If the BP natural range is south of the Saharan Desert, what is a sub-Saharan?

So I've been seeing sub-Saharan ball pythons for sale on kingsnake. What on earth are these supposed to be? I guess I'm confused because the natural range for ball pythons is south of the Saharan desert... I'm afraid it is a way to market your normals in a way, promising they'll grow huge... one day... :please:


http://www.inlandreptile.com/images/...gius%20map.jpg

Maybe another way to market wild ones?

Hi,

It's a name used to distinguish snakes from a specific locale. The other name for them is "Volta" if I remember correctly.

They do indeed grow substantially larger than regular ball pythons. Their heads are huge in comparison to normals and they lay bigger clutches as well.

The last part appeals to those who are chasing long odds on a combo.

It's a personal choice but I'd far more intrested in preserving them as a seperate line until it is proven there are no genetic differences worthy of calling them a subspecies or an official local variant. Unfortunately I can't find anyone selling them over here. :(

But they are definitely different enough to be marketed as such.


dr del

Because there are locality specific ball pythons that DO get larger than normal. I own one. Although she's not a giant yet, she has the potential. At 5'6" long and 3600 grams after a 7 month fast, she is quite large by ball python standards. But more than that, she looks different. Her head and neck are much larger and thicker than the average ball, even one as big as her. I have seen pictures of some massive girls. They are reported to grow in excess of 8' and weigh over 8000 grams. I have never seen one that large in person, but several members here have.

I believe Deborah or Robin one has a photograph of a giant, the ball python's head is larger than a human hand. I think NERD has one or more, as does Ralph Davis and a few other big names.

Here are some comparison pictures of my two females.

This first one shows them side by side. The darker girl is the Ghana or sub-saharan.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/IMG_0029.jpg

In these pictures, you can see the very noticeable difference in the size of their heads and necks.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/IMG_0028.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/IMG_0027.jpg

This is despite the fact that the lighter girl is a solid 8" longer and weighs 300 grams more. I have hopes that once I get my Ghana to eat regularly for me, she'll gain even more size. She certainly has the potential.

Gale

I wonder if that's what I have...? Sorry for the crappy pic... I got her as a Normal but we all thought 'gosh her head is huge' compared to others...?
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/27/guzerezy.jpg


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Good golly, Kimbly! How long have you had her and how big is she?

Great. Something else to add to the never ending wish list. On a side note, has anyone seen a male for sale?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gsarchie

Good golly, Kimbly! How long have you had her and how big is she?

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I have only had her a short time... She's still in QT with the rest of the group I got her with (the pairing pics I just posted show all of her better). The guy I got her from said he thinks she's 3 or 4 years old. She's 3100g, and honestly I haven't even measured her length yet.... :)

I just measured her... The tape measure was out 5ft.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/27/vu9a6u6u.jpg


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OP I understand your confusion, I have no idea why they call them sub Saharan, since as you stated the entire natural location of ball pythons is inside the enormous area called sub Saharan, its not really being very specific at all.

But as stated above, what they call sub Saharan.... they get huge.

I'd call her a giant, Kimbly.

She sure has the head for it. Are you breeding her this year? If so, please keep me in mind for a male hatchling. From what little I read about these animals, any hatchling that is over 100 grams is considered a giant. For sure if you hatch a few males that big, I'd love one! Even if it's a normal.

It's awesome we are finally seeing more of these amazing big girls.

I think the main reason we don't really see males with the same label is that females get bigger anyway, so naturally you are drawn to the visually bigger females. Although, I've heard from one or two people who claim to own 6' males, and it would not surprise me if the snake is a male and is 6' that it's a giant as well.

My hope is to one day see if the offspring from these massive girls can be selectively bred for the size. Can you imagine a 7000 gram pied ? A 7000 gram bumblebee? And with the massive clutches these girls are known for, what a treat to get maybe 9 or 10 babies with the potential to get that big!

Gale

Quote:

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Originally Posted by angllady2

I'd call her a giant, Kimbly.

She sure has the head for it. Are you breeding her this year? If so, please keep me in mind for a male hatchling. From what little I read about these animals, any hatchling that is over 100 grams is considered a giant. For sure if you hatch a few males that big, I'd love one! Even if it's a normal.

It's awesome we are finally seeing more of these amazing big girls.

I think the main reason we don't really see males with the same label is that females get bigger anyway, so naturally you are drawn to the visually bigger females. Although, I've heard from one or two people who claim to own 6' males, and it would not surprise me if the snake is a male and is 6' that it's a giant as well.

My hope is to one day see if the offspring from these massive girls can be selectively bred for the size. Can you imagine a 7000 gram pied ? A 7000 gram bumblebee? And with the massive clutches these girls are known for, what a treat to get maybe 9 or 10 babies with the potential to get that big!

Gale

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Thanks you! :) yes, I am breeding her and the other female from that group, both are similarly sized (3100g and I think 2900g); but the girl pictured above is definitely the bigger one, with the KillerBee and Fire. I'm excited to see what they produce! I will keep you posted! :)


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Our gravid sub saharan girl from Outback just laid a clutch of 11 flawless fertile eggs last weekend. We plan on holding back probably half of that but be on the lookout for 5-6 C.H. Giant hatchlings in 50 days or so :gj:. As per the OPs question, its exactly as OWOL said, the name sub-saharan doesn't make any since but it refers to these giant BPs.

LOL its a marketing ploy. ALL ball pythons are from the Sub Sahara. They use this name for the larger ball pythons.

We have a few. Our fave girl is over 4kg.

I have 4 of these "Volta" females, They look noticeably different than a normal. Not just in size (they are all over 3000g) but the heads are huge. It's as if you were to compare a Pit Bull to a Lab.