GTP vs. ETB

So I'm looking at getting a tree snake and can't decide between a Green Tree Python and an Emerald Tree Boa. I want something active, low temperament, about the size of a Ball Python (maybe a little bigger), and something that eats well. Any suggestions?

I've never kept either personally, but from working in a place that required me to care for both, I'd definitely go with a GTP if one of your concerns is temperament. The place I volunteered at had some very tame animals (they were used for educational purposes) but their ETBs were either very aggressive or very nervous/twitchy compared to GTPs who had been at the facility for similar amounts of times. The ETBs also didn't seem to eat as well as the GTPs. I could just be biased though since I lean towards pythons over boas in general. :P

Green Tree Python all the way!! ETBs are pretty, but they can be temperamental, and husbandry must be absolutely just so. Sometimes, ETBs can just up and die for no apparent reason even if husbandry is perfect. They are known for having feeding issues too.

My GTP is puppy-dog tame, NEVER misses a meal, and is very forgiving of minor husbandry errors. You will be very happy with a GTP!! But I do suggest that you get a yearling or young adult for your first. You will not be sorry. Neonates can be extremely fragile - just picking them up can break a spine - and are much less forgiving of husbandry until they are older. And you can be more assured of temperament with a better established animal.

This is my adult male GTP, Hunter....

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/...ons/Hunter.jpg


And being handled by his breeder's 8 year old son....

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/...thons/wes1.jpg

I'm going to have to vote for a GTP as well. Just got my first one, and I am smitten. Can't wait until I can handle him, I wound up with a neo, because I couldn't find what I wanted as an adult or juvie. But he is so freaking cool. And he definitely is a whole different ball game from balls or boas.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/03/24/muryqesy.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/03/24/eqadyva4.jpg

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I'm actually in the process of making the same decision. I keep going back and forth and can't seem to make up my mind. From the research I've done and people I've talked to, I eliminated the ETB. I'm debating between a GTP and ATB. You should also take a look at the ATB for your first arboreal snake, they seem to be the most forgiving of minor husbandry mistakes. If I do go with a GTP, I'm gonna go with a yearling or adult.

Keep us updated on whatever you decide and post some pics! Good luck!

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Originally Posted by chaseg22

I'm actually in the process of making the same decision. I keep going back and forth and can't seem to make up my mind. From the research I've done and people I've talked to, I eliminated the ETB. I'm debating between a GTP and ATB. You should also take a look at the ATB for your first arboreal snake, they seem to be the most forgiving of minor husbandry mistakes. If I do go with a GTP, I'm gonna go with a yearling or adult.

Keep us updated on whatever you decide and post some pics! Good luck!

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Actually, husbandry for GTPs is often overthought. I find them no harder to care for than my boas or balls. In fact, thanks to their feeding response, they are easier than my BPs. With the proper cage, humidity is a non-issue. And we use an RHP for the heat source since these are arboreal snakes and a UTH is less appropriate. They also prefer a more horizontal cage rather than vertical - they will move side to side on their perches to thermoregulate rather than up and down. But their care is really a piece of cake! :gj:

I second a young adult gtp. My first gtp was a young biak that suddenly died. It was incredibly nippy and would bite me every chance it got. It was in no way a friendly snake. My current I got as a young adult Aru and though he will still have grumpy days and has tagged me he is a dream compared to my first. As long as mine is fed and not startled I can reach right in and pull him out. Once he is out I completely trust him and he will crawl all around my neck and head.

I Am lucky in the fact I work nights so on my nights off I get the chance to watch my snakes actually move around. He never disappoints and uses his whole cage. I Usually have to straighten his plants because he crawls through them and turns them sideways most nights.

I too do not find the husbandry hard as long as you set the cage up right. Evenstar turned me to pvccages.com and I love the cage I got. I went with the 24/20 which came assembled and ready out of the box. It also took less than three weeks to get from the order date. I ordered it with a light, perches, and rhp.

http://www.pvccages.com/new/?wpsc-pr...-20d-assembled

http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/...ps35daecfc.jpg

With every shed he reveals more blue, which I love.

http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/...psa8213cca.jpg

Some day I want one. For now I live vicariously through the pictures you guys post. Gorgeous snakes! And I have the water bowl for my BP KMG.

Whatever you decide to get, bombard us with pictures please. :)

awesome gtp's guys!!

I have an Aru chondro that is super mellow, easy to handle, feeds super easy on frozen / thawed and poses for photos better than any other snake that I have owned. He is an amazing pet and display animal! My Jade line chondro is also mellow, gorgeous and easy to feed frozen / thawed, but she is an oddball that usually prefers curling up on the floor of her cage to perching. Oh well! Still a joy to have in My collection! Mine are both captive bred, and I think that is an important thing to look for in whichever species you choose.

Got this pic today with my point and shoot. I know it's not top notch but it beats my usual phone pics. It really picked up his blue.


http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/...ps9921e868.jpg

I LOVE EMERALDS!!! They are one of my vary favorite snakes. IMO they have much nicer colors than gtp. That being said they really aren't for beginners. They have questionable temperaments for the most part and need more time and care to keep them successfully. It's a big part of why you see so many gtp's compared to etb's. there are both amazing snakes, but if you have limited experience you'll probably find you have more success at least starting with gtp's

ETB husbandry doesn't scare me; their teeth do.

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Thanks for all of the responses everyone. :) I think I've finally made a decision, and I'm gonna go with the Green Tree Python. I gotta build a cage and get everything set up perfect before I get one though and that could take awhile. There is one thing I'm gonna have to go against though. If I'm gonna spend $400 on a snake I want to get a baby while it's still red so I can watch it change colors as it gets older. I understand I'll have to be extremely careful while handling it, if I get it out at all. One question though, what would you feed a snake that has a head the size of a dime or smaller?

Mine eats mouse pinks. Neo feeding can be tricky too. And if you get a neo, I would not handle it until its a year old.

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What's a neo?

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Originally Posted by Brad91

What's a neo?

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Neonate.

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

Neonate.

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= Baby snake. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Brad91

Thanks for all of the responses everyone. :) I think I've finally made a decision, and I'm gonna go with the Green Tree Python. I gotta build a cage and get everything set up perfect before I get one though and that could take awhile. There is one thing I'm gonna have to go against though. If I'm gonna spend $400 on a snake I want to get a baby while it's still red so I can watch it change colors as it gets older. I understand I'll have to be extremely careful while handling it, if I get it out at all. One question though, what would you feed a snake that has a head the size of a dime or smaller?

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First off, congrats!! You will not be sorry and you'll really enjoy a GTP. They are amazing animals!

But, and I can not stress this enough, I HIGHLY recommend you start with a juvenile or young adult. Neonates are extremely fragile. You can break their spine just picking them up. This is why most people don't handle them AT ALL for the first year at least. They can also be very hard to feed. Sometimes they have to be assist-fed. Neos are generally better left to someone with GTP experience or a LOT of general snake experience (and if you have that, forgive me, it's impossible to know personal details about everyone on these forums, lol, but just based on what you've shared thus far, I did not get that impression. I apologize if I'm wrong).

As far as what a GTP neo would eat, they can eat pinky or even hopper mice right from the egg. But the younger they are, the harder it is to feed them. MANY breeders have neos in almost every clutch that never do eat. DO NOT buy a baby that hasn't eaten at LEAST 1/2 a dozen times!!

Lastly, it's not impossible, but it is very very hard to find a RED neo at or under $400. Be prepared to spend $600 or even double that or more for a red neo. You may well find a yellow neo for less than that, but GTPs are high demand animals so it's hard.

Personally, I would check with Ryan Burke of Clockwork Reptiles (he's on Facebook). He has some very nice GTPs IF you have your heart set on a neo. Ryan's neos are well-started and eating well at the time of sale. And he sometimes has yellow neos for $375 and up. Occasionally he offers red neos for around $450 and up. He is a great guy to work with. Doolittle purchased her recent neo from Ryan and I'm sure she'll chime in on that.

Allie Watson is another great person to buy from. Look up AllieCat Watson on Facebook and she's on iHerp too. I got our recent yearling GTP from her and I am extremely happy with the snake and with the whole transaction. Allie was fantastic to work with and I'd buy from her again in a heartbeat.

Good luck! :gj:

I second buying a young adult. The color change is nice to see but you live with the end result.

It is possible though to get a young gtp that is well established that has not started the color change but not so fragile. Still fragile but not like fresh out of the egg.This is how I bought my first. I had her a few months and then the change started but I lost her. Or maybe you can find one starting to change.

But buying a young adult can make the experience much more pleasant since you can have a good idea of what your actually getting.

Temperament is a known quantity with an young adult too!! :gj:

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

Lastly, it's not impossible, but it is very very hard to find a RED neo at or under $400. Be prepared to spend $600 or even double that or more for a red neo. You may well find a yellow neo for less than that, but GTPs are high demand animals so it's hard.

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I found a little red one at a pet store about 20 minutes from home for $400. It's the same pet store where I get my feeders and he keeps all of his reptiles in amazing condition, he breeds his own BP's there even. I'd hate to get a little one and lose it though... Along with all of that money... That's a paycheck for me... Any suggestions on how small I could safely go? I got my BP's at about 150g and never had a problem.

I would make sure its captive born and bred here in the USA. Many pet stores get farm raises wild captured eggs or from wild caught adults. The problem with those is they can be full of parasites and have much nastier attitudes.

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Originally Posted by Brad91

I found a little red one at a pet store about 20 minutes from home for $400. It's the same pet store where I get my feeders and he keeps all of his reptiles in amazing condition, he breeds his own BP's there even. I'd hate to get a little one and lose it though... Along with all of that money... That's a paycheck for me... Any suggestions on how small I could safely go? I got my BP's at about 150g and never had a problem.

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Does he breed the GTPs himself too? If not, can he garauntee where it came from - as in who bred it?? If not, it is almost certainly a farmed animal or from wild-caught parents. The most important piece of advice I can give you is to only buy a GTP from a reputable breeder! It is even more important to do this with GTPs because there are so many farmed animals out there and there is little documentation on them.

I understand about the money. $400 is a lot for me too. But that's why its even more important to buy from a reputable breeder - even if you have to pay a little more up front. You'll spend less in the long run. I mentioned both Ryan and Allie earlier because they are very reasonable and have excellent captive bred and born stock with documented lineage.

GTPs are not ball pythons. Just because you can raise a tiny baby ball doesn't mean you'll do well with a baby GTP. I have raised numerous boas starting with babies as young as 6 weeks old and only at 110gm and I am hesitant to raise a neo GTP. You are best off starting with a yearling. You'll still see a lot of color changes.

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Originally Posted by KMG

I would make sure its captive born and bred here in the USA. Many pet stores get farm raises wild captured eggs or from wild caught adults. The problem with those is they can be full of parasites and have much nastier attitudes.

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Exactly.

I have raised balls and boas, from 80 gram babies. They are NOTHING like the itty bitty neo gtp I just got (a December 2012). He is from Ryan at Clockwork, who was great to do business with. He was well started, and feeding him is absolutely nothing, like any snake I have ever had. I have had a corn, have 7 balls, and two boas. While I do have snake experience, he is still a learning experience for me. The jump from balls to boas was nothing. But to a gtp, he's a whole different ball of wax. He is doing well, and I have got him to eat for me every week so far, but I won't lie that I am scared I will mess something up. I definitely would not just jump into them, especially with minimal experience. Or you may very well lose your $400 investment. If you planning on getting a gtp, you need to get and read the book The More Complete Chondro.


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The More Complete Chondro is now available on Kindle for alot less than trying to find the hard copy.

Yes!!! Do get that book! It is fabulous! And the kindle version is much cheaper. :gj:

I ran across this pic on google images and thought it was great. Really shows how small and fragile they can be.

http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0ab020d7.jpg

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Originally Posted by KMG

I ran across this pic on google images and thought it was great. Really shows how small and fragile they can be.

http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0ab020d7.jpg

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This is the cutest thing EVAR!

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I find both are quite easy to keep. Everyone is just too intimidated by the stories that are out there. Keep them as the breeder has and you'll have no issues. Been keeping Emeralds since 2003 and breeding them since 2008.

Here's a few of the gang.

http://gallery.pethobbyist.com/data/...4-9-12_001.JPG

http://gallery.pethobbyist.com/data/...nis_1-7-12.jpg

http://gallery.pethobbyist.com/data/...res_3-4-10.jpg

I have already decided to get a GTP! ETB are stunners but in many ways seem to be the more difficult to care for (at least from all I have read!) tell us what you end up getting.