breeding problems

okay so i have my ball python collection, i have been trying to breed 4 of of my females that are all over 2,000grams. i have been putting my males with them for the last two years and nothing, i dont get eggs, i dont get anything. what am i doing wrong?

i have them in a rack from animal plastics and i have the temps set at 90 during the day and 86 at night.

can someone please help me out, my dad is freaking out because we have spent well over 20k on all the snakes i have and i havent been able to get 1 clutch out of them.

the females im trying to breed now are

0.1 normal over 4,000g to a desert male thats about 600-700g
0.1 normal a little over 3,000g to the same desert male
0.1 piebald 3,000g to a male piebald about 1000 grams
0.1 woma about 2,000 grams to the same desert male above.

since i am using the desert for many projects i do give him breaks when switching tubs. 3 days on and 6 days off and then he goes to a different female.

please help me out, ive had these snakes for over 5 years and im freaking out because i havent gotten any eggs.

Are you sure they are sexed correctly?

they are deff sex correctly. my really good friend work in a reptile shop which i have bought most of my snakes from and he sexed them for me years ago.

Hi,

Do you get any signs of breeding at all? Like tracks on the substrate or locks or tailwagging or building?

Have the snakes re-sexed anyway. It never hurts.

Did you cool any of the snakes down?

Do you know about the breeding problems with desert females which may affect the price you can sell them at?


dr del

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Originally Posted by dr del

Hi,

Do you get any signs of breeding at all? Like tracks on the substrate or locks or tailwagging or building?

Have the snakes re-sexed anyway. It never hurts.

Did you cool any of the snakes down?

Do you know about the breeding problems with desert females which may affect the price you can sell them at?


dr del

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no i dont see any signs of that especially that i only go into their tubs once a week to give fresh water and fresh newspaper.

ive had them sexed a dozen times lol.

i havent done that, my friend who has been breeding ball pythons for at least 20 years told me not to do that so they dont get resp.

yes i do know about the infertile desert females. i have a desert male that im trying to breed to a normal female.

I don't know about the pied, but is your male desert producing sperm plugs? If he's not sexually mature, he won't breed.

How are you sexing your snakes? Pop each one of them to see if you can get hemipenes.

Have you seen visual locks at all?

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Originally Posted by satomi325

I don't know about the pied, but is your male desert producing sperm plugs? If he's not sexually mature, he won't breed.

How are you sexing your snakes? Pop each one of them to see if you can get hemipenes.

Have you seen visual locks at all?

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yeah he has sperm plugs already.

my friend probes and pops them.

i havent seen any locks.

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Originally Posted by ladizzle

yeah he has sperm plugs already.

my friend probes and pops them.

i havent seen any locks.

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Worries me you haven't seen any locks at all. DO you have any other males you can use to see which side the problem is? I am leaning towards a sexually immature male and not 4 different big sized females. I know you have some money in the male, but do you have another male you can rotate through to get locks and confirm the male is not ready? Are you females tail wagging and marking at all?

I would try a different male.

When you put any of your snakes together, do they fight or wrestle?

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Originally Posted by Joshua Jasper

Worries me you haven't seen any locks at all. DO you have any other males you can use to see which side the problem is? I am leaning towards a sexually immature male and not 4 different big sized females. I know you have some money in the male, but do you have another male you can rotate through to get locks and confirm the male is not ready? Are you females tail wagging and marking at all?

I would try a different male.

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no i havent seen any wagging or marking.

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Originally Posted by satomi325

When you put any of your snakes together, do they fight or wrestle?

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nope, they just lay there.

Can you post pictures of them?

This all sounds really weird to me. They are easy to breed, and I don't cool mine. Some of mine start wagging and scenting the second I introduce them. I wouldn't be surprised if one of your females didn't breed, but all of them, that is weird. You are getting a lot of questions that sound silly or obvious, but to be honest, I've never heard of anyone having that much trouble breeding BPs so I'm wondering the same things everyone else is asking.

What are your cold side temps?

How old are the females?

I second the suggestion of posting pics.

Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2

I know cooling is not required but it has been a very warm winter this year in Florida. There really is no change in seasons in Miami so who knows maybe their biological clock never cycled to "breeding mode".

I agree with the others though regarding the pics and this being weird.

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Originally Posted by SlitherinSisters

This all sounds really weird to me. They are easy to breed, and I don't cool mine. Some of mine start wagging and scenting the second I introduce them. I wouldn't be surprised if one of your females didn't breed, but all of them, that is weird. You are getting a lot of questions that sound silly or obvious, but to be honest, I've never heard of anyone having that much trouble breeding BPs so I'm wondering the same things everyone else is asking.

What are your cold side temps?

How old are the females?

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the cold temps at night are 83-85 for 12 hrs

the females are from 3-5 years old

what is it that you would like pictures of?

i know the snakes obviously but anything in particular?

This may sound like as easy question but no one else has asked.
Are you keeping the Desert with the females all the time? That may be stressing him out if you are. As long as you're keeping him with one female for a few days then giving him a break for a week or so before rotating to the next female. I don't see what else the problem could be unless he doesn't realize its "time" for him to breed since you didn't cycle them. (or at least drop temps a few degrees). Or maybe he's infertile?
I had a 1000 gram Bumblebee male that WOULD NOT breed for me in 2011. I did not cycle my snakes and he was supposedly a "proven breeder". I assume that's what the problem was, although I don't know for sure. Cycling them next year may be a good idea. It doesnt take but a few degrees, so RIs shouldn't be an issue.

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Originally Posted by ladizzle

the cold temps at night are 83-85 for 12 hrs

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Just to clarify - Do you have a 90deg hot spot that you drop to 86deg at night (even though you said you don't cycle them), and your ambient temps are 83-85deg, or are you heating the whole room to 90deg and letting it cool to ~86deg at night? Or am I more confused that I think I am? If you have a 90deg hot spot and 85deg ambient, then you really aren't providing much of a gradient. Drop your ambient temps to ~80deg at all times and keep a 90deg hot spot.

I agree with Annarose, I don't understand your temps after reading your post. I used to keep my BPs at 90 and had some produce slugs. After researching, I lowered my hot spot to 87 -88 and no more slugs. The ambient temps in my room stay around 75 degrees. The room is temperature and humidity controlled. I do not night drop. My opinion is that it leaves the snakes open for RIs, but some people do it. I'd rather have a steady temperature than one that goes up and down. I do have a cooling period where I drop the temps a few degrees (October through February). The temps go down and stay there, no fluctuations (I drop the temps gradually and raise them slowly).

You said that one of your males is producing sperm plugs. You might want to take some of those plugs and wipe them on the back of a female that is in with a different male. Sometimes that will stimulate the males to breed. If you are not seeing locks, then something may be wrong with the setup. Use a temp gun to verify the temperatures. Rotate the males through for three or four days, then give them a break for a few days. Once they get the hang of it, you'll see locks frequently. Also, I find I get locks quicker if I pop the male before putting him in with the female.

Yeah, an issue with temps was the first thing I could think of besides being sexed properly. I would imagine it would be pretty hard to get them not to breed, even if you kept them together all the time and stressed them out.

Just as a frame of reference. I keep my breeding females hot side at 88 and the cool side at 75, these are constant 24/7 temps. Last year I let it drop to 70, but ended up with RI in a couple snakes, this year I have it at 75 and have no issues with them breeding. You may be keeping them too hot. If they can't thermoregulate to cooler temperatures I would imagine that they would have issues building/getting ready for eggs. Maybe even cause them to reabsorb eggs if they do get that far?

One other thing to consider.

Since you don't cool they may not breed at the time you expect and introduce your males.

Have you tried palpating the females to see if they are ever developing follicles?

I know mine breed at different times of the year most of the time.


dr del

In my opinion temps are too high. During the breeding season my ambient room temps range from 68-75. I keep the basking spot the same year-round in the upper 80s. I have several females that have ovulated in the last few days and two female carpets that have had their pre-lay sheds. Lower your ambient temps to the low to mid 70s and you will probably see some action.

Here's a few things to consider that may help you:

Since you aren't cooling you're going to have to stay on top of palpating the girls to know when they're ready for the male. You can't just throw him in any time you want and expect a successful breeding.

Adding a shed skin from another male may encourage your desert to breed. It's a trick I've used a few times with reluctant males and it usually helps. You could also try actually adding another male in there with the desert and the girl, keep a close eye on them for a few, then remove the second male. The second method is a little more stressful, especially for the male you aren't keeping in there to breed, but I've done it more than once with excellent results.

If I think of anything else I'll return and post, but as long as your husbandry is spot on and the male is mature it's most likely an issue of timing.

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Originally Posted by Don

You said that one of your males is producing sperm plugs. You might want to take some of those plugs and wipe them on the back of a female that is in with a different male. Sometimes that will stimulate the males to breed.

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Also, this^.

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Originally Posted by BallChick

This may sound like as easy question but no one else has asked.
Are you keeping the Desert with the females all the time? That may be stressing him out if you are. As long as you're keeping him with one female for a few days then giving him a break for a week or so before rotating to the next female. I don't see what else the problem could be unless he doesn't realize its "time" for him to breed since you didn't cycle them. (or at least drop temps a few degrees). Or maybe he's infertile?
I had a 1000 gram Bumblebee male that WOULD NOT breed for me in 2011. I did not cycle my snakes and he was supposedly a "proven breeder". I assume that's what the problem was, although I don't know for sure. Cycling them next year may be a good idea. It doesnt take but a few degrees, so RIs shouldn't be an issue.

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cycle?
how many degrees should i drop it?

and yes i give him a break in between females.

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

Just to clarify - Do you have a 90deg hot spot that you drop to 86deg at night (even though you said you don't cycle them), and your ambient temps are 83-85deg, or are you heating the whole room to 90deg and letting it cool to ~86deg at night? Or am I more confused that I think I am? If you have a 90deg hot spot and 85deg ambient, then you really aren't providing much of a gradient. Drop your ambient temps to ~80deg at all times and keep a 90deg hot spot.

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i have them in a rack system. the heat tape from 8am-8pm is 90-91 degrees, then at 8pm to 8am the temp drops to 85-86degrees. the rack is in my living room but the air condition from my house doesnt affect the temps inside the tubs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dr del

One other thing to consider.

Since you don't cool they may not breed at the time you expect and introduce your males.

Have you tried palpating the females to see if they are ever developing follicles?

I know mine breed at different times of the year most of the time.


dr del

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to be honest, i dont know how to palpate, i tried that about a year ago and never got it.

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Originally Posted by ladizzle

to be honest, i dont know how to palpate, i tried that about a year ago and never got it.

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to be able to palpate for the first time you need a mature female with follicle's grow up a bit

okay just so everyone knows, I reset the thermostat to be at 85 degrees all the time. and I guess around late oct to early nov I lower it to around 77?

I don't understand why you're asking for help if you have a friend close by that been breeding ball pythons for 20 years?

I agree the temps are almost certainly too high. I don't change the temps of my heat tape ever, but because I live in MO the weather changes and so my ambient temps do as well. Even my very first year I had locks, and I had no clue what I was doing at first. If your climate doesn't change like mine does, it might be necessary to change your temps on a set schedule.

I find it really hard to understand you haven't had any locks ever, something must be very wrong for that to happen. You don't specify when you pair your snakes. Is there a certain time of year you try, or have you tried at different times of the year to see if that was the reason ?

I understand what works for someone else may not work for you, so I hope we can help you figure this out.

Gale

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Originally Posted by don15681

I don't understand why you're asking for help if you have a friend close by that been breeding ball pythons for 20 years?

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because he is the one that told me to put the temps that high. idkk I needed another opinion after 2 years of not getting any locks or anything.

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Originally Posted by angllady2

I agree the temps are almost certainly too high. I don't change the temps of my heat tape ever, but because I live in MO the weather changes and so my ambient temps do as well. Even my very first year I had locks, and I had no clue what I was doing at first. If your climate doesn't change like mine does, it might be necessary to change your temps on a set schedule.

I find it really hard to understand you haven't had any locks ever, something must be very wrong for that to happen. You don't specify when you pair your snakes. Is there a certain time of year you try, or have you tried at different times of the year to see if that was the reason ?

I understand what works for someone else may not work for you, so I hope we can help you figure this out.

Gale

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well I have just being doing it continuously all year long because I didn't know when it was going to happen since I had the temps the same all year long.

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Originally Posted by ladizzle

because he is the one that told me to put the temps that high. idkk I needed another opinion after 2 years of not getting any locks or anything.

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There are a bunch of breeders in South Florida that you can ask. I am 4 hours north of you and I cool mine. Especially this year as the winter was very warm so I can only imagine your temps were even warmer.

Look up Amir from yellowbellyball.com and give him a call he may be able to give you some better advice based on being in Sfl. Good luck

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Originally Posted by joebad976

There are a bunch of breeders in South Florida that you can ask. I am 4 hours north of you and I cool mine. Especially this year as the winter was very warm so I can only imagine your temps were even warmer.

Look up Amir from yellowbellyball.com and give him a call he may be able to give you some better advice based on being in Sfl. Good luck

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lol I know Amir personally. but I wanted to get a different opinion.

lol figures.....well I cool mine. Starting oct 15 hot spot 82 during day and drop to 78 at night. Do this up until Marc 15 then bring hotspot to constant 82. During the warmer months I run off ambient temps no hotspot.

Can't guarantee this will work for you but it works well for me.

try leaving the male in 4 days my stubborn ball pythons often lock up the 4th day

I'm betting that you're not hitting them at the right time of year. Males (in my little experience) seem to not want to continuously breed. Mine tend to get back to breeding after they have had a month or so break. Females will build follicles at all times of the year.

I don't bother with cooling or cycling temps for mine, either. I would suggest you just keep the females well fed and watch for building behavior. When they start bowl wrapping, introduce the male. Try the 4 days on, 6 days off. Watch for the bowl wrapping; pigging out; cool seeking; scenting; tail wagging; etc...then pair them. Pairing them before any follicle growth just tends to lead to frustration.

Good luck!

okay so I decided to look at my biggest female which is about 4,000 grams and she looks huge and she was wrapped around her bowl. does anyone else see anything that I don't? http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/28/e8aragu8.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/28/5ytabepa.jpg

does anyone have any input on how she looks?

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Originally Posted by ladizzle

okay so i have my ball python collection, i have been trying to breed 4 of of my females that are all over 2,000grams. i have been putting my males with them for the last two years and nothing, i dont get eggs, i dont get anything. what am i doing wrong?

i have them in a rack from animal plastics and i have the temps set at 90 during the day and 86 at night.

can someone please help me out, my dad is freaking out because we have spent well over 20k on all the snakes i have and i havent been able to get 1 clutch out of them.

the females im trying to breed now are

0.1 normal over 4,000g to a desert male thats about 600-700g
0.1 normal a little over 3,000g to the same desert male
0.1 piebald 3,000g to a male piebald about 1000 grams
0.1 woma about 2,000 grams to the same desert male above.

since i am using the desert for many projects i do give him breaks when switching tubs. 3 days on and 6 days off and then he goes to a different female.

please help me out, ive had these snakes for over 5 years and im freaking out because i havent gotten any eggs.

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Okay I am still confused about a couple things so…..

-I know you said that the temps in your living room don’t affect the tub temps but what is the temp f the room the rack is located (on average)? Open or enclosed AP rack system?

-what are you using to read the temps in the cage? Temp gun, thermometer etc… do you know if you have a cool side and hot side inside the tub(24 hours a day, AKA a temp gradient)?

-Do you have a certain time of year that you START putting the mails with the females? Or have you been rotating the male through the females year round the last two years.

Usually when pics are requested they mean pics of your setup and snake to see if there is something that you forgot to mention in your question….and we like to see pics of snakes in general.
Some people drop temps in the winter to stimulate the pythons to breed, but it is not necessary. Basically if your hotspot is set for 90 during the spring and summer then in fall (say Oct) you would drop the hotspot a couple degrees(say 87) ambient(air temp) can stay the same or lower as your room temp drops with the weather. Coming out of winter (say Dec or Jan) you would start putting you snakes together.
pieds are known to be kind of lazy breeders. Hang in there you’ll figure this out.