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causes of death?
My ball python passed yesterday..he was healthy one minute, then died the same day! he was in a 20 long (tinfoil over 75% to keep heat and humidity up), 90 hot side, 78 cool side. 50% humidity. ate religiously, even while shedding. Though him not eating was technically the first sign, and happened about 4 days before him passing. here are a few pics of him right before/right after death. (I'll be dissecting him tomorrow to see if I can find anything...He wasn't in my care, as I had some friends who really liked him, but i saw him nearly every day, and his set up didn't change when we moved him.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...30102-2043.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...30102-1954.jpg
ideas? and why is he all lumpy??
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Weird, I have no idea. I'm sorry for your loss. :(
Only way to know is a necropsy (put him in the fridge, not the freezer).
Please share whatever you find out.
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Sorry for your lose.:tears:
Even though a pink belly is a sign of a shed cycle coming on.
That belly looks like it is burned. Have you checked to make sure your heating element didn't malfunction and possibly cook him?
The only way to know 100% how he died is to have a necropsy done.
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yeah, i'm doing the necropsy myself...no vets in town do them on reptiles =/
I thought it looked like a burn, but the heat pad was only 90. It shouldn't be a shed cycle though, as he shed about 2 weeks ago, and he's 4 years old.
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPanda
yeah, i'm doing the necropsy myself...no vets in town do them on reptiles =/
I thought it looked like a burn, but the heat pad was only 90. It shouldn't be a shed cycle though, as he shed about 2 weeks ago, and he's 4 years old.
Any chance something chemical could of gotten into his enclosure or he could of gotten into some chemicals when he was out?:confusd:
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Re: causes of death?
I'm not totally sure about that. I wouldn't think so, as they have sugar gliders, so they're really careful about chemicals. they're house is a little dirty (as seen by the pics xD), but when he was out, he was on their person. What kind of chemicals would kill that quick??
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPanda
I'm not totally sure about that. I wouldn't think so, as they have sugar gliders, so they're really careful about chemicals. they're house is a little dirty (as seen by the pics xD), but when he was out, he was on their person. What kind of chemicals would kill that quick??
I don't have a clue what could do it that quickly, but just by the look of the belly thats the only other thing I could think of that could cause a burn if it wasn't a heat related burn.
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Re: causes of death?
Hi,
I'm tempted to say overheating myself.
Sometimes people do not take sunlight through a window into account but a hot spot or thermostat glitch can also cause temperature to rocket and produce the burn as well.
dr del
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Is that his hide he is wrapped around in the first pic or a heat rock? What did you check the heat mat temp with? I think his belly looks burned, almost too pink for a shed.
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here, I checked for you. this vet does necropsies. I called them, the doc that does the necropsies will be back in town on tuesday. put it in the refrigerator til then. Unless you just want to cut it open to see what the insides looks like.
(435) 586-3400
Cedar Veterinary Clinic
533 N Airport Rd, Cedar City, UT
spooky
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With what are you measuring your temperatures?
Where in the tank are you measuring the temps?
That belly looks messed up, almost looks like "hard belly" that may have caused back up causing the lumping.
How long have you had the snake?
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hard belly? I've had him for 4 years, in the same setup. temps were checked with a digital temp gun. The thing he was wrapped around was a hide, not a heat rock! Dr Thinnis (the vet you called) is also going to charge about $400 to do the necropsy...so i think i'll just do it myself...
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also, he wasn't in my care at the time this happened. and he wasn't close to a window.
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sooo,,, do you know what your looking for, or even at? Maby theres a university close to you that you can ship it to. I work in a vet diagnostic lab and thats how alot of small animals (and snakes) are sent to us. Just trying to help. BTW, If you have more than one snake, and its an infectious desease, $400 would be getting out easy as compaired to loosing the rest of your collection. But if this is the only one, I would agree with you, $400 is alot.
spooky
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I have one other snake, Pajamas (retic), who is in my bedroom under quarantine. He's not being held, and I wash my hands vigorously before changing water. I do know a little about what I'm looking at, and I've got an anatomy sheet printed out. Pictures will be taken, and I have people who know exactly what to look for waiting so they can help. just can't shell out $400 right now....
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if you could, please post pics of the lesions. It would be interesting to look at.
thanks
spooky
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oookay, so took him out of the fridge..and apparently my fridge is a little colder than I thought...he's slightly frozen xD Are they supposed to smell like a noxious fart though?!
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My theories on why.
Your "friends" might have done something, intentional or not, that made that animal die. I'm just an amateur, but no perfectly healthy animal dies for no reason.
I'm suspicious of poisoning, extreme stress all at once (I've been in a situation with my father where this literally has left my emotions permanently reduced), suffocation/choking, and extreme constipation.
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Re: causes of death?
true, but every time they did something, they called me...they left everything how it had been at my house, so I don't know...I'm about to find out, though!
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Uuurp. (how do we not have a puke emot?!)
Think I found the cause of death...I have NO idea what it is, but maybe you guys do!!
this mass goes all the way from the stomach to the vent...it's white and squishy. and smells AWFUL. (I'm not done yet, but I needed some air)
WARNING!! THIS IS GRAPHIC. SQUEEMISH TURN AWAY!!!!!
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...psa01e3492.jpg
Up close with 'it'
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...ps88555a64.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...ps80661c95.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...ps964e6adc.jpg
I'll post more as I get further in! (sorry for how curvy he is...he won't straighten out...)
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photos having me wanting to see more.
could he have been impacted at some point?
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All that white stuff in the pics is just fat reserves.
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl
photos having me wanting to see more.
could he have been impacted at some point?
Working on building up the courage to go back out. I almost threw up cause it smells so bad. going to put some eucalyptus in my mask.
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPanda
Parasite eggs, tapeworm, or kidney stones?
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thats fat, I was under the impression that you know what you were looking for/ looking at. Those google anatomy sheets just dont work out do they? Show the animal some dignity, dig a hole and put it in it.
jason
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they don't say anything about fat deposits. Never said i was a pro...and besides, what's the harm? He's already dead.
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Huh. Well I wish we could have learned what caused it, but thanks for the interesting pics. I hate to see an animal loose its life, but I love seeing a scientific approach.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2
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I've been talking to some others, and i'm going to try for some more pics. We think it might be an abscess because of the god awful smell...so i'm going to investigate.
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coleslaw007
Huh. Well I wish we could have learned what caused it, but thanks for the interesting pics. I hate to see an animal loose its life, but I love seeing a scientific approach.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2
never let a body go to waste!
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Did you palpate the heart, liver, stomach and intestines?
And feel for any lumps, hard spots or blockages?
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tes95
I'm just an amateur, but no perfectly healthy animal dies for no reason.
True, but some seemingly perfectly healthy animals do just drop dead...it happens.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coleslaw007
but I love seeing a scientific approach.
I wouldn't exactly call an at home necropsy using an anatomy printout the scientific approach...I don't think anyone with any sort of qualification to form a hypothesis that could lead to a theory or conlusion is performing this "experiment".
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.spooky
dig a hole and put it in it.
jason
Please do this...
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Re: causes of death?
yes. Heart spurted blood, but was only pink on the bottom. Lungs were gorgeous, kidneys were perfect. his intestines were black though, and smelled awful. so it may have been an impaction, or just an infection in his intestines. (had to cut it short, the boyfriend came home and freaked out because it smelled really bad) And to everyone else on here who don't like it...if you have an issue, go away. I didn't tell you to look in this thread. I'm sorry I can't shell out $400 for a necropsy, and I'm always up for learning something new.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobNJ
I wouldn't exactly call an at home necropsy using an anatomy printout the scientific approach...I don't think anyone with any sort of qualification to form a hypothesis that could lead to a theory or conlusion is performing this experiment
Imo the animal is dead, its gone. Its not suffering and I really can't see it minding its body being autopsied, be it performed by an expert or a novice. Its a more scientific approach than just tossing or burying it, not that there's anything wrong with just doing one of those. I personally see no harm though.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2
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If my dog passed, i dont think i would do this to him.... but then again i gut fish to eat at times. I dont think ur breaking any laws either because i believe as long as it passes naturally then its ok. But taking pics and showing to people who even have some background in veterinary care or is a reg DVM, isnt gonna help IMO. U have to be more hands on and tests have to be done. Ive had a beardie die in a similar fashion and it was possibly kidney failure.... but honestly u wont know unless a autopsy is done.... even then they might not know. Good luck on ur new hat band
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPanda
I've been talking to some others, and i'm going to try for some more pics. We think it might be an abscess because of the god awful smell...so i'm going to investigate.
The minute after an animal dies, it starts to decompose, break down, and fall apart. Dead things tend to smell foul almost from the get go and the smell only gets worse with time, even if it's refigerated. Stinky dead bodies do not indicate a cause of death.
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Re: causes of death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPanda
yes. Heart spurted blood, but was only pink on the bottom. Lungs were gorgeous, kidneys were perfect. his intestines were black though, and smelled awful. so it may have been an impaction, or just an infection in his intestines. (had to cut it short, the boyfriend came home and freaked out because it smelled really bad) And to everyone else on here who don't like it...if you have an issue, go away. I didn't tell you to look in this thread. I'm sorry I can't shell out $400 for a necropsy, and I'm always up for learning something new.
your right, there is nothing wrong with learning something,,,, so what did you learn? the heart "spurted" blood, they all will. Did you dissect the chambers and compair wall thickness, did you do a gross on the valves? As mentioned before, did you palpate the lungs, were they congested? Do you know what bad lungs (or kidneys) look like to asume the ones you were looking at were gorgeous? The reason the intestines were black is because during decomp. there the first to go due to all of the bacteria.
spooky
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