Crazy rat - it's feeding day - need help!!!!!!!

Okay, So I just went to the reptile store and bought a feeder live rat weaning.. I have never had this problem before but this rat is going to bite me.
I tried to stun it and it jumped at my hand and almost got it.. I put on gloves and it jumped up on them and tried to gnaw through them..

I really have no clue how or what I'm supposed to do anything that will let me feed my snake this rat, but its going crazy and won't let me grab it out of the box at all!! PLEASE HELP:mad::snake::taz:

This is why you don't try to "stun" a rodent. Whacking them on the head without killing them can induce panic and defensive attack mode. Put him somewhere he can't escape with a little food and water and give him time to chill out. Then just pick him up gently with your glove and feed the jerk off.

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

Whacking them on the head without killing them can induce panic and defensive attack mode.

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All I did was shake the box he's in a little, and that's because he was already doing this when I tried to pick him up the first time. I never have to stun them except for right now..

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Originally Posted by gillianc

All I did was shake the box he's in a little, and that's because he was already doing this when I tried to pick him up the first time. I never have to stun them except for right now..

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So the ride home freaked him out, and then you shook the box more. As I said - food, water, quiet, and then dump him in the cage. Grabbing at him is just going to aggravate him more.

Leave the poor little bugger alone for an hour or 2, it'll probably curl into a ball and go to sleep. It's a living creature, be kind to it and it'll calm down. Remember, rats are social animals. This morning that rat was probably piled in the corner of its tub with a dozen or more of its siblings. now its scared and alone.

A crazy rat would be one who DOESN'T think the before mentioned series of events was reason to get a little defensive.

Or it could just be a really aggressive rat. Our local pet shop gives us the ones that tend to bite fingers and chew the other rats' faces off, because they know we're not going to try to make a pet out of it.

... maybe but im pretty sure shaking it up in the box didnt make it any less aggressive if that is the case...

Funny thing I have fed / sold off well over 1k rats and have never met a rat that when approached calmly and confidently has not melted like little rat putty in my hands. I have only been bit 4 times and all of those were when pulling mothers off babies so I could feed off the pinks. Maybe I am lucky maybe my rats are uber calm but I think the aggressive rat issue is more of a scared crapless rat that does not know what to do. (For the record I have the same opinion on ASFS even though everyone thinks they are biters)

Rats aren't stupid. They know what's going to happen. I had to take my first female ball to the vet for a deep bite from a medium rat that decided to attack the minute its feet hit the floor.

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Originally Posted by Rickys_Reptiles

Leave the poor little bugger alone for an hour or 2, it'll probably curl into a ball and go to sleep. It's a living creature, be kind to it and it'll calm down. Remember, rats are social animals. This morning that rat was probably piled in the corner of its tub with a dozen or more of its siblings. now its scared and alone.

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I agree 100%, this also why I don't stun live prey. This is where my number 2 pencil comes in handy or me prying the rat away if it came down to it.

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Originally Posted by treeboa

Rats aren't stupid. They know what's going to happen. I had to take my first female ball to the vet for a deep bite from a medium rat that decided to attack the minute its feet hit the floor.

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This is also why I will not feed anything larger than a small rat if it is alive. Older/bigger means more potential for serious injury.

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

This is also why I will not feed anything larger than a small rat if it is alive. Older/bigger means more potential for serious injury.

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Yeah I haven't fed anything past a small yet either, and I don't think I ever will.

Okay heres what you do: 1.put on thick gloves
:2. kill it
:3.feed it to your reptile

Personally when I feed live rodents, I always use tongs to grab them by the scruff. That way when I present it to the snake it is much more likely to grab the rodent by the head and therefore less likely to be bitten.

With mice I sometimes use the tail, but rats are much too heavy to be held by their tails so you're best off with the scruff (I've heard of their tails actually coming off, not my cup of tea)

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Originally Posted by Alexandra V

Personally when I feed live rodents, I always use tongs to grab them by the scruff. That way when I present it to the snake it is much more likely to grab the rodent by the head and therefore less likely to be bitten.

With mice I sometimes use the tail, but rats are much too heavy to be held by their tails so you're best off with the scruff (I've heard of their tails actually coming off, not my cup of tea)

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Please don't dangle your feeders.

It stresses the rodent out. A stressed rodent is an angry rodent.

I would feed rats like this to my boa. She is very fast to strike during feeding time and very accurate. The rat would be choked out before it knew what happened. ( all under supervision of course)

I wouldn't trust a rat like that with my ball pythons as they arent as aggressive All the rats I breed are pretty sweet though

Yeah, my ball pythons won't eat f/t but they don't take live either. Quickly or painlessly prekill the rat or have the pet store employee do it for you. It's better for the rodent, better for the snake, and better for you.

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

Please don't dangle your feeders.

It stresses the rodent out. A stressed rodent is an angry rodent.

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Sorry, I wasn't clear. I don't dangle them ever, but I do transport them by the tail (mice) or scruff (rats). When I do feed them off I put them on the ground in the tub but I usually do keep a hold on them. Sometimes my snakes get them before they hit the ground though.

Why not just hold the rat in the palm of your hand? They're not only more secure, but they feel more secure and therefore are more relaxed when being offered. Whenever I have a live rodent to feed off, I just stand there, give it a few moments (or minutes) of cuddling and affection. It seems to help the rats go to the feed more calmly and then I don't have scarred up snakes because I was too callous to be nice to their dinner. Also I don't even hold them in place. I'll use my hand or hemostats to keep them to the side of the tub the snake is in but I don't touch them.

I just pick up the rat however is easiest and drop it in the bin an move on. I come back later and check the bins, never have problems. They usually get the rat before im even two tubs away. I wait for the squeal then check they got it ok and move on.

Wondering what everyone's thoughts are on the following method:

1) grab feeder and insert in sock
2) spin sock so as to dizzy the prey item
3) introduce prey item

I have seen this done with grocery bags also. I understand how harsh this may seem and do not wish to offend or incite any backlash just looking for opinions. It's pretty effective in immobilizing the prey item as most the time the rat/mouse will stay put as it tries to gain composure, after strike use pencil (eraser end first) to keep the prey item from biting your pet.

^ No...

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Originally Posted by DestinyLynette

^ No...

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I should've mentioned this isn't something I've done! Just that I'm new to the hobby n was wondering what you all thought lol. My girl won't eat f/t yet but so far no incidents, a few bite marks from a large male which worried me a bit but nothing serious thank God. Next week rat pups so back to no teeth prey? not sure if pups have teeth

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Originally Posted by galequin

I should've mentioned this isn't something I've done! Just that I'm new to the hobby n was wondering what you all thought lol. My girl won't eat f/t yet but so far no incidents, a few bite marks from a large male which worried me a bit but nothing serious thank God. Next week rat pups so back to no teeth prey? not sure if pups have teeth

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What size is your BP? That's a very wide range between prey sizes, unless you meant to say large mouse.

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Originally Posted by galequin

Wondering what everyone's thoughts are on the following method:

1) grab feeder and insert in sock
2) spin sock so as to dizzy the prey item
3) introduce prey item

I have seen this done with grocery bags also. I understand how harsh this may seem and do not wish to offend or incite any backlash just looking for opinions. It's pretty effective in immobilizing the prey item as most the time the rat/mouse will stay put as it tries to gain composure, after strike use pencil (eraser end first) to keep the prey item from biting your pet.

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I am kind of wondering how you would like someone doing this to you...

Yes large mice, sorry still learning prey sizes! Haven't gotten a scale so not sure about weight she takes em w/no problem. If I had to guess a weight I would say 200-300g? no clue really she's about 3 months old though if you can imagine a snake that size/age range bigger than all the snakes her age though. Bought her from a colony of 300 that all hatched out within a few days of each other n everytime I go pick up food I peek in at the others who look like they've barely grown.

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Originally Posted by The Snakery

I am kind of wondering how you would like someone doing this to you...

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I wouldn't! I saw a video on youtube was researching how to feed aggressive prey items, I dont have the heart to kill them myself so really hoping my girl gets on to f/t soon. She has a few bite marks from a large male mouse who got a hold of her while a few feeds ago n that's when I came across that vid but wanted to get opinions of ppl who know MUCH more than me before I tried. I'm too soft I actually had a prey item I had to hold onto once, named it stuart little and nearly cried when I fed it off :/ imagine a 6'2" 230lb man visibly upset about a dying mouse. Cheered up pretty quickly though, after all my girl's health n well being mean more to me. Pics of bite marks below... more noticeable in person

http://i1059.photobucket.com/albums/...uin/IMG377.jpg

Those bites will come out with a shed or two.

Feeding live is never a problem so long as you feed smaller rodents more frequently. If the rodent is small enough (IMO appropriately sized) it won't be able to do damage to the snake. Also, the snake will be able to kill it quickly by overpowering it, meaning its more humane for all animals involved.

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Originally Posted by galequin

I wouldn't! I saw a video on youtube was researching how to feed aggressive prey items, I dont have the heart to kill them myself so really hoping my girl gets on to f/t soon. She has a few bite marks from a large male mouse who got a hold of her while a few feeds ago n that's when I came across that vid but wanted to get opinions of ppl who know MUCH more than me before I tried. I'm too soft I actually had a prey item I had to hold onto once, named it stuart little and nearly cried when I fed it off :/ imagine a 6'2" 230lb man visibly upset about a dying mouse. Cheered up pretty quickly though, after all my girl's health n well being mean more to me. Pics of bite marks below... more noticeable in person

http://i1059.photobucket.com/albums/...uin/IMG377.jpg

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Just make sure you observe the feeding, no need to harm the rat/ mouse or whatever. Once your snake strikes, keep an eye on him, if the prey item is or can bite, then stick your pencil or feeding tongs in its mouth till its over. Those bite marks dont look bad and will likely go away with a shed.

I don't know how else it can be phrased. There is not a single intelligent, responsible, experienced reptile keeper that would ever suggest:

Stunning
Spinning
Dazing
Thumping
Shaking
Yelling cuss words at
Restraining
Dangling
Wounding

or any other action prior to feeding a prey item to an animal that doesn't involve calmly and comfortably introducing they prey item which is well fed and watered to the enclosure of the animal being fed and leaving it all alone until one or the other takes confrontational action

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Originally Posted by galequin

Yes large mice, sorry still learning prey sizes! Haven't gotten a scale so not sure about weight she takes em w/no problem. If I had to guess a weight I would say 200-300g? no clue really she's about 3 months old though if you can imagine a snake that size/age range bigger than all the snakes her age though. Bought her from a colony of 300 that all hatched out within a few days of each other n everytime I go pick up food I peek in at the others who look like they've barely grown.

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She's just bigger because you're actually feeding her a decent amount, as opposed to many pet stores. At that size, she can take even up to rat weanlings (~25-40g). If the pup still leaves a little bulge in her belly, just stick with those for a bit longer. I would switch her off of mice for good, because adult mice can definitely cause some damage and as she gets bigger you also don't want to be feeding multiple mice when one rat would do. It will be easiest if you get a digital kitchen scale to weigh her and her food, so you know what you're feeding and how she's growing. Oh, and just gently drop the rodent in the tub when you feed. Trying to stun or disorient it can often lead to panic and therefore more danger to your snake. Good luck!

All great advice :D, will be doing a rat pup next week and prob post on how it goes! Thank you all for your advice and info. Really loving this community!

... "Yelling cuss words at"....:rofl: