Facebook friends and family getting on my nerves

So last night I got into yet another arguement with a friend of mine on face book, she was out with her sons at a creak with a couple of .22s hunting water moccasin. they should pictures of severel snakes they had shot and I told them it was cruel to the animal to just shoot them in spite. she replied back to me that she hated snakes and would shoot anyone that she sees. I explained to her that this to is animal abuse no different then me shooting a dog or a cat because I didn't like it... I would probely end up in jail or with a hefty fine. then everyone on her friends list just started hounding me because I choose to stick up for the snakes that where not being killed for food.

so just a few minutes I posted this on facebook after a little bit of research that I am not all that clear and from talking to some of my reptile loving friends here in texas on facebook

I know a lot of people on my friends list don't like, even have a fear of these wonderful animals called snakes. I so happen to have a healthy respect and love for all snakes. Snakes have a purpose and I feel that they should be left to live on there own... except when bred in captivity for the pet trade and even for scientific research, even those in labs that are used to produce antivenoum are kepth with upmost respect and greatest of care. so if and when I see someone on my friends list rather your a friend, family member or someone just there I am going to speak up on killing a snake out of fear or hatred towards that animal.

just to let some people know most dogs and/or cats are immune to most rattle snake and coral snake venoum and 90% of the time a snake that does strike is striking because it is not being left alone and will not use its venoum. I wish more and more people would do the research snakes that have and learn that there is nothing to fear of these God created creatures.

I have faced my fears agains spiders which I still have phobia of and scorpians which creep me out as well.

I have respect for all types of animals and don't think one needs be killed just because they misunderstand or don't have the knowledge of the animals

Sorry you came across some haters. It's our job in the herpetological community to defend these animals and to educate the ignorance out of people. When someone makes a negative comment about a snake I always ask, "who told you that?" or "who taught you to be afraid of snakes and why did you listen?" I just about never get a real answer, and that's how I begin the conversation about the good that snakes do in the animal community and how they are not the demonic creatures people have made them out to be. Not knowing about an animal is NOT a reason to hate or fear it. It's a reason to ask questions or leave it alone. It is never a reason to shoot it. I would find it hard not to slap someone right across the face if they told me they went out to shoot snakes. And you're absolutely right, it is NO different than shooting an untagged/uncollared dog that's walking down the street.

Yet another reason I don't do facebook.

It might just be your personality (no offense) because people know how I am and keep their nosey comments out of business. I also don't go out of my way to not post things related.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

Heck Im 23 and I don't have a facebook. I am reluctant to even have a facebook page for my business but unfortunately it is a good source for communicating with other that are interested. Its all garbage IMO though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

Yet another reason I don't do facebook.

---

X2 TYVM. If I wanted drama I would have stayed in high school.

To the Op, you also have to be a open minded person, I really don't see anything wrong with shooting a wild poisonous snake on my property. It's also not your choice to tell some one that what they're doing is wrong, that's why she probably got mad at you. Sometimes you just have to bite your tongue. I wouldn't let it upset you some people are just ignorant, and don't know how to react to some people, best thing to do is be the bigger person and let it go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Southern_Breeder

Heck Im 23 and I don't have a facebook. I am reluctant to even have a facebook page for my business but unfortunately it is a good source for communicating with other that are interested. Its all garbage IMO though.

---

Yup I'm there with ya, 25 and don't have one. I hate Facebook but I agree with you on a Facebook for business.

Killing a snake that's under your shed when you don't know whether it's venomous or not; I understand.

Going out of your way to bring your child into the woods to teach them your fear of a little reptile that was fine staying in the woods, and shooting a bunch for the fun of it; not cool at all.

That reminds me of one highschool friend of mine on facebook that regularly posted photos of her dad big game hunting multiple African lions for just a trophy head. She also sold her childhood pet dog to replace it with a breeder female German shepherd and keeps breeding every year despite having a bunch of stillborn pups and babies that were put down for spinal deformities.

I don't think I'd get rid of my facebook account. Despite mostly using it for my personal Schadenfreude fix, I do use it to keep in touch with a handful of people.

However, I'm skeptical of my local reptile scene since getting into it on Facebook.

I'd rather pay the extra shipping money than drive to some nuts house that probably has a body heat pad on his tanks. Or, just free ranges his snakes. (no one's done either of those though!)

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

I love animals, I own lots of them and always have. I also hunt deer, wild pig, squirrels, rabbits etc. does that mean I'm ignorant for hunting?

Fish and Game does population analysis on animal species, and they determine if it is ok to hunt them or not, or how many can be hunted. Nothing wrong with humanely hunting animals as long as it isn't done in a fashion that is obscene, or cruel to the animal...

Btw, again I love animals, and I always treat them respectfully and humanely.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Expensive hobby

I love animals, I own lots of them and always have. I also hunt deer, wild pig, squirrels, rabbits etc. does that mean I'm ignorant for hunting?

Fish and Game does population analysis on animal species, and they determine if it is ok to hunt them or not, or how many can be hunted. Nothing wrong with humanely hunting animals as long as it isn't done in a fashion that is obscene, or cruel to the animal...

Btw, again I love animals, and I always treat them respectfully and humanely.

---

I don't think that was the point th OP was making at all.
In fact it sounds like if this was an ethical hunt, the Op would have no issue with it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raven01

I don't think that was the point th OP was making at all.
In fact it sounds like if this was an ethical hunt, the Op would have no issue with it.

---

You are correct I am not against hunting for things such as food and then even using it for clothing and such...

Tho I am against killing a "venoumus" snake on my property. I will remove and relocate but I can understand someone with kids wanting to protect.

This person was going to maturely environment of the snakes just to kill out hatered

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Expensive hobby

I love animals, I own lots of them and always have. I also hunt deer, wild pig, squirrels, rabbits etc. does that mean I'm ignorant for hunting?

---

There's a big difference between hunting animals for freezer meat, and killing non-game species simply because their mere existence upsets you.

As for FB, much like real life I find that choosing my friends carefully keeps drama to a minimum.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bcr229

There's a big difference between hunting animals for freezer meat, and killing non-game species simply because their mere existence upsets you.

As for FB, much like real life I find that choosing my friends carefully keeps drama to a minimum.

---

No I understand, I was just making sure that "killing" animals wasn't looked down on in every situation...

And I don't only hunt for freezer meat either. I hunt squirrels for farmers because of depredation reasons.

But ya me personally, I'd rather trap and relocate a venomous snake than just kill it.

I personally believe that there are many legitimate reasons for killing an animal as long as it's done humanely. I think hunting for food is fine, I've done it many times myself, even trophy hunting, though I wouldn't do it myself, is fine as long as you have a use for the animal and you're following the law. Killing an animal that is destroying your property or eating up your garden or eating your livestock or even just causing a nuisance in or around your home is fine. But going out into THEIR home and killing them just because you can is just plain stupid and shows a complete lack of respect for life.

Hunting, got it, makes sense, but you better make use of every last bit of the animal. Hunting for sport, well if your ok with that we might as well hunt people for sport too, your unnecessarily wasting the life of an animal. Killing animals on your property.. gray area... we need to learn to live WITH nature, not AGAINST it! There are ways of dealing with nuisance species without killing them i.e. relocation. People need to learn the snakes on their property are likely eating other animals they dont want, or, just passing through.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by eatgoodfood

Hunting for sport, well if your ok with that we might as well hunt people for sport too,

---

Ummm, most people would see a difference here. Animals are not people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

Ummm, most people would see a difference here. Animals are not people.

---

Isn't pointlessly killing animals a sign of a potential serial killer? Its at the very least a sign of a very sick person, so hey, might as well kill people too. At least then theres a chance of doing some good for the planet.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by eatgoodfood

Isn't pointlessly killing animals a sign of a potential serial killer? Its at the very least a sign of a very sick person, so hey, might as well kill people too.

---

That's troll logic if I ever heard it.

Yes troll logic, I have no idea what that is supposed to mean.

Purposefully baiting someone into an argument.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

Ic, well I was not trying to do that, apologize if it came off that way, just people killing pointlessly really pushes a button with me, and I guess I let my personal feelings about how certain situations should be handeld out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kodieh

Purposefully baiting someone into an argument.

---

No actually, I was thinking of this definition. http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...=troll%20logic

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

No actually, I was thinking of this definition. http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...=troll%20logic

---

So by that I get the idea that you are implying I am stupid?

I believe the term used was "logically challenged".

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kodieh

I believe the term used was "logically challenged".

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

---

Interesting, good to know.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by eatgoodfood

So by that I get the idea that you are implying I am stupid?

---

Nope I never said that. Your earlier statement

Quote:

---

Isn't pointlessly killing animals a sign of a potential serial killer? Its at the very least a sign of a very sick person, so hey, might as well kill people too.

---

Makes absolutely no sense. Hence, troll logic.

I guess what I very poorly articulated was that i feel if you are sick enough to kill animals for fun you might as well be killing people. And that the latter has at least the potential to have a positive impact on the environment considering the extreme negative impact our species tends to have.

Trouble is that what is pointless to one person may be completely logical to another. Especially if that person is not or has chosen not to become well educated on the subject in question.

Another thing is that 99% of the time these "poisonous water moccasins" that people are so proud of killing are actually harmless water snakes. I know a lot of people that live in the South and it always amazes me how a lot of them think they are experts and really know very little about their local wild life. They think any snake they find in the water is a water moccasin. It doesn't help that lately there's a trend for celebrities, especially athletes, to kill snakes and show it on social media like they did something brave and honorable.

Pointlessly killing animals/or abusing for pleasure can, in fact, can be a very troubling behavior and be a sign of something being very wrong in a young child. However, animals are not humans. A child killing animals for pleasure does not automatically mean serial killer or human abuser. It is something that requires close monitoring, and possibly professional help.

(http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...als-when-worry)

An adult killing animals for pleasure is not one step away from becoming a serial killer. Heck, I'll admit that I enjoy hunting, but I would never hunt an animal for the sole purpose of killing. (there will always be another factor, usually food or population control)

It disturbs me to hear of a family teaching young children to kill pointlessly. Animals may not be humans, but they're certainly worthy of our respect. You will catch more flies with honey, though. It's easy to go on the instant defensive of something we love and are passionate about. But you must understand that most people view venomous snakes as monsters who are out to get their family. They think they're teaching a valuable lesson.

Instead of instantly involving our emotions, we want to calmly educate people, and bring honor to our hobby, you know?

Not everyone will listen even after that. But that's okay. It's also the time to walk away. (And unfriend their butts!!)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by treeboa

Another thing is that 99% of the time these "poisonous water moccasins" that people are so proud of killing are actually harmless water snakes. I know a lot of people that live in the South and it always amazes me how a lot of them think they are experts and really know very little about their local wild life. They think any snake they find in the water is a water moccasin. It doesn't help that lately there's a trend for celebrities, especially athletes, to kill snakes and show it on social media like they did something brave and honorable.

---

On more than one occasion I have seen people that have killed a "water moccasin" that was nothing more than a water snake. Even saw a dead copperhead one time that somehow upon death turned back into a cornsnake.

I wish snakes could show the fear and pain they are in when they are hurt. Maybe so many people wouldn't think it's OK. A dog or cat cries out in pain when they are hurt just like a human. Anyone that sees and hears this and continues to purposely hurt them is twisted and has no conscience. It's easier for people to not have empathy when the don't see their pain. It's still not right, though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by treeboa

I wish snakes could show the fear and pain they are in when they are hurt. Maybe so many people wouldn't think it's OK. A dog or cat cries out in pain when they are hurt just like a human. Anyone that sees and hears this and continues to purposely hurt them is twisted and has no conscience. It's easier for people to not have empathy when the don't see their pain. It's still not right, though.

---

Even in reptiles, pain is displayed. Roughly a week ago, when I contradicted myself and killed a local blind snake, aside from permanently scarring my conscious and adding to my life regrets, I saw its dying body writhe in pain. Maybe it's just because they are blinded from prejudgment and the hatred they learned. What I saw was a suffering being that was dying, even though it was a simply blind snake- a few steps up from the earthworm I thought it was- and in seeing that, I blamed myself and learned a valuable lesson the hard way. I vowed not to kill any animal just out of prejudged disgust or hatred, but to respect them. They did not choose to be born that way, and from killing them just because their genes say that they have to be that way, is simply prejudice. People are blinded from the hatred of other's hearsay, and in being oblivious to the pain of another being, they share the thoughts of other's who developed the historical autrocities upon mankind, only it isn't noticed, because these are just animals.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pythonminion

Even in reptiles, pain is displayed.

---

This^
I've had to give 2 snakes injections a couple times a day for a couple weeks on separate occasions. They CLEARLY feel pain. Sticking them was not easy, I felt so terrible. To make it worse, both were young, small snakes.

Sent from microwave via Tapatalk ll

My point though is that non-reptile people don't see it because the snake can't cry out and look you in the eye with that "why are you hurting me?" gaze. Those of us who know and love snakes recognize their pain and fear(trying to crawl away or bite), but others don't get it. Look at the tape of that officer on COPS that bashed that Black Rat snake's head in on camera. He never even noticed or considered that snakes suffering. It is definitely fromm prejudice and fear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by treeboa

My point though is that non-reptile people don't see it because the snake can't cry out and look you in the eye with that "why are you hurting me?" gaze. Those of us who know and love snakes recognize their pain and fear(trying to crawl away or bite), but others don't get it. Look at the tape of that officer on COPS that bashed that Black Rat snake's head in on camera. He never even noticed or considered that snakes suffering. It is definitely fromm prejudice and fear.

---

That is very true as well. Non snake ppl will take a snake flinching due to being headshy as an aggressive motion.

Sent from microwave via Tapatalk ll