Fire

Hello, I'm having a hard time being able to differentiate between a fire and a normal ball python. I have a picture (I need help posting the picture here) and I was told all three are fires but they look like normals to me. If they are indeed fires, which one would you choose? Thanks.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...with-pictures)

Fires can be difficult when young if they aren't great examples or they aren't sitting right next to normals to compare. They should be lighter than normal, usually with a head spot and nice blushing. Get the pics posted and we will see what we can do to help you choose :)

hope this works

http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/...ps31ff2b29.jpg[/IMG]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/18/5epu9e5y.jpg

The fire is on the left :gj:

Your fire is a lot brighter than mine. I'm thinking about getting the one on the far right. What do you guys think? I would like to buy quality pythons and if they're below average then I'd pass on them.

I would pass on those if I were you. Just being honest

Ok, could you explain why? Thanks.

My rule of thumb is if I can't tell I pass. I am not that great with Fires. I do think the one on the right is a Fire but the other two eh.

I purchased a hatchling fire this year but he is very bright, nice head spot and blushing so I can tell he is without a doubt a Fire.

Those just look to much like normals to me.

I appreciate your honesty. No offense to you but I am curious to hear what others think about the fires?

All three look legit to me, whether or not you buy one is entirely up to you. I'd ask for an outside picture in mild lighting(overcast) without a flash.

- - - Updated - - -

I'd probably ask for a full clutch shot and the pairing that produced them too.

They look like fires to me but not high quality ones. In fairness my normal in that pic is a really dark normal and the lighting make him look weird. Heres a couple outdoor shots of him:

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/18/ezy8e7e6.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/18/u4a3yta6.jpg

You wanna look for creamy colors, good blushing, a nice head stamp, and i prefer a more reduced pattern. The fires in those pics look too busy and not creamy enough for ny taste.

What about the one on the far left? He seems a bit brighter than others and less busy. I want to get a fire in hopes of making super fire in the future.

Oops, I meant to type "she"

As john1982 said, ask for pics of the parents and outdoor shots if you want.

Personally, i would still pass on them.

Ask the breeder what the pairing was and clutch shots to put your mind at ease.

There certainly was no concern with selective breeding when that breeder produced those fires.. I too would pass on them. They do look to be fires but low quality. People really should build their collections with the highest quality, obvious morphs they can find. The market is being flooded with terrible representations of all these morphs in the last couple years due to so many new people getting into it and breeding whatever they can get their hands on with no regard for quality.

This is only hurting them because if you shop around you'll see that the breeders who are selling the same morphs but of an eye popping quality are getting more money out of them. Plus they sell a lot faster and they aren't sitting on those babies for months or a year.

Never settle. Get what you want but get a nice one in the process.

I believe they are fires. but not the quality of fire I would want for breeding.

Fire's should be bold and bright. As babies, they should be very yellow, with heavy blushing and bright headstamps. Big belly flames are also good. I am very particular about snakes I buy or keep for breeding. That selectivity led me to be blessed with some amazing fires this season.

Here is a photo of one of mine to compare.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...firefemale.jpg

See that super bright yellow coloring? That is key to a quality fire baby. As they mature, they turn creamy instead of yellow.

Here is one with killer blushing, this one is a male.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...umber8-boy.jpg

See the huge difference in these babies compared to the ones in your photo ?

Gale

There certainly was no concern with selective breeding when that breeder produced those fires.. I too would pass on them. They do look to be fires but low quality. People really should build their collections with the highest quality, obvious morphs they can find. The market is being flooded with terrible representations of all these morphs in the last couple years due to so many new people getting into it and breeding whatever they can get their hands on with no regard for quality.

This is only hurting them because if you shop around you'll see that the breeders who are selling the same morphs but of an eye popping quality are getting more money out of them. Plus they sell a lot faster and they aren't sitting on those babies for months or a year.

Never settle. Get what you want but get a nice one in the process.

Some like reduced, some like busy, light, dark, yellow, grey, blushed, contrasty, etc, etc.. If you ask 20 people what the ideal fire is, you'll probably get 20 different answers. Get what you think is nice and strive towards producing animals that put a smile on your face.

I agree that u should get some more natural light pics. They may just be under funny lighting, and fires do get better with age. You do want to make sure you get a quality hatchling tho, so it just gets better and better...

I would pass on them as well. As was stated even if they are Fire, they are poor quality (OR just VERY badly lit).

Here is my single gene female (she is a Flame, which as just another Fire line). Notice the color and the head stamp. She is 700-800g.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...7/DSC02228.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...x667/XRAY1.jpg

You want a bright Fire, so that when you mix it with other morphs it passes on that color. Like this in my Fire Spider girl:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...7/DSC02203.jpg


And, you do pay for quality. I only paid $50 less for the Flame than I paid for the Fire Spider, due to wanting such a clean and bright female.

So, all of that was a long winded way to say: Keep Looking

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

There certainly was no concern with selective breeding when that breeder produced those fires.. I too would pass on them. They do look to be fires but low quality. People really should build their collections with the highest quality, obvious morphs they can find. The market is being flooded with terrible representations of all these morphs in the last couple years due to so many new people getting into it and breeding whatever they can get their hands on with no regard for quality.

This is only hurting them because if you shop around you'll see that the breeders who are selling the same morphs but of an eye popping quality are getting more money out of them. Plus they sell a lot faster and they aren't sitting on those babies for months or a year.

Never settle. Get what you want but get a nice one in the process.

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Ive Produced over 50 fires they are all variable I keep the best looking females for myself,This year I have fire combos that are stunning fire is a must have in any collection!

They all appear to be fires to me. They have proper head stamps. With fires, as babies anyways, they're brown is creamier. It's not like chocolate, it's smoother and lighter. It's hard to say which one is better for me because i really love the flames on fires. So cloer shots of each at an extended side view would be helpful in choosing which is better in my opinion

How about this one?

http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/...psb761f692.jpg[/IMG]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by angllady2

I believe they are fires. but not the quality of fire I would want for breeding.

Fire's should be bold and bright. As babies, they should be very yellow, with heavy blushing and bright headstamps. Big belly flames are also good. I am very particular about snakes I buy or keep for breeding. That selectivity led me to be blessed with some amazing fires this season.

Here is a photo of one of mine to compare.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...firefemale.jpg

See that super bright yellow coloring? That is key to a quality fire baby. As they mature, they turn creamy instead of yellow.

Here is one with killer blushing, this one is a male.

[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v421/Angllady2/snakes/Number8-boy.jpg[/IMG
See the huge difference in these babies compared to the ones in your photo ?

Gale

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Does that first snake have eyes? I may be missing something......

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MorphMaster

Does that first snake have eyes? I may be missing something......

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I think that was a clutch that were born eyless but correct me if Im wrong.

I just got a fire the other day, heres mine, he's a little brighter in person, and he's got some cool blushing around his head.
http://i807.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps0595426e.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by digizure

How about this one?

http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/...psb761f692.jpg[/IMG]

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Any thoughts about this one?

Yes, that baby was one of my clutch that was born eyeless.

The one in your hand seems brighter to me, which may or may not be the lighting. I do like the belly flames you can clearly see on this baby, and a few bands of blushing across it's back. Based on that picture, I'd consider that one for breeding.

Now the question is, is that one of the first three? ;) Or a different one?

I wish you all the best in your search. But the truth is, ask 100 different people if that baby is ideal and 45 will say yes, 45 will say no, 5 will hate fires, and the last 5 will tell you to wait and get a fire combo. :D

Gale

I wish you all the best in your search. But the truth is, ask 100 different people if that baby is ideal and 45 will say yes, 45 will say no, 5 will hate fires, and the last 5 will tell you to wait and get a fire combo. :D

Gale[/QUOTE]

It is a different one. I know, everyone has their own opinion. I just don't know much about fires and I want BELs someday. I just don't want to waste my money on low quality pythons.

those do not look much like fires to me to be honest....

here is a pic of mine...

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...98739468_n.jpg

If you are looking for a male, I just saw one on Jeremy Smith's site that looks great, over 800g and is $350. Nice females can be a bit harder to come by, but just keep looking. Also, Mike Wilbanks usually has some very nice ones.

Nah, I'm looking for a female. Did you see the recent picture I posted? Check page 3.

the one on the third page looks nice