Noob question of the day!

I'm about to buy a baby BP and was wondering..is a 20 gal long good enough? And for how long? Also, I have a extra 40 gal breeder tank and I'm not sure if it could live in that as an ADULT in that size tank. Thanks in advance!

A 20 gallon long is big enough. They like to feel secure. You may even find it too big to begin with, if you have feeding problems try blocking off a section. Make sure you provide plenty of hides as well, on both the cool and warm ends.

A 20 gallon long could actually be too big for a baby BP, but you can clutter it with extra hides and crumpled newspaper to fill the space and make him/her feel more secure. A 40-gal is large enough for the majority of adult BPs to live in. I kept a 2400g female in one for a few months, until I switched to racks, with no issue. Just do a search for some of the tank modifications suggested on here for keeping in humidity, supplemental heating, etc.

AWWW THANKS!!! So can't I buy like a humidity machine from petsmart or saomething to keep it misted?

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Originally Posted by MrBrute

AWWW THANKS!!! So can't I buy like a humidity machine from petsmart or saomething to keep it misted?

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That will most likely keep the humidity TOO high (and be a waste of money compared to covering part of the screen and misting 1-2 times/day with a spray bottle). If your enclosure is humid to the point of being wet, you can end up with scale rot and other health issues (petri dish effect).

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Originally Posted by Annarose15

That will most likely keep the humidity TOO high (and be a waste of money compared to covering part of the screen and misting 1-2 times/day with a spray bottle). If your enclosure is humid to the point of being wet, you can end up with scale rot and other health issues (petri dish effect).

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oh lol well i learned something! how many snakes do you own? Thanks for helping me!

You could, or you guys save yourself $50 and get a tub :P

Ball pythons don't need a TON of humidity. Misting systems are used more for amphibians, chameleons, and other animals that require high (90+%) humidity or moving water to drink.

Ball pythons really only need 50-70% humidity which is easily accomplished with a daily spray. If you use a heat lamp with your tank you will notice a huge drop in humidity, so if you don't need one don't use one. Cover your screen top with something that will act as a moisture barrier. I like to use pieces of acrylic because I can still see through it :P Just leave some sort of gap for ventilation.

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

You could, or you guys save yourself $50 and get a tub :P

Ball pythons don't need a TON of humidity. Misting systems are used more for amphibians, chameleons, and other animals that require high (90+%) humidity or moving water to drink.

Ball pythons really only need 50-70% humidity which is easily accomplished with a daily spray. If you use a heat lamp with your tank you will notice a huge drop in humidity, so if you don't need one don't use one. Cover your screen top with something that will act as a moisture barrier. I like to use pieces of acrylic because I can still see through it :P Just leave some sort of gap for ventilation.

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really? so can i just use a regular bulb, so i can watch it through out the day?

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Originally Posted by MrBrute

really? so can i just use a regular bulb, so i can watch it through out the day?

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No offense intended but...watch it do what? :giggle: Ball pythons are nocturnal and spend the entire day sleeping. They will come out at night, but aren't particularly active.

If you'd like a light just for aesthetic purposes then go with a fluorescent light as they do not emit much heat, which keeps your humidity high.

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

No offense intended but...watch it do what? :giggle: Ball pythons are nocturnal and spend the entire day sleeping. They will come out at night, but aren't particularly active.

If you'd like a light just for aesthetic purposes then go with a fluorescent light as they do not emit much heat, which keeps your humidity high.

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lmao I don't know...just look at it lay there lol thanks! :banana:

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Originally Posted by MrBrute

lmao I don't know...just look at it lay there lol thanks! :banana:

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Ball pythons like to hide. If you keep them in a display it is a good idea to get two identical hides that are dark and tight fitting. They like to be hidden :P Thus why they don't make great display animals.

I totally agree. I went with a tub for my first bp and now all of mine are in a rack system.

I just went to wal-mart picked out the appropriate sized tub for my snake. Got a Under tank heater and a thermostat (thermostat is VERY VERY important). Also a Thermometer/hydrometer digital with probes to keep temperatures and humidity perfect.

Then I made 2 hides out of old Tupperware containers and used a dog food bowl as a water dish. I also used paper towel for substrate.

For ventilation in the tub I use a soldering Iron and plug it in and melt a bunch of holes in the lid and sides near the top of the tub.

Thats basically it. Most BP's tend to be shy and will stay in their hides all day. A hiding BP is a happy BP.

Not much has changed with my set up. They are all still in tubs but its a rack system now. With 11 tubs.

mrbrute, yes a 20 gallon long would work but believe me when i say this it is just a downward spiral i say this because this is how i started and i just recently swiched to some animal plastics cages.

with the glass 20 lg i was barely able to keep the ambient temp above 78 hot spot 90 with my ac set at 76 and an undertank heater with no thermostat (i know) so i ran a light bulb to boost ambient temps well when you do that there goes the humidity so you have to make adjustments and work to keep it regulated.

now i have a animal plastics t3 with two hides and a water bowl some flexwatt and the florescent light and my temps are a cozy 82 ambient and 90
on the hotspot and my humidity is sitting pretty at 65 with just the waterbowl no other rigging or towles or humid hides necessary.

i spent about 150.00 bucks setting up a glass 20long to get it where i needed it to be and still had to do extra work every two days to make it work. i could have used that money and bought an animal plastics cage first for just a hair more and not had to deal with the aggrivation of temp and humidity regulation which in my book and im sure in the snakes book is well worth the money. so in short yes it will work but in the long run spend the money up front for a t3,t8 or even their 3 or 4 tub rack and you, your wallet , and your animals will be alot happier I know me and mine are .
which ever set up you choose good luck and if you have any questions feel free to ask. i will post some before and after setup pics in a second

First off, I would like to say thanks to you. A lot of new keepers are afraid to ask for help. There is no bad question when it comes to getting your BPs environment setup correctly! If your BP is a hatchling, definitely use extra clutter in your 20L. Give them all of the security they want. I also agree that if you want to light up the tank, go with fluorescent. Good luck!

here are some pics of the before and after hope it helps

before
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/...5/IMAG0794.jpg


after
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/...ewcages012.jpg
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/...ewcages011.jpg

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it was already mentioned but they do hide all day, in the pics above there are snakes in all three pics so what you see is what i look at all day until they decide to come out later in the night usually after 12. you can see i added herpstat thermostats and timers for my flourecent lights. also that blue handled tub on the counter is what you can start your ball in if he is small.

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Originally Posted by MrBrute

oh lol well i learned something! how many snakes do you own? Thanks for helping me!

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Happy to help anyone that wants to learn. :) I have ~30 BPs, plus additional hatchlings that are for sale.

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Originally Posted by MrBrute

really? so can i just use a regular bulb, so i can watch it through out the day?

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You don't want to use a regular bulb, because you would need to turn the light off at night, when temps tend to be lowest. Use an infrared bulb (not just red-colored) or a ceramic heat emitter (doesn't put out light) so you can leave it on at all hours. As far as making a tank work, one of our members posted a GREAT DIY on how to convert a terrarium to something more BP-friendly: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...arium-Solution

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Originally Posted by 05kas05

mrbrute, yes a 20 gallon long would work but believe me when i say this it is just a downward spiral i say this because this is how i started and i just recently swiched to some animal plastics cages.

with the glass 20 lg i was barely able to keep the ambient temp above 78 hot spot 90 with my ac set at 76 and an undertank heater with no thermostat (i know) so i ran a light bulb to boost ambient temps well when you do that there goes the humidity so you have to make adjustments and work to keep it regulated.

now i have a animal plastics t3 with two hides and a water bowl some flexwatt and the florescent light and my temps are a cozy 82 ambient and 90
on the hotspot and my humidity is sitting pretty at 65 with just the waterbowl no other rigging or towles or humid hides necessary.

i spent about 150.00 bucks setting up a glass 20long to get it where i needed it to be and still had to do extra work every two days to make it work. i could have used that money and bought an animal plastics cage first for just a hair more and not had to deal with the aggrivation of temp and humidity regulation which in my book and im sure in the snakes book is well worth the money. so in short yes it will work but in the long run spend the money up front for a t3,t8 or even their 3 or 4 tub rack and you, your wallet , and your animals will be alot happier I know me and mine are .
which ever set up you choose good luck and if you have any questions feel free to ask. i will post some before and after setup pics in a second

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my goodness! So where do i buy t3 t8 from?

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Originally Posted by S.I.R.

First off, I would like to say thanks to you. A lot of new keepers are afraid to ask for help. There is no bad question when it comes to getting your BPs environment setup correctly! If your BP is a hatchling, definitely use extra clutter in your 20L. Give them all of the security they want. I also agree that if you want to light up the tank, go with fluorescent. Good luck!

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lol thanks!

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thing is I already have the tanks..I'm not trying to go out and buy t3s t8s whatever that is....i'm so confused...so much info lol

this is the web site www.apcages.com is where you will find the t3 and t8 they have other cages and racks also. there is other companies that sell cages like these but i have not dealt with them personally.i chose to switch over to the AP cages because they retain the heat and humidity better.

also i dont know if you can see it in the pic but i insulated and blacked out the top, bottom and sides on my 20 longs with the foam board they sell in the school section at wal mart its only 3 bucks a sheet and helps retain the heat and adds a little security for your ball just another suggestion if you go the tank route.

please dont get me wrong you can do a 20 long cheaper than me but just make sure you get a thermostat or at least a light dimmer for your u.t.h
this is really an important step for the well being of your snake.

*the t3 cages are the ones in the second pic posted above*

yeah but i'm on a budget and i know several people using tanks and things are fine. I just want to do this the right way..so what is the main problem in your opinion about glass tanks?

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so for a baby ball a t2 is good?

http://www.apcages.com/

My main beef with tanks is that they are for fish, not snakes.

You can make it work. Many people keep balls in tanks for their entire lives. Even a hatchling can be started in a 20g, but not all hatchlings will feed well in one.

If you want to keep the tank here are some suggestions:

1. Insulate the back and sides. I use foam core or cardboard. This helps block off the other three sides so the snake feels less exposed and helps to hold temps better.

2. Make a moisture barrier on the screen top. I think I mentioned acrylic being my favorite as it still looks nice. Leave a gap around the edges for ventilation and you are good to go.

3. A UTH that covers roughly 1/3 of the bottom of the tank, run in conjunction with a good thermostat. I would spend most of your budget here. If you have the money, the the herpstat intro. You will not be sorry!

4. Provide lots of hides and cover! This can be as elaborate or as simple as you'd like. The snake does not need pretty plants or realistic hides, but if you'd rather make a nice display than go for the fake plants and "rock cave" type hides. Don't bother buying half log hides. Fill the thing with fake plants/ branches/ hides. Whatever you want. A substrate such as cypress mulch would look nice, but it could very well be newspaper or paper towel. For my hides, I use plastic cereal bowls. Very fancy I know, haha.


The reasons why people don't like tanks is because they are nearly impossible to hold heat and humidity. Tanks are very big and 50% of that space isn't really used by the terrestrial ball python, which tends to stay close to the ground. To combat not being able to hold heat well, people end up with a humidity sucking lamp, which makes their snake have bad sheds. It is really hard to reach a happy medium with a tank, often people will just resort to increasing the room temp in order to maintain a good ambient temperature.

Also because they are so big, sometimes a smaller snake will feel unsafe and refuse to eat. This can sometimes be solved with lots of cage clutter and good hides, but not in all cases. Some ball pythons will just not eat in a big enclosure. You will have to find out what your snake likes.


*breathes out* Sorry didn't mean to write you a novel! Just thought I would be thorough XD

Well I've heard that if you use Coconut Husk substrate like EcoEarth in a glass tank then you can keep the temperature and humidity where desired.

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Originally Posted by futurebpowner

Well I've heard that if you use Coconut Husk substrate like EcoEarth in a glass tank then you can keep the temperature and humidity where desired.

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You can use whatever substrate you'd like. I personally prefer cypress mulch because it holds humidity and it isn't dirt. When it comes to a full substrate change, cleaning up dirt is a pain.

Thanks again!!