Trade value?

What would the trade value for a 1300 gram female pinstripe be?

I'd say $350-$400 ish

For a breed able female? The person I'm talking to is valuing hers at 900. So no way?

I wouldn't pay over $600 and for $600 it would need to be a really nice one.

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

I'd say $350-$400 ish

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no way is a 1300 female $350-400. i know pastel females at that size are in the $800-$900 i dont think a pinstripe would be any less

I just paid 600 for a 1250 gram

I seen a few proven breeder pinstripes for sale this year in the $800-1200 price range.

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Originally Posted by JaGv

no way is a 1300 female $350-400. i know pastel females at that price are in the $800-$900

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You can buy pinstripe breeder males from BHB for $350, Females are worth more, but not that much... you can get a 3 gene spinner blast (hatchling) for $950...

You have to take your reputation and the quality of your pinstripe into consideration. For a pinstripe of high quality coming from a reputable breeder I would say you could get at most $475. This number is based on the fact that it still short of the weight many people seek for breeding and also for the fact that it hasn’t been proven that the snake can lay viable clutches.

Also, in my opinion, you can't go around advertising this snake as a breeder yet for the two reasons I listed above. You shouldn't be breeding a female at 1300 grams. At the minimum you could do 1500 grams but even that is not the optimal weight.

Adult females are worth their weight in gold though... Even single gened

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

You can buy pinstripe breeder males from BHB for $350, Females are worth more, but not that much... you can get a 3 gene spinner blast (hatchling) for $950...

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i know males are less but a breeder size female would be worth more. so a hatchling 3 gene is $950, what would an adult 3 gene go for?more than $950 right

I trade value everything at market. You have more wiggle room when your selling for cash, but trades you wan't to make sure you price at market.

A 1300 gram Pinstripe female would sit at 900 with me as well.

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Originally Posted by JaGv

i know males are less but a breeder size female would be worth more. so a hatchling 3 gene is $950, what would an adult 3 gene go for?more than $950 right

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Yes but this is a completely different situation that should not be used to compare the price of a base morph pinstripe. This is simply because there is a lot more involved in producing a spinner blast rather than just a base morph pinstripe.

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Originally Posted by boyer.michael.s

You have to take your reputation and the quality of your pinstripe into consideration. For a pinstripe of high quality coming from a reputable breeder I would say you could get at most $475. This number is based on the fact that it still short of the weight many people seek for breeding and also for the fact that it hasn’t been proven that the snake can lay viable clutches.

Also, in my opinion, you can't go around advertising this snake as a breeder yet for the two reasons I listed above. You shouldn't be breeding a female at 1300 grams. At the minimum you could do 1500 grams but even that is not the optimal weight.

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This is not my pinstripe it is being offered to me as partial trade for a pastel calico 2012 female. I was just told she is a virgin. What do you feel would be a fair trade value on an unproven breeder like this ??

$900 is a fair trade for a virgin $1300 grams female Pin

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Originally Posted by boyer.michael.s

Yes but this is a completely different situation that should not be used to compare the price of a base morph pinstripe. This is simply because there is a lot more involved in producing a spinner blast rather than just a base morph pinstripe.

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but even being a base morph female pinstripe they go up in price as adults as well as any other adult female morph

Well since it is a trade where you would be getting the pinstripe you would have to think about a couple things to come to a conclusion of what that pinstripe is worth to you. First you need to decide if the pinstripe meets your expectations in quality. At the same time you will need to decide where this pinstripe will fit into your future breeding plans. Is this pinstripe going to be a big part of your future plans to justify the trade? The reason I am asking this is because a pastel calico goes for quite a bit more money 1300 gram unproven breeder female. That is if you go based off my calculations of it only being worth about $475 at 1300 grams unproven breeder.

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Originally Posted by JaGv

but even being a base morph female pinstripe they go up in price as adults as well as any other adult female morph

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This is true but you are not taking all the variables into consideration. For one we haven’t even seen a picture of this pinstripe so the quality of the pinstripe itself might not meet most people’s standards. Secondly, it is an unproven breeder that is not even at full adult size or even recommended breeding size. Finally, if you take the size into consideration next year at best would be when it is ready to breed which is plenty of time for the prices of pinstripes to change once again since it has seemed to be a favorite by many which has led to a huge supply of them being available.

Like I said, I was giving my opinion. Everyone is different. I just happen to be someone that wouldn't pay $900 dollars for a pinstripe female that is an unproven breeder and still isn't at even recommended breeding size. I think some may be overlooking the fact that this female still has at least 200 grams to put on before she should even be considered to breed and even then I personally would wait for her to get to at least 1800 grams but that again is just my opinion.

Yeah I too do not value the pinstripe at 900. I said the least I could take is 650 cash and the pinstripe and they said no way. So I passed not worth it to me.

This is the pic of the pinstripe
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/08/y7e5uvym.jpg

lol the serpent merchant trying to play you son!

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Originally Posted by New guy

Yeah I too do not value the pinstripe at 900. I said the least I could take is 650 cash and the pinstripe and they said no way. So I passed not worth it to me.

This is the pic of the pinstripe
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/08/y7e5uvym.jpg

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it's not a bad looking pinstripe though why did you want to trade your 2 gene for a single? but i say $650+the pin was a lil bit too much.

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Originally Posted by New guy

Yeah I too do not value the pinstripe at 900. I said the least I could take is 650 cash and the pinstripe and they said no way. So I passed not worth it to me.

This is the pic of the pinstripe
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/08/y7e5uvym.jpg

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Out of curiosity, what was the guy expecting as a fair trade or didn’t he make an offer? I feel you could definitely find a better trade than that.

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Originally Posted by boyer.michael.s

Out of curiosity, what was the guy expecting as a fair trade or didn’t he make an offer? I feel you could definitely find a better trade than that.

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300 cash and I feel the same way

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Originally Posted by JaGv

it's not a bad looking pinstripe though why did you want to trade your 2 gene for a single? but i say $650+the pin was a lil bit too much.

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Looking to make kingpins this season and been trying to sell for cash

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

I'd say $350-$400 ish

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WHAT! Hatchling Pinstripe females are still going for $2-300 depending on quality.

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Originally Posted by boyer.michael.s

You have to take your reputation and the quality of your pinstripe into consideration. For a pinstripe of high quality coming from a reputable breeder I would say you could get at most $475. This number is based on the fact that it still short of the weight many people seek for breeding and also for the fact that it hasn’t been proven that the snake can lay viable clutches.

Also, in my opinion, you can't go around advertising this snake as a breeder yet for the two reasons I listed above. You shouldn't be breeding a female at 1300 grams. At the minimum you could do 1500 grams but even that is not the optimal weight.

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There is no such thing as an optimal weight for females to breed at. It varies from one animal to the next and should be based on a combination of things such as age, weight and more importantly to me is the females overall appearance.
There have been alot of documented cases of 1200 gram females breeding and producing with no issues.

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Originally Posted by boyer.michael.s

This is true but you are not taking all the variables into consideration. For one we haven’t even seen a picture of this pinstripe so the quality of the pinstripe itself might not meet most people’s standards. Secondly, it is an unproven breeder that is not even at full adult size or even recommended breeding size. Finally, if you take the size into consideration next year at best would be when it is ready to breed which is plenty of time for the prices of pinstripes to change once again since it has seemed to be a favorite by many which has led to a huge supply of them being available.

Like I said, I was giving my opinion. Everyone is different. I just happen to be someone that wouldn't pay $900 dollars for a pinstripe female that is an unproven breeder and still isn't at even recommended breeding size. I think some may be overlooking the fact that this female still has at least 200 grams to put on before she should even be considered to breed and even then I personally would wait for her to get to at least 1800 grams but that again is just my opinion.

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The female the OP posted could easily put on 2-400 grams by the time she is out of quarantine and be more than ready to breed! Especially if she is a good eater and continues feeding up until the time she Ovys.

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Originally Posted by New guy

Yeah I too do not value the pinstripe at 900. I said the least I could take is 650 cash and the pinstripe and they said no way. So I passed not worth it to me.

This is the pic of the pinstripe
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/08/y7e5uvym.jpg

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2012 Female Pastel Calicos are going for $900-1200 depending on quality with the majority of them being $1000-1100. So you really only value the Pinstripe being offered for trade at $250-550 depending on the quality of your girl?
I could easily see that female selling for somewhere in the $7-900 range, so why not ask for $400 cash plus her for your girl?
Especially if you really want to shot for Kingpins this year!:gj:

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/08/7ydu3ege.jpg
I value this pastel calico over 1200
With this one being her sister
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/10/08/e4ypa4u8.jpg

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Originally Posted by C&H Exotic Morphs

WHAT! Hatchling Pinstripe females are still going for $2-300 depending on quality.



There is no such thing as an optimal weight for females to breed at. It varies from one animal to the next and should be based on a combination of things such as age, weight and more importantly to me is the females overall appearance.
There have been alot of documented cases of 1200 gram females breeding and producing with no issues.



The female the OP posted could easily put on 2-400 grams by the time she is out of quarantine and be more than ready to breed! Especially if she is a good eater and continues feeding up until the time she Ovys.



2012 Female Pastel Calicos are going for $900-1200 depending on quality with the majority of them being $1000-1100. So you really only value the Pinstripe being offered for trade at $250-550 depending on the quality of your girl?
I could easily see that female selling for somewhere in the $7-900 range, so why not ask for $400 cash plus her for your girl?
Especially if you really want to shot for Kingpins this year!:gj:

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I am going to have to disagree about your view on the weight. I never said it isn't possible to breed at 1300g but it does have the possibility to pose more of a risk if she doesn't gain more weight in the time it takes until she ovys. I understand that it is possible to put on the weight in a timely manner but I (and you as well unless you know something more than what was said in the original post) don't know how this snake reacts to feeding. Your basing your view off of perfect conditions but the reality is not all snakes eat well all the time and even if they do it does not mean they won't randomly stop one day and take a month break. So in perfect conditions I would agree with you but we can't just assume everything is perfect as there are often times where the conditions are not.

As for pricing, in the end it really comes down to what each person values a particular morph at and also even a particular snake within that morph. I mean there are some $2,000+ morphs that I wouldn't even buy if they were under $200 but at the same time there are some morphs that are under $500 that I would be willing to spend $2,000 on if that was what they were priced at.

Like I said these are just my opinions and not the rule. Just like what you are saying is not the rule but simply an opinion. I just happen to play things a bit more safe and would rather have more weight on my females before thinking about breeding. After all, the health of the animals is what comes first so whats the problem with waiting a little longer for some extra weight.

Didnt read the whole thread but id say $800-850 would be a very fair pirce.

On topic: If you're looking at market value on both animals, I'd say 900 value on the pastel calico and 800 on the pin. It's a nice pastel calico, but I've been shopping calicos recently and have seen similar animals being sold for 650-800.


Off topic: I've read a lot about 'optimal breeding weight' and there is nothing to suggest there are health risks to breeding a female that is appropriately aged and with the appropriate body condition. If she can't produce and lay eggs she simply won't get pregnant from the breeding.

First of all, from what I understand from doctors [pregnancy from underweight breeding] is really rare. If it’s a legitimate underweight breeding, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down.

Could not resist.

I think those people are who mentioned ridiculously low prices are people who may have the hook ups to get them at that price. I think the going retail market value for them would be $800 and over. Full grown Pastel's are even worth more that $450.

My advice to you is trade her if she fits your plans. Obviously the Pastel Calico is worth more and more useful in the future, but since you can use the Pin earlier, it may be worth it instead of waiting for for Calico to gain size.

Also, from my personal opinion 1300 grams is fine to breed as long as she is healthy. 1500 grams and over is the ideal weight but doesn't necessarily mean the healthy weight. I had 2 girls go for me under 1500 grams and they laid 6+ healthy eggs each. I also know some larger breeders down here that breed at that weight as well with success.

I got in the middle of this since I know both parties, and my suggestion to the person who owned the pinstripe was to keep it, breed it and sell a few babies and then buy a pastel calico.
It's a very nice pastel calico but letting go a breedable morph female?
No way this time of year a breedable pinstripe would go out my door to trade for a pastel calico baby.

Is the trade fair?
IMO the pastel calico is worth about the same as the pinstripe, but it makes little sense to do that trade when you could breed the pinstripe and make enough to buy 2 or 3 pastel calico's and still own the pinstripe :gj:

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Originally Posted by snakesRkewl

Is the trade fair?
IMO the pastel calico is worth about the same as the pinstripe, but it makes little sense to do that trade when you could breed the pinstripe and make enough to buy 2 or 3 pastel calico's and still own the pinstripe :gj:

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I'm with Jerry on this one. It comes down to what both of you need/want. Sale price on both animals is pretty close. Even if you value your pastel calico a few hundred dollars over the pin (which I've seen breeders ~$800-900), you could make more money than that off the pin in the first year. "Trade value" is not automatically wholesale value, which I think is the number some others have thrown out, especially if the goal is not to just flip the traded animal. Now, if your plan would be to resell the pin immediately, I can see how a straight-up trade would not be favorable against the pastel calico.

When talking trade's money value goes out the window. At this point you're simply trying to trade one animal for another, the money value isn't as important as the ratio of collection potential. Is the animal you're getting going to advance your collection and in-turn producing potential over that of the animal you own.. example, I' trade a breeder Pied female for Juvi LA or clown female..so with trades you need to focus more on the impact the trade has on your collection and nothing else..That's just the way I look at it..

Unless you needed that pin I would of passed too. That pastel calico is hot!

I would value a breeder size female at $800 plus as well.

I would vaue the pin at $800 - $900 as well. As stated earlier, I would keep and breed her and then sell the babies to buy the pastel calico. Breeder size females, even single gene, will always command a premium.

$300-400?!? :O No way!!
Babies go for $300..

I agree with $800-900 for a breeder sized female.

I paid $800 for my pin at 900g two years ago. I would say 600 in trade now. The problem is finding someone to take the gamble. I don't think I would again unless it was a gene I really wanted regardless. I had problems with my pin. The cold temp of shipping stressed her out and she went off feed for 6 months. I paid all the money to breed her that year, but lost on the gamble. It's worth a fair amount, but your market is smaller. Either way your in good position. Keep your price where you want it and keep feeding her. If you don't find a bidder. Just breeder and make some cooler stuff.

Like I said, what I stated is not the rule its an opinion. I never said there was an 'optimal' weight. I simply said that 1300g is not the weight most seek for a breeder female. This is simply based on my own experience and based off of many other breeders that I know. Also for the person who said that the weight doesn't matter as long as the snake has the proper age and body size, I can't seem to make much sense of that. I understand the age part but body size comes with weight so by saying they need the proper body size is basically the same as saying their is a proper weight.

So yes I know that breeding at 1300g is possible and can be done successfully but I personally believe it is better to wait until 1500g or more and I will continue to recommend that to anyone who asks.

But to get back on topic, I believe the two have decided to not make the trade so with that said I believe you made the right choice. If your looking to trade or sell your pastel calico, I believe you can get something much better out of it. Good luck with your future breeding plans.

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Originally Posted by boyer.michael.s

Also for the person who said that the weight doesn't matter as long as the snake has the proper age and body size, I can't seem to make much sense of that. I understand the age part but body size comes with weight so by saying they need the proper body size is basically the same as saying their is a proper weight.

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By body size, they mean the snake has good body condition. The female could be short in length, but has good muscle tone or fat reserves and still weigh under 1400 grams. Some females are just small and just never peak 1500 g. As long as the snake is mature and has a healthy weight to length ratio, breeding can be achieved no problem without complications.

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