What morph is tis ??

A fren of mine got hold of this beauty today.....He was told she is the offspring of a Killerbee x Pastel.
This lady started off her life as a pastel (or so my fren was informed by the seller) and after numerous shed, became what she is as of present. She is currently 1200 - 1300g. I would definitely luv to classify her as Axanthic but seller says she is definitely not....If the seller is telling the truth, a quick check on the Genetic Wizard for KB x pastel reaps the following;

Percent	Fraction	Morph
25%	1/4	Pastel
25%	1/4	Super Pastel
25%	1/4	Bumble Bee
25%	1/4	Killer Bee

Question now is, what exactly is she ?? I hail from a country where ball pythons as pets are well........very very rare....hence not much reference from my end. Any kind soul care to shed some light ?? Tks in advance

http://i1306.photobucket.com/albums/...ps08df5913.jpg
http://i1306.photobucket.com/albums/...ps08cff922.jpg
http://i1306.photobucket.com/albums/...psfc1fab5e.jpg
http://i1306.photobucket.com/albums/...psae80c8a1.jpg

If it started as pastel, then it most likely has IMG traits somewhere.. From what I've read, it's random, non genetic(in the common sense of the term (rescessive/co-dom/dom..) and will eventually return to her normal pastel coloration.. But I could also be wrong and over looking a key bit of info.. After all it's 5 AM here..
http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/co...all_python.asp

I'm thinking it looks like a super pastel that's really really light/faded, but I agree with Sand; there's probably something more going on. I don't know if it's necessarily IMG specifically but I would not be surprised if it was something.

Try breeding it and see if you get similar offspring! :D

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Originally Posted by Sand

If it started as pastel, then it most likely has IMG traits somewhere.. From what I've read, it's random, non genetic(in the common sense of the term (rescessive/co-dom/dom..) and will eventually return to her normal pastel coloration.. But I could also be wrong and over looking a key bit of info.. After all it's 5 AM here..
http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/co...all_python.asp

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Interestin read. Tks for the link. But the article mentioned the specimen w IMG wil grow darker but tis gal is losing its yellow and its dorsal stripe is also lightening....am I missing something here ??

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Originally Posted by het

Interestin read. Tks for the link. But the article mentioned the specimen w IMG wil grow darker but tis gal is losing its yellow and its dorsal stripe is also lightening....am I missing something here ??

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I thought IMG was genetic. I've seen a few IMG animals. They don't start to get lighter till the 500g range. then is like someone sucked all the color out of the snake!

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Originally Posted by BP2

I thought IMG was genetic. I've seen a few IMG animals. They don't start to get lighter till the 500g range. then is like someone sucked all the color out of the snake!

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That being said my guess is Pastel IMG. Breed her and see what you get! Also try and find photos of her as a baby its hard to tell if she is a super or just a pastel with how light she is.

She definitely has the traits of the IMG but look at all that beautiful blushing!

Doesn't look axanthic.
It looks exactly what the seller said it was. A pastel (maybe even a super pastel with that blushed head) with pigment loss.
Some snakes just loose their coloring randomly in their life.
Sometimes it's a nutrition related, hormone issue, and other times it's just a shed issue (When the new skin doesn't develop correctly under the old skin. Think ink cartridge running out of ink)

Most dramatic pigment change in snakes (especially females) is due to hormones.
Whatever it is, these snakes usually always return back to their original color.

People use the term IMG to describe the pigment loss in some ball pythons. Don't ask me why but they do. It is actually a wrong term, as IMG is increasing melanin while this strange occurrence is losing melanin. This snake does look like it could be a pastel that has lost its color. So far, to my knowledge, all ball pythons that have done this do eventually get their color back after a few years. No one knows why this happens, but it is speculated that it could be some type of nutritional deficiency or stress. It does not seem to be genetic.

Tks yall for all ur inputs.....

I had a male and female do this earlier this year, Both related ( Brother and Sister ) Both also changed colour within the same week.

This is how the male looked before his dramatic change,

http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...96492164_n.jpg

Straight after he shed,

http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...98736299_n.jpg

This is him now with the female,

http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...35852963_n.jpg

He's gone exceptionally dirty in colouration and the female who went through the same change is nearly back to her normal colour. Still unknown to what happened and only time will tell in the future IF it's genetic.

Cool....how long did ur male maintain his silver?

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Originally Posted by Tempestas

http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...98736299_n.jpg

This is him now with the female,

http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...35852963_n.jpg

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That is the craziest thing I've ever seen. (Okay, probably not. But it's pretty crazy!)

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Originally Posted by het

Cool....how long did ur male maintain his silver?

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Not long to be honest I had a lot of people say it must be due to food items but I ruled that out because none of my others changed colour.

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Originally Posted by loonunit

That is the craziest thing I've ever seen. (Okay, probably not. But it's pretty crazy!)

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Lol thanks it was pretty crazy indeed :)

Looks like what people refer to as a ":cens0r::cens0r::cens0r::cens0r:ter". Basically, if you let you snake sit in a wet, nasty, soupy, crappy mess for a long period of time the acid in the poop will eat away at the pigment in the skin. Once the snake sheds the snake looks "axanthic like" but then goes back to normal after a few sheds.

If it was a genetic condition the snake would be the same colour all over. Not one colour on the sides and then another wavy colour on the top. On the original posters snake you can see how there is a darker wavy patch from the head part way down the spine. That is where they weren't covered in nasty poop for as long.

Corey

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Originally Posted by Corey Woods

Looks like what people refer to as a ":cens0r::cens0r::cens0r::cens0r:ter". Basically, if you let you snake sit in a wet, nasty, soupy, crappy mess for a long period of time the acid in the poop will eat away at the pigment in the skin. Once the snake sheds the snake looks "axanthic like" but then goes back to normal after a few sheds.

If it was a genetic condition the snake would be the same colour all over. Not one colour on the sides and then another wavy colour on the top. On the original posters snake you can see how there is a darker wavy patch from the head part way down the spine. That is where they weren't covered in nasty poop for as long.

Corey

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Hmm Corey this theory you have that they have been sitting in wet, nasty, soupy, crappy mess for a long period of time. You are basically implying that we aren't keeping our animals correctly!

Now see the funny thing is MY two that had the colour change didn't even defecate whilst in shed so your explanation is invalid and not only the fact that what you say would be practically impossible for BOTH snakes in separate tubs to crap at exactly the same time to sit in the same position and covered in the same amount of crap ! Also you state they go back to normal yet my male is far from looking normal and the female is no where near the same as she was and they have shed god knows how many times since those photos.

Perhaps you might of experienced this with having a tub full of crap but I can certainly say I haven't! Now this theory you have put forward really is crap to an extent, Out of ALL the people that have seen the photographs of my two you are the first and ONLY person to say what you have. So just for the record MY snakes have never and will never be kept in their own feces or wet soupy conditions I can't comment about others but I know for sure mine don't!

I am actually offended by what you have said Corey implying that I keep my snakes in such a way that it would be detrimental to their own health, :colbert:

Taken last night, Obviously this isn't their normal colouration.

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...79149034_n.jpg

Sorry that you took offense. However, the majority of the ones that change colour do it under the described conditions. Yours maybe different but the animal originally posted is most definately a sh*tter.

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Originally Posted by Tempestas

Not long to be honest I had a lot of people say it must be due to food items but I ruled that out because none of my others changed colour.



Lol thanks it was pretty crazy indeed :)

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Just because all of your snakes didn't turn doesn't mean its not a nutritional deficiency. It could be the individuals themselves that have some sort of internal nutrient processing issue. And the color change did occur in siblings, which may hint at their similar and/or possible issues.

I'm not saying your snakes are nutrient deficient, but you shouldn't rule it out because the others aren't showing the same signs.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

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Originally Posted by Corey Woods

Sorry that you took offense. However, the majority of the ones that change colour do it under the described conditions. Yours maybe different but the animal originally posted is most definately a sh*tter.

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I do know that some have changed due to having been kept in bad conditions, To be honest I wish they never did change they were much better before the strange colour change.

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Originally Posted by satomi325

Just because all of your snakes didn't turn doesn't mean its not a nutritional deficiency. It could be the individuals themselves that have some sort of internal nutrient processing issue. And the color change did occur in siblings, which may hint at their similar and/or possible issues.

I'm not saying your snakes are nutrient deficient, but you shouldn't rule it out because the others aren't showing the same signs.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

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Hi Satomi,

It's only these two out of the entire group of siblings that have changed colour, I did consider it being due to the food prey but to be honest it's not happened before and hasn't happened since if it was due to a deficiency then surely it would go away once the deficiency was corrected and if it wasn't corrected then surely they would be experiencing it all the time plus I would expect it to be seen more often considering the sheer amount of ball's in peoples collections.

I have looked at all different ways and I don't claim it to be genetic if anything it's annoying because they were beautiful before hand and now the male just looks dirty.

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Originally Posted by Corey Woods

Sorry that you took offense. However, the majority of the ones that change colour do it under the described conditions. Yours maybe different but the animal originally posted is most definately a sh*tter.

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Tks for the uncalled for comment.