I really have no idea what morph my guy is

Here's some pictures...the breeder said he didn't have any "normal's" so I'm confused on what I got...

http://i.imgur.com/WvzwfzS.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/KWrMLXK.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/1dtcAqq.jpg

Looks like a normal to me. Do you have a pic of his belly?


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All breeders will have some normal OR hets. ;)

http://i.imgur.com/Caiypz9.jpg

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

Looks like a normal to me. Do you have a pic of his belly?


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Not sure what the breeder was talking about, that guy is a normal unless he's het for something. Is there any way you can contact the breeder?


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Originally Posted by Annarose15

Not sure what the breeder was talking about, that guy is a normal unless he's het for something. Is there any way you can contact the breeder?


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I did after I got him. He said that he had no normal's because he had no adult normal's, so all his babies were i'm guessing he said het. i just don't know what he's het for. I thought Pied at first, but that doesn't seem likely. he doesn't have the two stripes down to his vent. it's pretty much the same clean white all the way down to the tail.

his color's are really odd. Up by his head, he's almost an army green, while some of him is almost a bright yellowish brown (as seen in pictures) and he has white in a lot of places.

You can still get normals without normal parents. I hatched a normal male last season from a bumblebee x lemonblast pairing. On the flip side, breeders will sometimes sell het and poss het males as normals if it's a lower value gene (albino, etc.).


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I say you hit this breeder up again and ask. Did you not get papers with him? Like was said before, every breeder will have normals. And a het is really just a normal to anyone not breeding. And your snake looks pretty normal. Not that that is bad or anything. My first was a male normal and I still have female normals.

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Originally Posted by eatgoodfood

Did you not get papers with him?

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Not to high-jack but................ there are VERY FEW small breeders here that give any paperwork. I run on my word and trust people at theirs till they prove otherwise.

I guess thats different than here because I have gotten papers for every snake I bought.

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Originally Posted by eatgoodfood

I guess thats different than here because I have gotten papers for every snake I bought.

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How much are "papers" really worth? And what do they say?

I, (so and so), verify the genetics of this (ridiculous double het, like pied and albino) and will buy back the snake at (selling price) should it not prove it's genetics.

Really? Ha, I could:
1. Fake that.
2. Lie like a little child.
3. Say I never produced it.
4. Sell you a normal for 5x the price.
5. Get away with it.

:|

Yea sure a person can fake it for, but for others its an added piece of mind. Its just back up for your words IF your a trustworthy person to begin with. Papers with no picture of the actual snake in question are the ones easily faked and lied about.

Papers may have no value from breeder to breeder but to a new person they may feel more secure. Its like how a person gets papers for other animals .You can get animals with or without papers but the papers is just added security it makes the breeder a bit more accountable than on just on their word alone.

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Originally Posted by kyote19

Yea sure a person can fake it for, but for others its an added piece of mind. Its just back up for your words IF your a trustworthy person to begin with. Papers with no picture of the actual snake in question are the ones easily faked and lied about.

Papers may have no value from breeder to breeder but to a new person they may feel more secure. Its like how a person gets papers for other animals .You can get animals with or without papers but the papers is just added security it makes the breeder a bit more accountable than on just on their word alone.

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I agree! I am a small breeder and give out photo id paperwork for hets. not only for the customer but also if they sell a different snake and say its my het. They cannot come back on me if its not the same snake in the photo. I am very honest and pride myself on my genetics! Hell I get paperwork from the pro breeders. I know its a het. Bit if I decide to sell it....

For him to never produce normals he would have to use a super in every pairing he did. That little guy is a normal visual wise, unless proven he is het for something then its still a normal. Does the guy own visual recessives?

Looks normal to me but I could be missing something. Still, not knowing what it was, I hope you didn't pay too much for it.

dude most likely played u buddy .. n if u buy from trusted dealers u dont need papers ... jmo

Every person selling an animal should give their customers some kind of 'papers'... as you all call it.

I give every one of my customers a photo ID of their snake, what produced him/her, date hatched, date shipped, date sold, weights, eating habits, a free water bowl, etc etc.....

So yea... people that do the bare minimum for their customers are... useless.

You have a normal, OP.

Who'd you buy the snake from?

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Originally Posted by Coopers Constrictors

So yea... people that do the bare minimum for their customers are... useless.

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That's nice to know, I guess a feeding card is bare minimum as well as a nice plump healthy snake. :confusd::confusd::confusd:
BTW what is the point of giving away a water bowl??

To answer some questions.

I bought him as a normal. I played 50 bucks (he's 5 months old). I got 0 paper work with him. My wife and I guess that they probably had paper work for their more expensive ones. I bought him from a breeder called Ron's Reptiles. He's the biggest reptile dealer/breeder north of Sacramento. When I bought him, he said one of his parents was pied, so I'm guessing that means he's het. I wanted a spider but he wanted 275 just for a 6 month old and 199 for a hatchling pastel.

He was in a VERY not to my liking environment. This person had hatchlings in just tubs sticking out of a shelving unit. Inside each tub was a water bowl and paper towel. Their designer bps had way better homes.

Anyways. Hope that helps

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

That's nice to know, I guess a feeding card is bare minimum as well as a nice plump healthy snake. :confusd::confusd::confusd:
BTW what is the point of giving away a water bowl??

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x2. Unless it involves recessive genes i don't plan to type up any special paper work. They'll get the feeding card for the snake and that's it, no water dishes or anything lol. If they ask more about who the parents were or anything else i'd be more than willing to provide the info/pics, but otherwise i feel that's enough and not the "bare minimum".

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Originally Posted by greenacid

He was in a VERY not to my liking environment. This person had hatchlings in just tubs sticking out of a shelving unit. Inside each tub was a water bowl and paper towel.

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That sounds like a standard setup for a hatchling rack.

The OP's snake sounds like it may be het for something, but without papers he has no clue what. Unless he's planning on breeding or selling it in the future, it's not something to stress about.

"Papers" are meaningless. It's the information that is key. It doesn't have to be formalized in "papers." If I know the breeder well enough, they can tell me verbally what it is an I'll just write it down to keep track myself. Otherwise I am just fine with a hand written feed card or an email so I know what to feed it to start off with.

As for the OP, if he said verbally to you that one of the parents was a Pied, then you have a Het. Of course you won't know for sure if he was telling the truth until you breed it to something else with the Pied gene.

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Originally Posted by kyote19

Papers may have no value from breeder to breeder but to a new person they may feel more secure.

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This is not necessarily completely true. It depends on who the breeders are. I bought a pair of het albinos back in 2004 from Adam at 8ballpythons, when he was still in the business. Both animals were given a genetically guaranteed document. Years later i traded the female to another pretty well known local breeder who knew Adam, and only accepted my trade because he knew Adam's "paper" would back up the genetics of the animal. In todays market, het albinos are not worth crap....but you get the idea.



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Many people may remember the scam the guy was running early on about selling normals with papers claiming them to be het. Got a good sum of money before people tried to prove his animals out and they didn't.

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