Question about BP vision

I've heard/read that they don't see like we do. I've read a lot, and I'm a reasonably intelligent person, but I don't get it.
Explain? Anyone?

Good question. Found this.


Sight - Snakes do not see colors, but their eyes are equipped with a combination of light receptors: rods that provide low-light but fuzzy vision, and cones that produce clear images. The complexity of the eyes varies among species because of their different lifestyles. For instance, snakes that live primarily underground have smaller eyes that only process light and dark, but snakes that live above ground and hunt by sight have crystal-clear vision and good depth perception. Some species, specifically boas and pythons, have a second visual tool: Pit organs on their heads see heat sources in their surroundings like infrared goggles -- an effective ability for nocturnal hunters of warm-blooded animals.

Source: How Snakes Work

So. If their analogy is correct, pythons might see something more like the image below...

http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/xt...ifs/ir_man.gif

Also explains how hitting the head of that F/T rodent before offering it lets them know where to strike. In most rodents, the head is several degrees higher than the rest of their bodies (or so I hear.)

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Originally Posted by FoxReptiles

Good question. Found this.


Sight - Snakes do not see colors, but their eyes are equipped with a combination of light receptors: rods that provide low-light but fuzzy vision, and cones that produce clear images. The complexity of the eyes varies among species because of their different lifestyles. For instance, snakes that live primarily underground have smaller eyes that only process light and dark, but snakes that live above ground and hunt by sight have crystal-clear vision and good depth perception. Some species, specifically boas and pythons, have a second visual tool: Pit organs on their heads see heat sources in their surroundings like infrared goggles -- an effective ability for nocturnal hunters of warm-blooded animals.

Source: How Snakes Work

So. If their analogy is correct, pythons might see something more like the image below...

http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/xt...ifs/ir_man.gif

Also explains how hitting the head of that F/T rodent before offering it lets them know where to strike. In most rodents, the head is several degrees higher than the rest of their bodies (or so I hear.)

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This is one of the things I read (How Snakes Work). I thought maybe I misunderstood because I've seen a lot of people claim that their snakes prefer a prey color over others. I've also seen people suggest trying a different colored prey item for a reluctant eater.

If they don't see the color...?

No they do not see in colors but even in black and white an all White male rodent looks and smells different than a Black and White female. Trust me some how they know the difference :)

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Originally Posted by RestlessRobie

No they do not see in colors but even in black and white an all White male rodent looks and smells different than a Black and White female. Trust me some how they know the difference :)

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Yes I had a ghost male that would not touch white rats but if it had a darker color he would grab it without hesitation

I don't imagine they would "see" 100% in infrared. Their eyes and the Pit organs are separate but I would imagine it's a combination of senses working at the same time. My pickiest eater seemed to be way more interested in a F/T mouse if I perked both of it's ear up before offering it to her. So I definitely think they pickup on the silhouette of their pray which could also be a reason that ASF rats trigger a better response with their more pronounced ears...

Then again, I could be reading into things too much.

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Originally Posted by FoxReptiles

I don't imagine they would "see" 100% in infrared. Their eyes and the Pit organs are separate but I would imagine it's a combination of senses working at the same time. My pickiest eater seemed to be way more interested in a F/T mouse if I perked both of it's ear up before offering it to her. So I definitely think they pickup on the silhouette of their pray which could also be a reason that ASF rats trigger a better response with their more pronounced ears...

Then again, I could be reading into things too much.

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Mine (so far) will eat anything. I mostly feed live, but I tried to make millions of mice and they offed each other, so I froze them. She's eaten two of those with the same vigor as the live ones.

I was wondering if different colors smell different, or look different to the snake. Obviously, they do! Interesting.

The belief ball pythons do not see colour has been proven not to be true. They have limited colour vision, dichromatic vision (two colour). Ball/royal pythons have been shown to have very limited UV/blue visual spectrum vision. There is also very highly refined red/infrared sensitivity. The cones also run into the yellow spectrum. This means yellow/orange/red/IR near and middle can be seen easily. As humans we see from near UV through the spectrum to the near IR (deep red) end. Pythons fail to see the lower end of UV and blues but much deeper into the IR range than humans can. This we know from electro microscopy and dissection. The heat pits are basically connected to the optical nerve of the brain so they are also vision. What this looks like is unknown if they are able to separate information from the eyes and heat pits or if it is linked is still a mystery.

http://jeb.biologists.org/content/202/14/1931.full.pdf

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Originally Posted by kitedemon

The belief ball pythons do not see colour has been proven not to be true. <snipped> The heat pits are basically connected to the optical nerve of the brain so they are also vision. What this looks like is unknown if they are able to separate information from the eyes and heat pits or if it is linked is still a mystery.

http://jeb.biologists.org/content/202/14/1931.full.pdf

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Beat me to it! :)

So, yes, ball pythons see in color. Based on behavior, I know some people think snakes can sort their visual signals, if they're in IR or what is, to us, visual light and learn to ignore the visual . . . While the IR is always paid attention to. Really, to them, it's all visual light, but they register the difference.

It's worth pointing out, urine and other chemical trails will phosphoresce in UV light. Seeing in this end of spectrum may well allow balls (and other snakes that probably depend on it more) to track prey, find rodent trails to ambush like other pythons, and find potential mates.

Excellent feedback from everyone! Thanks!
BP.net is the new Google :)

Very cool stuff everyone, and thanks for sharing. I am going to have to disagree with restless robie, however, in his claim that different colored rats will smell different. They will look different to a snake however the smell will be the exact same. Maybe you mis-spoke?

@gsarchie: he stated that a white MALE will smell different than the black FEMALE..... ;)

I can not recall where I heard this from, perhaps it was on Python Hunters. I believe they were talking about new science coming out that pointed to the possibility that pythons and venemous can actually switch from normal limited colour vision to IR at will by turning on/off the heat pits and also that they may be able to overlap them together (mindblown). This would give them more differentiating ability between objects with similar temperatures and also would give them the ability to hunt in complete darkness which is when most heat pit snakes are on the prowl for food.

I see. Thank you, Courtney, for pointing that out. Can't call me Bruce? I see how it is. ;)

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Originally Posted by gsarchie

I see. Thank you, Courtney, for pointing that out. Can't call me Bruce? I see how it is. ;)

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Bruce! Haha not Archie ok i got it now we need a real name thread if one doesn't exist. Sorry no hijacking tho I've also wondered how my snakes see so its nice getting input on it. Is it true they can't hear tho?

I am not sure how they process images no one can. The information from the eyes and heat pits are both processed by the same part of the brain so both should be thought of as vision but it is hard to say how that looks. I wish there was some way to see what they see. The UV is limited with Royals but other species is quite pronounced they believe it is not likely to be functional usage in royals. Carpets have been proven to see well in UV. It is amazing to think there is so much variation in spectral range from one to the other.

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Originally Posted by gsarchie

I see. Thank you, Courtney, for pointing that out. Can't call me Bruce? I see how it is. ;)

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Hardy har har.....I'm sorry my friend, Bruce :P
I just figured that not everyone knew your real name, so it would be better if I used your username.

No worries, Mr. Carlson! Archie is something that both my cousin and I are called by our military peers so it is fine with me.

Courtney - it is in my signature, but I see where you're coming from. I forgive you - this time! ;)

I am confused now... Because I was told if a UTH does not produce enough heat then get an overhead INFRARED light, because it can be on 24 hours without disturbing their nocturnal nature (unlike a normal light, which disrupts their pattern because they would be able to see it at night time).
!?!

Maybe someone mentioned this and I missed it but I recall reading that the nerves and sensors connected to their heat pits are overlayed onto their eyes in such a way where in a sense, pythons have a somewhat wider range of colour in their vision than us humans.
However that was in a kid's book and several years ago so who knows if that's changed since. :rolleyes:

I think the vision of pythons/boas is something really amazing though and I wish there was a much more cohesive collection of information about it! It's incredible that for how many people own snakes, we actually don't know that much about their fine inner workings. They're just such an incredible group of animals, I will continue to be amazed by them.

MisterKyte yes that is true the heat pit nerves are ultimately connected to the optical tectum this region processes sight. So heat pits are processed as optical information. Newer studies have demonstrated that the cones of Royal pythons are dichromatic sensitive to two colours Yellows and reds (by default that includes orange as well) So red light is seen by both eyes and heat pits as deep red in the beginning of IR light. All things that get hot produce IR.

Noz yes they see IR lights quite well both with the eyes and with the heat pits as well. The recent studies have shown they have very poor response to deep blue (uv) and it is guessed that they have no practical function in this end of the spectrum. This is different from other pythons (carpets) that actually have good UV vision and things like garter snakes that also do as well it is guessed this is used to track scent trails left by prey items. Many reptiles see exceptionally well in UV end of the spectrum and poorly on the red end. This I believe is where the belief that pythons do not see red comes from. This is completely false as it is common knowledge they hunt by IR and IR and red over over lapping. If they see one they see the other.

I use deep blue as this is not so visually tuned. It is clear that heat sensing snakes are 'tuned' to react to the IR end of the spectrum. All lights emit heat this is generally how lights work by heating gas or metal and causing it to glow with human range spectrum. Blue lights as well, I use LED so if the see the blue light is doubtful but they would clearly see the electrical components that become warm in between the LED units. Pythons seem to adapt to various lighting and heating methods we employ so in the end it likely makes little to no difference.