can be. But at the same time are are no mamba. I never said I was underestimating them. In fact I said quite the opposite actually. Don't try to come on here and bash everything I said. Your not contributing to the conversation at all that way. I was only stating my opinion. I don't need you telling me I'm wrong about this and that. Obviously they can freak out. What snake can't. But I've met 100 cobras and mambas and who knows what for every 1 bitis that acts crazy.

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Pissy much?
I wasn't in any way attempting to bash anything you said. Just attempting to point out that the lazy, laid back attitudes of Bitis are largely over stated. Far to often I hear about how calm this group is. And with the explosive capabilities they posses its critical that people who keep the large members of Bitis remain constantly aware of what they are capable of. That's all.
Now back on point to the op.
King cobras can and are safely handled by experienced keepers all the time. There are many techniques utilized. Free handling is not one of them. Hook and tail is typically the most common and "safe" way for when the animal must be physically manipulated for what ever reason. But like all large elapids, using a shifting cage or trap box to limit the exposure to the specimen is IMO the perfered method when ever possible.

All of the snakes will be different i have puff adders, copperheads and cobras, one king cobra. My male puff is crazy too lol.. i have pics of the king cobra on facebook. Joe parker is my name if ya want to see them..
There is a site called venomousreptiles.org most people free hande large kings good luck trying to hook a 16 foot king cobra lol. Look at ray hunters pics on facebook too he freehandles them but has lots of experience with cobras

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Originally Posted by jparker1167

All of the snakes will be different i have puff adders, copperheads and cobras, one king cobra. My male puff is crazy too lol.. i have pics of the king cobra on facebook. Joe parker is my name if ya want to see them..
There is a site called venomousreptiles.org most people free hande large kings good luck trying to hook a 16 foot king cobra lol. Look at ray hunters pics on facebook too he freehandles them but has lots of experience with cobras

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Errrrrr, 3 of my best friends have king cobras, none of them free handle. Free handling is reserved for idiots, or people lacking vital grey matter.

How many times has ray been bitten by venomous snakes? More than his fair share.

Hook and tail, is a perfectly useable method when working with kings.

I dont believe ray has been bit by a king cobra, you do what works for you and if that is not using a hook for large kings then that's your decision. I would bet that ray had kept and handled more cobras than you and your friends and me all combined. I will have a hook for mine, but i also wouldnt call someone like ray an idot when hes being doing this for as long as he has. I have seen tons of large kings free handled not what i would do but those are people that have been doing it for as long as i have been alive so it works fof them

I'm not sure I would call Ray an Idiot exactly. He is clearly a skilled handler with TONS of experience. But I would have to agree that free handling any hot is a bad idea. I've seen plenty of kings handled using a hook. It's not easy but it certainly is not impossible. So why take the risk of free handling if you don't have to? Trouble is a lot of times when people spend so much time around dangerous animals they become complacent and do things like free handle because its easier than doing it the proper and safe way. But at the end of the day it's not my life and I don't lay there medical insurance so people can do what ever they want.

I agree i would use a hook, but a 3 foot hook on a 15' king really doesnt seem to be much different than without. I dont free handle anything hot, never have and never will. But some people are able to do it and have for many years. I wouldnt call those people stupid.