Buying hets

Just curious would you buy a 100% het if it didnt come with paper to guarantee the genetics. I have my black pastel 100%het albino came with no papers but I trust Garrick at royal constrictor designs. And the pin get albino I'm getting from BHB on Sunday might come with papers(emailed Lori) but I trust them as well. So as long as I trust the breeder I don't mind the animal not having papers. So do you?

i got my het pied and 66% pied spider from Garrick with no papers but i trust him,i would only buy hets from breeders i trust, there is too many people that would lie to you to just get your money.

Some of the big breeders will send you paperwork anyways. I know Justin Kobylka and NERD will include paperwork. When you buy from these reputable breeders, you can probably safely assume that it's het. The only reason I would really ask for paperwork is in case I want to sell that snake in the future. I want to prove that I bought that snake from so and so.

I'm not sure you can trust paperwork... You can't prove that the snake is in fact het... It's still sort of a gamble. This is why people say to buy hets from people you trust.

I will take a het if I know the person well, otherwise I will just buy a homozygous recessive animal. I was going to get a 1.2 VPI.100%VPI Axanthic from a guy that I know and trust last year for $400 but ended up not doing it since I knew was going to Afghanistan. I may end up picking up a single het female with the Axanthic that I am getting when I get home but haven't decided yet. I was going to get a steal because I know the guys and we always talk snakes, hunting, and Colorado when I see him. He is a great dude and that is why I'd buy a het from him, and I wouldn't ask for any paperwork.

Paperwork is only worth, well, the paper it's printed on. I have two het pied females from Deborah that came with a fantastic digital picture ID, which will come in handy if I ever decide to sell them (as proven, of course). However, I bought them from her because of who she is, not because she gave me a great picture with a signature on it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by h00blah

Some of the big breeders will send you paperwork anyways. I know Justin Kobylka and NERD will include paperwork. When you buy from these reputable breeders, you can probably safely assume that it's het. The only reason I would really ask for paperwork is in case I want to sell that snake in the future. I want to prove that I bought that snake from so and so.

I'm not sure you can trust paperwork... You can't prove that the snake is in fact het... It's still sort of a gamble. This is why people say to buy hets from people you trust.

---

x2

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

I would only buy hets from someone reputable and whom I trust. I would prefer paperwork just in case I chose to later sell the snake but it wouldn't be a requirement. I would much prefer to only buy visuals of course but money can be an issue, especially with morph hets.

Paperwork or not does not matter to me, the most important is to buy from someone REPUTABLE that stand behind their animals.

Anyone can print something on a piece of paper, that piece of paper is only as good as the breeder is.

Now having paperwork may help someone if they wish to re-sell their animal later on and they are not established in this industry. If will allow the potential buyer to verify the origin of the animal by contacting the original breeder. I issue paperwork for this very reason and keep pictures of the animal on file should the animal be re-sold.

I couldn't really answer this poll. If I buy a het from the breeder directly, I want paperwork with it. They can produce paperwork, so it should be no problem for them to provide it for me.

If I buy a het from someone other than the person who produced it, and they do not have paperwork, then I will accept verifying the animal with the person who produced it, in lieu of paperwork. I don't expect the breeder to make up new paperwork for me, as they sold the animal and their responsibility has largely ended.

I won't buy a het without one of those two things, and if the latter, the breeder has to be known and reputable, or I wouldn't consider it. If the former, the breeder has to be reputable, but I would consider buying from a newer breeder who may not be so well known.

I'm happiest when I have paperwork, as if/when I sell the animal, I'll be able to provide that paperwork for the person who's purchasing it from me.

The last two hets I bought were from people I've dealt with before on homozygous snakes as well as co-dominates that turned out fantastic. Paperwork means nothing to me. If I decide to sell them down the road as proven hets, I'll include the original parental information I have from the sellers, but I'll also include my own paper work proving them out when bred.

garrick is the man id trust anything he sold you and honestly if he says something is 100% and turns out it isnt he would probably replace it with another one

IMO, Paperwork is a total waste of time. Anyone can write up paperwork. If the seller is a scammer you will never get your money back no matter what the paper says. One of the biggest scammers ever (Top Shelf Exotics) were one of the first breeders offer paperwork with the captive hatched "Hets" he was selling. That said if someone buying a snake from me requests paperwork I write up and laminate the paperwork with a pic of the snake.

Was looking at buying out a collection for a very good deal (20+ snakes) many vision racks. Enough that I could of sold off everything and gotten my money back and kept what I wanted out of it.

Then I started looking at old listing from the same person talking about sickness in their animals and their hets they bought but could not 100% guarantee them. This is after they told me who they got them from (contradicting stories). I am going to pass on it.

I of course like everyone else would trust reputable person or persons but if it was a not well known person then I am going to pass. (unless I get them at a normals price and then maybe it would be worth the risk) But no matter who I got them from I would want paperwork though for if I ever did let them go I want proof.

I don't think any of the hets I have came with paperwork, other than a 66% poss het hypo male I bought. I researched and trusted the info I was able to find on the others I bought from. Paper work matters very little to me. I don't think fake hets are as prevalent as many others seem to believe, but I'm sure there are a few people here and there that have no issue misrepresenting genetics...and I think that most instances where genetics are not as they are sold are probably a result of ignorance/not understanding rather than intent to deceive.

I would like to have some kind of proof that my snake is 100% het, but isn't necessary. I try not to buy animals that I'd sell in the future anyway.
My pastel het clown girl didn't come with a photograph, but I copied and matched up the snake with the breeder site photographs and it matched perfectly.
And while there wasn't any actual paper work, the snake came with a receipt that stated what she was. And I have email correspondences from the breeder that states what she is too.

Either way, the most important thing is to buy from a reputable source.

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet is that paperwork even from a trusted and well known breeder can be worthless if you are not buying direct. There was a thread here recently where the seller offered NERD paperwork on hets that he purportedly bought from them. If I remember correctly, the buyer felt the deal was a little off but trusted the "NERD" paperwork and went through with the sale. Turns out the paperwork was never sent with the "hets" and the picture of the paperwork was revealed as fraudulent.

Thanks everyone for your answers.
Dragon- I remember that post, it sucks for that guy.
It is true that the Gaureentee is only worth what paper it is printed on, glad that's why I will only buy animals from breeders I trust that are selling me the correct anImal.
Tom

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jabberwocky Dragons

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet is that paperwork even from a trusted and well known breeder can be worthless if you are not buying direct. There was a thread here recently where the seller offered NERD paperwork on hets that he purportedly bought from them. If I remember correctly, the buyer felt the deal was a little off but trusted the "NERD" paperwork and went through with the sale. Turns out the paperwork was never sent with the "hets" and the picture of the paperwork was revealed as fraudulent.

---

The paperwork that was forged, in that case, did not have photographs of the animal and was not the legitimate NERD paperwork. Not even close. A little bit of research would have yielded that it was not the correct paperwork. Then buyer then found a thread started by the seller after the fact, contradicting where he purchased them from.

In that case, I think it's unfortunate for the buyer, but again, research is key here. A little digging and asking a few questions can go a LONG way in this industry.

On the matter of hets, paperwork would be a requirement of mine if purchased from anyone but the breeder (with confirmation of the paperwork's authenticity by a quick e-mail to said breeder), or no paperwork if I'm buying from someone I know and trust.

Hets is all about a trust, if there is any doubt in your mind then dont do it.
I do not have a plan for any hets I produce yet but I kow I wont blow smoke up anyones hind end because I value my word and honesty more than anything:gj:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vasiliki

The paperwork that was forged, in that case, did not have photographs of the animal and was not the legitimate NERD paperwork. Not even close. A little bit of research would have yielded that it was not the correct paperwork. Then buyer then found a thread started by the seller after the fact, contradicting where he purchased them from.

In that case, I think it's unfortunate for the buyer, but again, research is key here. A little digging and asking a few questions can go a LONG way in this industry.

On the matter of hets, paperwork would be a requirement of mine if purchased from anyone but the breeder (with confirmation of the paperwork's authenticity by a quick e-mail to said breeder), or no paperwork if I'm buying from someone I know and trust.

---

Even assuming it was legitimate paperwork, it would be relatively easy to Photoshop a new pic of a fake het in so I still would not trust correct paperwork with pictures from a third party seller. Someone could buy a het with paperwork from respected breeder, and then sell a hundred normal "hets" all with real actual het paperwork just with different pictures. You would have to contact the actual breeder for the het status, assuming they keep records with pictures of every snake and then have them compare the pictures. Better to just buy from the breeder in the first place if trust is an issue. If trust is there, then paperwork is just a nice extra.

The last two hets I bought came with digital PDF paperwork emailed to me which I thought was great. I don't know if PDF paperwork is common practice now but it should be. I'm sure PDF's can be doctored as well but it's probably a little harder and most importantly, there's the orignal email record.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jabberwocky Dragons

Even assuming it was legitimate paperwork, it would be relatively easy to Photoshop a new pic of a fake het in so I still would not trust correct paperwork with pictures from a third party seller. Someone could buy a het with paperwork from respected breeder, and then sell a hundred normal "hets" all with real actual het paperwork just with different pictures. You would have to contact the actual breeder for the het status, assuming they keep records with pictures of every snake and then have them compare the pictures. Better to just buy from the breeder in the first place if trust is an issue. If trust is there, then paperwork is just a nice extra.

The last two hets I bought came with digital PDF paperwork emailed to me which I thought was great. I don't know if PDF paperwork is common practice now but it should be. I'm sure PDF's can be doctored as well but it's probably a little harder and most importantly, there's the orignal email record.

---

This is why I sign my paperwork with my signature right across the picture if someone requests paperwork. Just because you have paperwork, does not mean that it is legitimate. Photoshop and other programs make it easy to doctor paperwork. I've only received paperwork on my first het purchases, which were from a breeder who I did not know. He is out of business now, so his paperwork no longer means anything to me or potential buyers. So, paperwork is really a waste of time, in my opinion but I provide it if requested.

I bought mine from Jd constriction a pair of het pieds as babies for 250 just depends on the breeder if ur buying them off Craigslist then yes I would recommend paper work which most breeders now Adays provide I just produced my first pied this year

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rallisonreptiles

I bought mine from Jd constriction a pair of het pieds as babies for 250 just depends on the breeder if ur buying them off Craigslist then yes I would recommend paper work which most breeders now Adays provide I just produced my first pied this year

---

No offended but the last place anyone should by hets from is craiglist. As for paperwork it's quite the opposite not many breeders provide paperwork for all the reasons that have been stated previously.