PVC cage owners! I have some questions.

Well I have a cage that I built that I really like. It is an oak 3/4" oak plywood cage with a CHE heat source. It measures 4'x2'x2'. I use a Herpstat 1 to control it and temps are perfect. 90-92 on hot side and 78-80 on cool. I do have to use cypress as substrate to battle the CHE humidity sucking power. I only have to mist once every week or two in the summer and up to twice a week in winter. Humidity is 50-60%.

So that setup is working but now I want another snake or two. I think I want PVC cages that are 4'x2'x1'. That way I can stack them on my current oak stand to replace my old cage.

My concern is the that I have a cool house. I can't devote a room to snakes unfortunately. My room is 65-68F in winter and up to 73 in summer. I want to use PVC because humidity will be easier to control and I would like to use UTH for my heat source instead of a CHE. Of course I will use my Herpstat for regulation.

Will I have high enough ambient temps in a room that is 68f with only a UTH as a heats source?
Do any of you have PVC cages in rooms close to 68f?
If a second heat source is necessary, what do you use?

My goal is the simplest solution.

I am looking to get the cage at an expo this summer and then run it as a test setup for a week or so to perfect the setup. I just don't want to waste the money if it is going to need heat lamps or a CHE because then I will just forget it and keep what I have.


Thanks. As usual any input or experience is much appreciated.

I guess the first question is what do you intend on keeping in the cage? Different animals obviously require different heat levels. I had a 4x2x1 cage in a room with the ambient temps around those. I had about 2' of 4" heat tape connected to herpstat set to run at 94 degrees and I had no problems at all. I kept a bci in that cage and it did awesome.

Well my BP will move into the first and I would like to add a second fora Nicaraguan Boa another smaller boa in the future. (Just starting to look into a boa it may just be a second ball).

So I need a 90-92f to 78-80f. I know humidity wont be an issue if I using a UTH in a PVC case.

68 shouldn't give you any issues, 65 will be starting to push it. Make sure that you get a cage with 1/2" PVC walls and not the thinner 1/4" or 1/8" walls as they won't hold in nearly as much heat as 1/2" walls will. You will want to use 2 18" fluorescent lights in each cage to help boost the air temps, and keep the cages on the humid side. You want to keep them humid because the water in the air will help to transfer heat from the fluorescent lights and even the floor of the cage over the heat tape into the air in the cage.

I haven't seen any cages that thick at the expos or shops here in Canada. I live in Timmins Ontario but I planning on getting down to an expo or two this summer. We are moving to a new house this year so I may be able to get a room that is more around 70ish. Would that help?

For humidity I will continue using Cypress or another substrate that keeps humidity in check.

I forgot to mention I wanted to use a t5 fluorescent for 12 hours daylight and blue LED's for night viewing.

Does anyone have the 1/4" PVC cages in cooler rooms and how do they work for you?

Or anyone in Canada know where to get 1/2" PVC cages at a decent price? The guys in Sudbury want $375 for a cage I can get for $249 at a shop down south or at an expo.

No I have not seen anything here but 3/8 or 1/4 pvcx I use sly plastics from Montreal they are reasonable at holding heat. The thing to remember is that all heat sources that heat air will alter the humidity you can't have one with out the other.

That said my sly is in a room that is 66 this last few days has a 2 ft flourscent light and a deep blue led light string in it and it holds 82 ambient most of the time the coolest I have recorded last 2 weeks was 77 in the enclosure but the rooms low was 60. I rarely mist but use a large glass bowl 6 inch diameter over the warm side. Currently I have Sami chips but may switch back to coco coir as it holds more humidity. Hope this helps!


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Thanks Kitedemon! That is very useful! That helps me make my decision a lot easier. I figured there would be some one in a similar situation as mine.

Well if I get a good deal, I may get two cages.

Kitedemon, do you use flexwatt or a retail UTH?

Also Kitedemon, do you have pics of your setup? No biggie of you don't.

I think the sly has commercial UTHs I have used both I tend to use commercial more than most. I run a business from my home and by Canadian law in places of business electrical wiring MUST be UL approved and in the case of flexwatt it needs to be wired by an electrician. It makes flexwatt very expensive to use legally in my situation. Illegal use, negates my insurance and open the door on criminal negligence that can mean jail time.

Even ignoring this I would be likely to run commercial on a single enclosure or even a few enclosures. The better UTH run cooler and therefore safer than flexwatt does . Thermostats especially modern designs (herpstats, eco zone, and herpkeeper) are very safe but nothing is beyond failure. I prefer to assume that sooner or later T-stat and failsafe will fail and having a UTH that does not get over 100ºF eases my mind. (intilliheat, ultratherm, and a few others)

http://images49.fotki.com/v855/photo...31/0112-vi.jpgHosted on Fotki

This is one of my sly plastics.

http://www.slyplastics.com/en/index.html

Powerhouse look great too I personally do not own one but a friend does it is really well made.
http://powerhousedisplays.weebly.com/products.html

Buying enclosures again i would stick with 16 inch ones. The 12 inch tall given 4 inches around the doors make it very small opening (8 inches tall) it is hard to clean in such a small opening. I am a bit (ok a lot) of a spazz and clean very thoroughly I am also 6'4" and 235 pounds so it is hard to fit my arms in.

Great looking cage! I know that powerhouse are at the expos a lot here in ON and they look fantastic and that is my preferred brand from what I have seen available. I know an electrician that always checks over my wiring but I think using foil tape and taping a commercial UTH is the way I will go. I know not to put foil tape over my Herpstat probe.

I have a little to weigh out before the purchase but at least I know I have an option for a new cage. I am so tall but I liked the idea of 12" tall cages because I have a 3' stand for them to mount on and I think two cages be airtime too high in my living room. (Needs to be wife approved)

Thanks so much everyone e for your input.

Kitedemon you have been most helpful as usual. At least now I know someone has my intended setup working successfully in a similar room temp.

I think the 12" high may even hd the heat better as there is less space. I will have to look at them closely in person at an expo to make sure the opening does meet my needs. Ish just go with one 16" high and just add smaller snakes to my collection.

Tha ms again.

I ordered three 48*24*15 pvc cages from ReptiRacks. I ordered them in July and finally got the first one in November another in December and I'm still waiting on the third.

They are the thinner pvc and in my house which stays at 68 they would not hold the proper temp with a rhp and belly heat. I have to heat the room with a heater to keep them on point. They also do not hold up to shipping very well. Both I have received had broken seams that I had to epoxy back in place. They do look and function nicely, and they are light and easy to move but I wish I chose a different kind. I'm still in disbelief I'm still waiting on a product I paid so much for.

I also ordered another cage for my gtp from PVC cages and it is the thicker material. Apart from being more rigid and strong it holds heat alot better. I wish I would have spent the extra money and got large cages made out of it. I got this cage super fast and it was ready to use out of the box.

Thanks for the input KMG. That sucks you had such a crappy experience with your larger cages and customer service/shipping. I try to avoid ordering whenever I can because of experiences like yours.

I am glad to hear the thicker 1/4" PVC is holding heat better. I bet it will stand up better in the long run too.

KMG did you try using fluorescent lighting inside the enclosures? UTH and RHP both are radiant heat and they do not directly heat air. lights do. Lighting I have found will raise the ambient air temps and this allows more efficiency to the other heat sources. When I was tinkering with RHPs I found that with the lighting and UTH it was not needed and completely redundant.

It doesn't help your break but maybe it may help your temps.

Oh Jim, I have on all my PVCx enclosures a sheet of 1/2 inch foam sheet. I am not certain I would be overly concerned with the thickness of the PVCx as it is easy and inexpensive to add insulation during the colder months and remove it when it is warmer.

Yep I have a fluorescent light in each. I ordered those with the cages. But still they were not getting to the needed temps.

I knew that the uth and rhp were not going to heat the cage air very well but wanted them for cold nights since I rarely run my heater, wanted to make sure they had a warm spot at all times.

I'm more upset about the time it is taking to get the cages. Having to heat the room has given me the ability to keep more snakes in tubs which I could not do before.

I will probably be moving this summer to a new house with a better room that is 70-73F so I should be ok but at least if I have to I can add insulation. Do you have insulation surrounding your whe cage?

I meant do you have insulation around your whole cage?

I have insulation on the top and sides and part of the back (not covering the vents) I remove it all in the summer when it warms up.