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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
I am looking for an Enchi to add to my collection. I've seen quite a few but these 2 girls that have caught my attention.
http://newenglandreptile.com/cart/a-...t-piebald.html
http://pythonregius.com/enchiballpython-12f7.aspx
I wanted to know what you guys think of these girls. I like the one from NERD because she is poss het pied and I have a pied male that I can pair her up with. The second one has a gorgeous color and very nice pattern, though she is more expensive. I haven't committed myself to purchasing either of these girls but I want to know which one is the better example of the morph, and would it be worth it to purchase the 50% het pied girl when I can save some more for the other female. I would possibly breed this Enchi to a pied, super pastel, firefly, or super orange dream/orange dream male. Any suggestions?
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
I think that NERD one is pretty nice. It has nice colors but not *quite* the classic enchi pattern. Still a nice animal imo. If you wanna get it to try to prove out the pied, that'd be cool. Enchi pieds are sweet.
The second one isn't that nice at all imo. If you put that snake next to one of travis' enchis, there's not even a contest. I wonder how big that girl is...? $750 is wayyyy too high for that quality imo.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
I would keep looking. I like the color but not the pattern
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The patterns on both are okay in my opinion but not the best examples of the morph so I'd second to keep looking if you want an Enchi.
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I like the first one's coloring but not the pattern unfortunately. I like really banded Enchis with almost no spots. It'd keep looking too.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daybreaker
I like the first one's coloring but not the pattern unfortunately. I like really banded Enchis with almost no spots. It'd keep looking too.
Do people like any other kind of Enchi? :v
Like, maybe this is a just me opinion but I feel like the ones that aren't banded or have a lot of spots kind of defeat the purpose of the morph.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daybreaker
I like the first one's coloring but not the pattern unfortunately. I like really banded Enchis with almost no spots. It'd keep looking too.
This was my thought process exactly. If you wait around for a few months, the 2013 enchis will start hatching and you can pick from those.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
I am in no rush. I'll keep an eye out for nice 2013 hatchling's. Thank you guys:)
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonviper
$750 for an average looking Enchi female??? Welcome back to 2012! :fest2:
Do yourself a favor and check Kingsnake.com...there are plenty of better options...and with eggs being laid and babies starting to hatch, the prices are only going to come down more...
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just saying the same thing... definitely wait for the new babies... just my opinion...
Calder
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FYI ugly enchi's can and do throw HOT looking enchi's. Enchi's are one of those morphs that looks really don't matter when it comes to breeding.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TessadasExotics
FYI ugly enchi's can and do throw HOT looking enchi's. Enchi's are one of those morphs that looks really don't matter when it comes to breeding.
Everyone always uses this excuse to justify buying poor examples of morphs and I don't see why. I wouldn't want anything in my collection/breeding group that I wouldn't always be proud of looking at when I open up the tub on daily rounds not to mention, wouldn't a really nice Enchi be more likely to continue to produce more really nice Enchis. Why would spend the money on a lower quality animal and then go with the chance that hey, maybe it will give you a gem eventually. :/
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterKyte
Everyone always uses this excuse to justify buying poor examples of morphs and I don't see why. I wouldn't want anything in my collection/breeding group that I wouldn't always be proud of looking at when I open up the tub on daily rounds not to mention, wouldn't a really nice Enchi be more likely to continue to produce more really nice Enchis. Why would spend the money on a lower quality animal and then go with the chance that hey, maybe it will give you a gem eventually. :/
Exactly. Well said.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TessadasExotics
Enchi's are one of those morphs that looks really don't matter when it comes to breeding.
Sure, an ugly enchi COULD produce hot enchis. But why wouldn't you wanna start with a hot enchi that produces more nicer looking babies for you...? Quality in, quality out. :gj:
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Out of those two, I would pass and wait for 2013's to hatch and get a really nice one. Me personally would never just "settle" for an ok Enchi. There are just to many ugly ones out there, imo. Start with a really hot one instead.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TessadasExotics
FYI ugly enchi's can and do throw HOT looking enchi's. Enchi's are one of those morphs that looks really don't matter when it comes to breeding.
I kind of agree as I see Enchi's being pretty random as far as looks go. I produced two clutches last year from a fairly average looking male Enchi and some of the babies were far better looking than others. I've been watching Enchi's for many years now as they are one of my favorite morphs and the trend seems to be pretty consistent.
One interesting thing is that I produced three Enchi Butters and the Enchi influence in these combos seemed much more consistent than the other normal Enchi offspring. Obviously it's a very limited sample but kind of interesting I guess...
With all that being said, a good Enchi shouldn't cost too much more than a less attractive example...and I have a feeling there's gonna be plenty of them coming available in the next several months...:)
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterKyte
Everyone always uses this excuse to justify buying poor examples of morphs and I don't see why. I wouldn't want anything in my collection/breeding group that I wouldn't always be proud of looking at when I open up the tub on daily rounds not to mention, wouldn't a really nice Enchi be more likely to continue to produce more really nice Enchis. Why would spend the money on a lower quality animal and then go with the chance that hey, maybe it will give you a gem eventually. :/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
Sure, an ugly enchi COULD produce hot enchis. But why wouldn't you wanna start with a hot enchi that produces more nicer looking babies for you...? Quality in, quality out. :gj:
Anyone who breeds Enchi's will probably tell you the same. Sorry but who really buys ugly animals to breed? Not many. Just about everyone looks for what they think looks good or the best. Yes some people will look for the cheapest price available. Yet how many "ugly" animals can you find? Look at any ugly or phenomenal enchi's parents and you will see it's true. I have seen the UGLIEST Enchis consistently throw out superb babies.
I to look for the best quality in my animals, but unfortunately that does NOT guarantee quality looking babies. "Really nice enchi's" do not continually produce more really nice enchis over the ugly breeders. It's not a maybe or by chance issue. It is very common.
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
I want proof. I don't believe you lol. Show me hot enchis that are throwing ugly babies or show me ugly enchis that are throwing hot babies, consistently. What's bothering me is that you're talking like this is all FACT. And i think you're just bs-ing me.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
I want proof. I don't believe you lol. Show me hot enchis that are throwing ugly babies or show me ugly enchis that are throwing hot babies, consistently. What's bothering me is that you're talking like this is all FACT. And i think you're just bs-ing me.
2x
Also, am I the only one baffled by the fact that people will always swear left and right that ugly Pastels will produce more ugly Pastel yet when you apply the same logic other morphs, they'll guarantee that it doesn't matter??? Not saying that's the case here but I've observed that logic enough in the past to raise an eyebrow.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
I want proof. I don't believe you lol. Show me hot enchis that are throwing ugly babies or show me ugly enchis that are throwing hot babies, consistently. What's bothering me is that you're talking like this is all FACT. And i think you're just bs-ing me.
You would be amazed. Seriously, ask any enchi breeder. If they tell you that ugly enchis produce only ugly enchis or that smoking hot enchis don't produce ugly babies then they are lying. Not saying that ugly ones dont throw any ugly ones, and not saying that hot ones don't throw hot looking babies. What I am saying is that it doesn't really matter what the enchi looks like, they both will produce each.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
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Originally Posted by DooLittle
Anybody think he will make ugly babies??
I am willing to bet you that that enchi will throw out ugly babies. Like I have said, I have seen UGLY enchies make the perfect babies.
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sho220
Post pics of the parents
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Sho, what did the mother look like on that clutch. The father isn't the only thing that will influence the look of the kids!
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
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Well, I do get your point and the parents both look really nice but like I'm still pretty convinced that probably in the next ten years, that male will throw you more high quality Enchis than low quality ones.
What is this, just like two hatchlings out of a whole clutch?
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sho220
I would say he's an average looking enchi. Neither of those babies he produced are really hot. This proves my point.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Here's the original hatching thread...3 normal Enchis...all 3 look different...
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...bation-problem
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sho220
Well in all honesty, if you think you had an incubation issue then that kinda negates the validity of your previous post lol.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
I would say he's an average looking enchi. Neither of those babies he produced are really hot. This proves my point.
He's most certainly an average Enchi. A few of his babies were what I'd consider above average though. keep in mind, Enchi's are hard to photograph...especially with a cheapo camera...that clean pattered Enchi baby above was pretty darn nice looking in person...I personally would consider her a hotty...:)
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
Well in all honesty, if you think you had an incubation issue then that kinda negates the validity of your previous post lol.
I never did figure out what the deal was with that. I'm still sticking to Enchi's are random...much like Spiders...
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sho220
It says you had a temp problem here so now I must admit that I have to take this example with a grain of salt here. But looking through this whole clutch, with maybe exception of that wildly patterned one (Who I'm not seeing the Enchi in to be honest) it doesn't look like random quality here. I can see where the dad passed on his traits and the Stingerbee and the better quality Enchi hatchling are both of the same quality as dad in my book.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
I would say he's an average looking enchi. Neither of those babies he produced are really hot. This proves my point.
I think the dad is pretty okay actually? He doesn't meet the whole criteria and is lacking in the colour department but he's not the worse I've seen. Just a nice standard. The first baby wasn't very nice (I'm like kind of shaky on if that's even an Enchi now??? Like is it just me because it looks like a normal, I'm not seeing it) but the second was better and does indeed have that similar look of the dad.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterKyte
It says you had a temp problem here so now I must admit that I have to take this example with a grain of salt here. But looking through this whole clutch, with maybe exception of that wildly patterned one (Who I'm not seeing the Enchi in to be honest) it doesn't look like random quality here. I can see where the dad passed on his traits and the Stingerbee and the better quality Enchi hatchling are both of the same quality as dad in my book.
I think the dad is pretty okay actually? He doesn't meet the whole criteria and is lacking in the colour department but he's not the worse I've seen. Just a nice standard. The first baby wasn't very nice (I'm like kind of shaky on if that's even an Enchi now??? Like is it just because it looks like a normal, I'm not seeing it) but the second was better and does indeed have that similar look of the dad.
Temp problem was a guess. Don't really know for sure what happened. And the "shaky" baby was indeed an Enchi. They are hard to photograph. In person, there was no doubt...
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Personally, anyones allowed to think whatever they want. Idrc.
I only have a problem with tessadas stating her opinion (which was a bit of a stretch imo) like its a fact, yet she provides no evidence to back it up.
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
"Hard to photograph" is an excuse for lesser quality imo. Doolittle could post pics of her enchi at any age, you're never gunna have to double take, thinking its a normal. Its a nicer enchi, and its going to produce nicer babies, imho.
You know, i really can't wait for travis to see this thread. He's gunna be so disappointed when he finds out that all
his hot enchi stuff is going to make ugly babies.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
Personally, anyones allowed to think whatever they want. Idrc.
I only have a problem with tessadas stating her opinion (which was a bit of a stretch imo) like its a fact, yet she provides no evidence to back it up.
You can think/believe what ever you want and that is your entitlement. I can not say from experience yet as we have only recently gotten into enchis our selves and have not done any breedings yet with them. Next year. I have though been to quite a few different breeders place and seen what they use and what they produce. They also swear by the randomness of the babies. I have seen some of the bigger breeders use enchis that I would never even consider using in a million years. I will not post pictures of their animals even if I had then to do. They are not mine.
Quote:
You know, i really can't wait for travis to see this thread. He's gunna be so disappointed when he finds out that all
his hot enchi stuff is going to make ugly babies.
And your trying to make it out that I am saying hot looking enchis will never produce hot babies. Not what I am saying at all.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike41793
"Hard to photograph" is an excuse for lesser quality imo.
And on that note, I'm done...
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Which bigger breeders are you referring to?
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sho220
And on that note, I'm done...
I'm not hating, i'm just saying if you have to stop and think "is that an enchi or a normal...?", then it isnt high quality imo. I feel like it would have been the same in any lighting.
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Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TessadasExotics
And your trying to make it out that I am saying hot looking enchis will never produce hot babies. Not what I am saying at all.
No thats not what i was saying... I'll be eating crow if his snakes prove me wrong, but i highly doubt his enchis will make ugly enchi babies. We'll see.
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Re: Enchi girls- which would you choose?
Idk, personally I'm of the opinion that quality begets quality so I'm personally be looking for the best examples of morphs in all my future purchases.
I would be interested to see an actual "study" on this argument, but honestly I feel the whole throwing nice *and* ugly babies is simply because snakes have LOTS of different genes that come into play. I feel if you started with hot snakes and kept holding back the offspring and breeding them to snakes that compliment the traits you desire, you will "weed out" the undesirable traits over generations. Improving the bloodline essentially.
Sent from microwave via Tapatalk ll
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Well I can't take a position on what my enchi babies will look like unless I actually start producing them, but I know that Ed @ Wildmorphs produces some freakn SEXY enchis consistently enough. I'm really glad you posted pictures, sho, because most people just take a side without offering any real evidence in regards to ball python husbandry and breeding.. I'm taking the "quality in, quality out" side when dealing with enchis because I'm hopeful that the stinger I got from Ed makes me more hot enchis and enchi combos that have that golden look to them, and because I've followed his posts and videos enough to be a believer.
Why not get the best example you can in order to produce the best. It's not always up to the single parent either. Pairing a super reduced enchi to a busy patterned normal isn't the smartest idea if you'e going for reduced pattern enchis. You have to be wise and pick the best parents to PAIR. Tiffany and Marissa have amazing single gene animals in their collection, and they chose them specifically for the traits they wanted. That's intelligent breeding :gj:.
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