Is there still a market for caramels?

I love Caramel Albinos, but with there being Ultramels which lack the kinking of CA I have heard people say they just want to get Ultramels instead. I know there is always a market if the stock is quality and the produced animals are quality, but are more people really shying from the CA onto the Ultramel?

Personally I think a quality Caramel Glow is 100x hotter than anything, so I may be a little biased.

However, one can not, not worry about eventually having trouble moving babies. From someone very interested in the breeding hobby.



Thanks,
Kevin

Caramels have completely dropped off of MY wish list.

I won't work with 'em, I couldn't handle kinked animals.

Why work with an inferior product? Caramels have the Double Wamy with the Kinking and Low Fertility issues in females...I had a lot of time and money invested in Caramels...

I have now sold everything Caramel and replaced it with the Ultramel Gene!

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...UB_U_16999.jpg

I'm not completely saying I don't love ultramels. They are just still to pricey for me, even hets. Hence why I thought of working with caramels

Ultras are ugly imo

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I don't think the market is gone for caramels. At least I hope not.

I personally don't like either gene.. :oops:

I like ultras - though some of them seem low on the plurple/ blue colour I love.

I guess when someone finally makes an ultra-glow I will know for sure which I want to work with.

I still like the Caramel morphs. In fact, we are breeding two different pairs this season. I think there is a market still out there, but just not as big as it once was.

Sorry...I'm no help here, just wanted to say I read the title "Is there still a market for camels?" and I was very confused. Carry on.

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I happen to like the caramel gene over the ultra. Furthermore, I looooovvvveee caramels. I realize that people shy away from them and I totally understand. For my money though, if you take breeding out of the question, they are one of my top three morphs. While the market has dropped from a breeding standpoint, I think there will always be a market for beautiful snakes from a collector standpoint.

I agree, I think caramels are significantly prettier than ultramels. I dont have either at the moment, but if I ever decided to get one it would be caramel all the way (even if ultras were the same price).

Carmels are still good. They just need to be out crossed more. People should not take shortcuts when breeding. They should get unrelated pairs and not do any back breeding with them.

I still think I might keep a pair as a side project eventually. Caramel glows are still one of my all time favorite combos with the hypo and caramel gene.

I just stumbled upon the Cinnamon Caramel Albino, "Cinnamel" and yet another reason I want to get a pair eventually.

Spider Caramel is HOT... a breeder in my area still works with it a lot here:

http://www.nhreptile.com/


Idk, to those who have worked with them before... how frequent is the kinking? I think sometimes people take a few horror stories and blow things out of proportion sometimes. Caramel in particular seems to be a gene that people actively avoid though. Is there substance to that?

I love caramels! Have you seen Joe Ellis' yellowbelly caramel? That thing is absolutely smoking, I've been thinking of trying for that combo with some mojave influence.

Definitely still a market, at least I'll be buying one sometime

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Originally Posted by TessadasExotics

Carmels are still good. They just need to be out crossed more. People should not take shortcuts when breeding. They should get unrelated pairs and not do any back breeding with them.

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In my experience it doesn't matter. It's part of the gene not a product of inbreeding. We bred son x mother and sibling with zero kinks 3 seasons in a row. Paired the same male with an unrelated female and got two kinked caramels. I think the bloodline is more important.

As far as there being a market, we sold out of two clutches right away. People still like them even with the possible issues.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Brandon Osborne

In my experience it doesn't matter. It's part of the gene not a product of inbreeding. We bred son x mother and sibling with zero kinks 3 seasons in a row. Paired the same male with an unrelated female and got two kinked caramels. I think the bloodline is more important.

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I have talked to a few breeders who basically report the same thing, once you got a no to low kink trend going hang onto it. Last time I talked to brian from bhb he said he hatched over 50 caramels in a row with no kinks and some of those caramels came from female caramels that had no slugs. It does appear a few have selectively bred it out or at the very least reduced it significantly.

Me on the other hand, I like the ultras looks better, so I'll dive into them when I feel the time is right.

Good to know everything thanks!

i purchased my caramel from mark at bbc reptiles and also picked up a spider het from skip at nhreptiles. skip is scott at cvexotics father. i have dealt with all three of these people. they have all done work together and have had good experiences with all of them. mark especially has gone over the top. he told me in discussions that they havent had much of a problem with breeding their caramels. they have had luck breeding bother females to hets and vice versa. they have been working with that gene and it appears that they have had good luck with their gene(s). since i have animals from both im hoping that continues. im shooting for a caramel spider cause i think theyre just plain awesome.

I'm really liking the caramel cinnys.

I'm going to have to look for that caramel cinnamon pic. One of the breedings I would like to do this year if they get to size is caramel pos het hypo to chocolate cinnamon mojave pos het hypo.

I started my caramel project I think it was about 12 years ago with a 66% chance het male. Of course I didn't know anything about the kinking or the female slug issues back then. Took me forever to get him to breed and then again to grow is daughters up during a stretch with feeder supply issues but finally produced 1.2 caramels this year. Was unsure what to do with the females so gave them both away but am getting one of them re-gifted back to me. I really like the look and hearing another report of good eggs has me thinking of keeping her as I don't know what a female caramel should sell for as a pretty pet.

Still have this wild theory that the reason some breeders get no kinks and others get lots (and maybe the same with sluggs?) has something to do with some dietary nutrient that the caramel mutation either can't tolerate or needs more than normals.