Rescued a BP.. omg poor thing!! :(

Hi folks,

Yesterday I rescued (bought) an adult male BP. He's appx 5', haven't seen him fully extended so not sure exactly how long he is.

The owner had not fed him for 4 months, he told us a story about how once he forgot about it entirely for 10 months.... *shaking head*. The BP is skinny.. has wrinkly, loose skin and he's in a horrible shed state. He was housed in a tank, with sand substrate and judging by the lack of feeding and the amount of dead skin within the enclosure, the tank had not been cleaned in years. He had no basking light, only one hide on the warm side of the tank and the hide has a heat rock on top of it..

He came with three tanks, the one he is in which is an ugly DIY wood thing with glass inserts, one smaller glass tank and the one we're converting in to his new home which is 30"x18"x12". Still a bit too small for my liking but much better than what he has been living in. Going to have to DIY a lid, suggestions are welcome! :)

Bought some cypress bedding and a new 75w bulb for his basking light.. also picked up some frozen hoppers and 1 live hopper. A few hours after he arrived, we offered him the live mouse in his current enclosure. He instantly attacked and devoured it.

Misted the enclosure a couple times yesterday to bring the humidity up, he will have to stay in there until his new one is done.

The former owner.. and the pet store owner we got the live feed from both said to not feed him in his enclosure but to move him to a feeding tank. Well even I know this is BS but at the same time I do not want to get bit.. lol. I know to establish a feeding schedule and to not handle the BP on feed day, but what about handling after a feed? Is regurgitation a concern?

We are going to get some heavy duty leather gloves today in anticipation for the habitat move.. how would you recommend we move him while stressing him out the least amount possible? Put the gloves on and herd him in to a pillowcase? I don't really want to handle him just yet.. he's had a rough time.

I will attach some pictures of his current living situation.

iam no expert for sure but i do move all my snakes by hand to a feed box for feeding times. i have 5 right now 3 redtails and two balls.. there all fed in feed boxs and havent bite yet lol knock on wood

Feeding in separate enclosures is generally frowned upon, especially for balls as it causes unnecessary stress and is a major cause of feeding issues. There are a million threads on it here if you use the search button in the upper right hand corner of your screen. Cage aggression in relation to feeding is a myth, end of story. Look at it this way: If you feed your snake in a separate enclosure you have to put it back in, right? Well, now your snake is in "feeding mode" and you have to handle it. Perfect opportunity to get bitten if you ask me. If you feed in your enclosure and wait 24-48 hours to handle as is generally recommended, your snake is no longer in "feeding mode" and you run little risk of being bitten due to being confused for food. Snakes are very primitive animals. They aren't like a dog, cat, horse, rat, etc that can consciously distinguish between such things. They are driven by instinct only.

I highly recommend you check out http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...thon-CARESHEET and cruise the husbandry forum a bit. Lots of great advice on there.

I have checked out the care sheet but it did not mention much about handling after feeding (or maybe I missed it?)
Although I would prefer to not handle him until he's in a better state and had a chance to get used to us/our house, I have to get him in to his new habitat somehow.
As mentioned, here are some pics of his current situation.
http://s952.photobucket.com/albums/ae9/YukonChick/Saul/

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Originally Posted by MissStress

I have checked out the care sheet but it did not mention much about handling after feeding (or maybe I missed it?)
Although I would prefer to not handle him until he's in a better state and had a chance to get used to us/our house, I have to get him in to his new habitat somehow.
As mentioned, here are some pics of his current situation.
http://s952.photobucket.com/albums/ae9/YukonChick/Saul/

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Just pick him up and move him. "Herding" him will only cause him to ball up or strike defensively. If you are really worried, get a snake hook, but just picking him up will be the least stressful way for him.

Thanks annarose15. We definitely do not want to cause him any more stress.

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Originally Posted by MissStress

Thanks annarose15. We definitely do not want to cause him any more stress.

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Good luck and congrats on your new "baby"! He's obviously in a much better place already. :)

Dont be afraid of him. Just pick him up he will be ok:)

I feed all mine in the enclosure with no problems. As for moving, if one of mine look like they might want to try for a bite, I just lightly tap them on the head, typically they duck their head and tada! no longer in bite mode. Just picking him up and moving him would probably be much less stressful then trying to herd him into a pillowcase?

Thanks folks.. I'll pick him up and transfer him. Going to find the thickest gloves I can though! lol. I am generally not afraid of animals/reptiles but I do not like pain and again, don't want to stress him to the point of attacking. I will keep a look out for the strike position. Picking him up will also give me a good chance to give him the once over for mites, signs of illness and get some pics of him.

As for the pillow case herding.. I guess I watch too much tv! :)

The tank has been sanitized, cleaned and cypress substrate added. Will get a UTH and thermostat/humidity control and six live mice this afternoon, (we plan on raising his food). Still need to figure some kind of lid out for the tank. I was thinking plywood with two small doors on top (hatch style), one with mesh for the light to sit on, the other solid?

Also going to get some black poster board and cover three sides of the tank. I have painted salt water tanks in the past but that stuff is so smelly and takes a long time to cure I think we'll go with the paper method.. :)

Thanks for all your help peeps! :D

I feed my ball p's right in their tubs. The whole feed box thing seems a little strange to me, I've never had a problem feeding them in their tubs. I don't handle them at all the day I feed and at least 2 days later. Just think when you eat a turkey on thanksgiving your not really in the mood to move around a whole lot now think if you've just eat a tenth of your body weight. I don't poke my ball p's in the head either they hate that, I just stay calm and pick them up slowly and they stay calm. That's awesome that you picked up that snake he's lucky to find you and that's awesome he already eat too!

Thanks chimp54321! I couldn't believe how fast he took down his dinner!! I literally dropped it in, it walked about 4" and then he struck. About 5 seconds from drop to dinner.. lol

You won't need the basking light. For a lid...what sort of tank is it? Just a regular glass one?

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Originally Posted by Vesper

You won't need the basking light. For a lid...what sort of tank is it? Just a regular glass one?

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She might need a heat bulb for ambient temps, depending on the winter temps in the house. However, do bear in mind that you don't want to leave a light on overnight, which is probably when you'll need the extra heat the most. You can use a ceramic bulb (no light) or an infrared bulb (minimal visible spectrum light) if you do need the temp bump.

Feel the need to mention, he can probably eat adult mice. Hoppers would be so small :(

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

Feel the need to mention, he can probably eat adult mice. Hoppers would be so small :(

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I was surprised no one else picked up on this. Hoppers are for hatchlings. An adult male can easily eat a small rat while he's recovering, and then to smalledium rats the rest of his life. I wouldn't even bother with fuzzies.... That's not even a hor'dourve

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I use a combo of infared (on a dimmer) and uth (with tstat) to keep my temps where i want them. I also agree that hoppers are too small, if he's an adult he should be eating small rats. BUT if he's been underfed for a long time adult mice would be good until he puts on some weight. I would try and switch him to rats once he's gained some weight back and is recovering nicely. He may never take them though, plenty of balls out there are mousers and shun rats.

Ok, maybe I don't have my mouse age terminology right. The mouse looked like a young adult, full fur and was roughly the size of his widest part (from what I could see through the tank). He had to work to get it down! lol.

The tank is a glass tank with warped black vinyl strapping around the top and bottom. It had a strip across the centre but it looked like it had been melted by a light and was severely warped so I cut it out. Was thinking about taking the whole thing off and replacing it with 1/4"x2" wood trim and attaching the plywood top to that with latches for easy removal?

Hard to explain but it looks good in my head! :)

I'd like to chime in here honey, ditch those gloves!

One thing, he's going to HATE the feel of them, that's going to upset him and make him more likely to bite, not less. Two, a bite from a ball python is just about a joke. I've had mosquito bites hurt worse. Even if he hunger strikes you and wraps you up, he's only got tiny little pinprick teeth that are no big deal at all. Here is a link to pictures of my worst ever ball python bite: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...icture-Warning! You can see what I mean.

I agree hopper anything is going to be way to small for your guy. If you are feeding mice, he needs at least adult mice. If he's on rats, that is even better and you can give him weaned/small rats. It will look like way to much food, but believe me he can handle it. It might not even be a bad idea to start a little bit small with prey, and offer on a 5 day schedule instead of 7.

I've done rescues myself, and one important thing to share with you is this: It is very common for starved snakes to become ravenously aggressive when given food. It is not being mean, but rather inability to control themselves. If you have ever had experience with a neglected kitten or puppy, or even an adult cat or dog that bolted it's food without chewing, growling the whole time and hovering over the food bowl then you know what I mean. The snake has been without food for so long, that it takes a while for it to comprehend food is going to be regular now. I rescued a female who'd been starved for so long, she would have literally eaten until she burst if I had let her. She snapped at anything and everything that moved near her enclosure. She'd bolt down her rat and actively hunt for more. She even tried to strike at someone else's rat in the tub next to her. I named her Mori, because for the first six months I had her, that was her life. " More, more, more, more, more mommy, more!"

So fair warning, if he gets really worked up and starts striking a lot, chances are that is why. He will need time to figure out the food isn't going away again.

Gale

OK.. I just found a YouTube video and he was a bit older than a hopper but still young. There is only one place in my town to get them and that is the only size she carries. We're going to get 6 this afternoon for breeding but won't have any full adults for a while yet.
I didn't get any pics of him eating but my son did, I'll grab a copy from him so you can see the size.

Don't know if I can ditch the gloves the first time.. I don't know what to expect.. he doesn't know what to expect.
I DO want to be able to bare hand handle but I think I'll wait until he's recovered from starvation. I'll find some soft leather gloves, they'd probably feel better than my calloused man hands anyway! ;)

Posted some pics of him when he poked his head out today to the album above. Man I can't wait to get him out of that filth!!

You didn't pick him up in Portland Oregon did you?

Nope, in Canada

Ok thought u saved the one I saw on Craigslist :( sounded very similar. If I had room I'd take him

If you insist on gloves, try to find some really thin, light cotton gardening gloves. Those will allow you to handle him without too much discomfort.

I can tell you, if you've never been bitten, it IS a shock. It's kind of an "OMG he just BIT me!!!" Then you look down at your hand/finger/arm, and you go "I THINK he bit me? Didn't he? He struck at me I'm pretty sure." Then if you are really lucky, you will find a microscopic pinprick of blood, and then you go "He DID bite me! So..... what on earth was I so worried about?" Then you laugh.

I had a nice sized female pastel bite me at a reptile show. She was cranky and in blue, so she couldn't see real well. I knew she struck at me, but I wasn't worried about it. Almost 30 minutes later, I go to scratch myself with the hand she struck at, and I notice a little smear of red on my palm. I looked at it and looked at it, finally I rubbed it with my finger and realized it was blood. She'd bitten me and I never felt a thing.

The best of them is when the tiny little babies, no bigger than a magic marker, try to re-arrange your hand/face. They think they are robot guard dogs or something, just snap,snap,snap,snap. It's so hilarious because they think they are all big and bad, and if one actually connects, it feels kind of like running your finger over a burr.

The only one of mine I ever worry about biting me is my 6' long 3600 gram female. She's powerful enough to nearly dislocate my shoulder when she strikes her rat, and if she ever did get me I would know I'd been got. Of course, she's the sweetest of my collection, and I think the only way she'd ever bite me is if I wasn't fast enough with dinner for her! :D

Truthfully now, the worst part about a ball python bite is the strike. They are so darn fast, they'll make you jump a mile even when you know it's not going to hurt. Once you get past the knee-jerk reaction, a bite is really no big deal. Even the ones I've seen from people who got bitten and then wrapped, I've seen kittens do a LOT more damage. I think the only really bad ball python bite I've ever seen was some moron who was laying on the floor with his friends ball out, and he kept agitating her. Then he did the really dumb thing of letting a cranky snake get up next to his face. He got it in the eye. It bruised up really good let me tell you, but even the tooth punctures weren't bad.

The best thing for it as far as most of us believe is just to get that first bite over with. Once you really see what a non event it is, then you will be more relaxed around your snake. And when you are relaxed, so are they. I look forward to seeing you both change and grow here.

Gale

Maybe I'll make my dear, dear hubby handle him then! :) I shouldn't be freaked about it.. I stick a 3" needle in my leg weekly and I am sure that is much, much worse! I was thinking of really soft leather driving gloves but didn't buy any.
Picked up thermometer (indoor/outdoor/humidty), UTH, and an infrared bulb. 6 feeder mice and totes for them to go in to (but got the wrong lids dammit!)
Going to have to get a thermostat/dimmer for the UTH too right?

great job rescuig tat bp , I also agree that he will need bigger than mice in the near future ( if you gothe room and supplies start a small rat colony now so by the time he over the worst of his neglect you can start bumping him up to proper sized prey. I aslos think ( not sure if you managed to yet) is to allow him to soak in a tub or a large tub to help loosen the many layers of sking that appears he got stuck on .I am shocked he was able to see food yet grab it . those layers of skind will need to be worked off a little at a time ( unless they flake off in chuncks while soaking. I also would not be shocked if he not empty the water bowl overnight as rough as those pictures look.

His new home is 90% habitable. He should be soaking in his sanitized tub within the hour! ;)
I stuck my hand in long enough to get the decorations out (except hide). He looked but didn't S me. :)

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Originally Posted by MissStress

Picked up thermometer (indoor/outdoor/humidty), UTH, and an infrared bulb. 6 feeder mice and totes for them to go in to (but got the wrong lids dammit!)
Going to have to get a thermostat/dimmer for the UTH too right?

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http://www.reptilebasics.com/thermos...onics-ve-200d/ Dimming thermostat for bulbs

http://www.reptilebasics.com/ve-200 Baseline proportional thermostat

He's in! He was no problem for hubby to pick up, he balked right up. Dropped a mouse in... Being prepared to take it out when he didn't eat it and poof! Gone!
Will update pics

That'll have to wait until payday but I think we can keep a relative constant temp in the meantime, the room temp doesn't fluctuate.
Trying to find a source rats.. not an easy thing to find where I am.
Will also have to get him another hide for the cool end of the tank.
Nothing will show up if I take pics now so I'm going to wait until daylight in the morning.

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Originally Posted by MissStress

That'll have to wait until payday but I think we can keep a relative constant temp in the meantime, the room temp doesn't fluctuate.
Trying to find a source rats.. not an easy thing to find where I am.
Will also have to get him another hide for the cool end of the tank.
Nothing will show up if I take pics now so I'm going to wait until daylight in the morning.

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If you can't afford a thermostat right now, then do not even bother using your Uth. Unless its regulated, temps can reach over 100 degrees

Oh! And he's only about 30" long..the length of his current enclosure.. not as big as the guy said he was!

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I have a thermometer on top of the substrate and it's reading 28c.

You have to measure it on the glass though on the inside under the substrate. It can get well over 100 and if he burrows he can get burned. You can put the uth on a lamp dimmer temporarily, there like 10$ at any home improvement store, but never ever ever let an unregulated heat mat run.

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Originally Posted by MissStress

Oh! And he's only about 30" long..the length of his current enclosure.. not as big as the guy said he was!

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I have a thermometer on top of the substrate and it's reading 28c.

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A therMOMETER measures temperature.

A therMOSTAT regulates temperature.

Until you get a thermostat or a lamp dimmer, do NOT use the UTH.

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Originally Posted by MissStress

That'll have to wait until payday but I think we can keep a relative constant temp in the meantime, the room temp doesn't fluctuate.
Trying to find a source rats.. not an easy thing to find where I am.
Will also have to get him another hide for the cool end of the tank.
Nothing will show up if I take pics now so I'm going to wait until daylight in the morning.

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Where in Canada are you?

If you live in Alberta, like myself, you will NOT be able to find LIVE rats. They're only available in f/t.

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

A therMOMETER measures temperature.

A therMOSTAT regulates temperature.

Until you get a thermostat or a lamp dimmer, do NOT use the UTH.

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I know the difference.. thanks!

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Originally Posted by PorcelainxDoll

You have to measure it on the
glass though on the inside under the substrate. It can get well over 100 and if he burrows he can get burned. You can put the uth on a lamp dimmer temporarily, there like 10$ at any home improvement store, but never ever ever let an unregulated heat mat run.

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk 2

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It's unplugged. I'll see what I can find to regulate the temp tomorrow.

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In BC.. I meant I am looking for a source for breeding. Nobody wants their pets to be eaten. ;)

Try posting on kijiji.

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

Try posting on kijiji.

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That's part of the plan! :)

..I use a light dimmer for my uth and it stays at 91* f constant where I have the little dial. Before I got my ball python, though, I spent a good four days measuring the temperature day and night to make sure it is Reliable.

Good job rescuing the little one and good luck getting some rats. You may have to find a breeder online and have some shipped to you.

Picked up a dimmer.. Slowly warming things back up. Probe on the glass bottom. He's almost fully shed, took a dip and explored last night. :)

You don't have to tell the person you get the rats from that you're going to breed them for food. And you won't be lying if you tell them you're not going to feed their pets to anything. The rats that I keep, my breeders, are pet-like. Except for one old bitey jerk and one new momma that's really skittish, I can (and do) handle/play with them. It's just their babies that wind up in the snake tubs. I keep my colonies in big chinchilla cages and I find it's nice to be able to reach in and touch the ratlets without getting attacked by super defensive mommas anyway.

Good luck with the snake, sounds like things are going well.

My unsolicited .02 to the convo:

.01- for the lid to the enclosure, you may be able to find something in the DIY section of the forums. Also a lot of turtle hobbyists use above tank basking areas so searching turtle forums for ideas on the doors/screens and such. Disclaimer: I am not saying create an above enclosure hot spot for the snake, in fact I would advise against it. I am simply suggesting a place to get ideas for DIY stuff cause turtle hobbyists are a good source for ideas.

.02- I'd rather get bit by any snake that I have than get stung by a bee. :D