Severe Neck Kink - Help?

Hello all ^^

I picked up a pair of ball pythons at the Tampa Repticon, and have noticed a very severe problem with my female.

She has a very severe neck issue... I am not sure if it is merely a muscle spasm, a kink, or a possible broken bone or pulled nerve. I am really very worried about her though, as she appears to be very agitated (As if in pain) all the time, and it prohibits movement (She's always getting it caught on things.)
I have not fed her yet (She was fed the day before Repticon, which was yesterday.) and am also worried about how eating is going to work.
As far as I know, she was not like this when I first bought her. If she was, perhaps I just didn't notice it.
Possible cause? My brother was holding her on the way home and she attempted to strike at him, so he grabbed her by the back of the neck to hold her still. Could this have caused something to go wrong?

I have tried to work her spine with my fingers, and have also tried gently pulling on either side of the spot to see if it would perhaps give, but nothing. It's been two days though, so it's not a stress thing.

I really have utterly no idea what to do, and as a first time BP owner, would accept any help or opinions given.

http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/004.jpg
http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/006.jpg
http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/005.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by asingleterry

Hello all ^^

I picked up a pair of ball pythons at the Tampa Repticon, and have noticed a very severe problem with my female.

She has a very severe neck issue... I am not sure if it is merely a muscle spasm, a kink, or a possible broken bone or pulled nerve. I am really very worried about her though, as she appears to be very agitated (As if in pain) all the time, and it prohibits movement (She's always getting it caught on things.)
I have not fed her yet (She was fed the day before Repticon, which was yesterday.) and am also worried about how eating is going to work.
As far as I know, she was not like this when I first bought her. If she was, perhaps I just didn't notice it.
Possible cause? My brother was holding her on the way home and she attempted to strike at him, so he grabbed her by the back of the neck to hold her still. Could this have caused something to go wrong?

I have tried to work her spine with my fingers, and have also tried gently pulling on either side of the spot to see if it would perhaps give, but nothing. It's been two days though, so it's not a stress thing.

I really have utterly no idea what to do, and as a first time BP owner, would accept any help or opinions given.

http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/004.jpg
http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/006.jpg
http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/005.jpg

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Id suggest a trip to the vet right away. May be nothing, but don't how she could possibly eat this way. I have never seen such thing

One word....VET! That does not look very good....

Oh my god. Poor thing. Hope she's OK.

hope she's ok. did you contact the person you got her from? let us know what the vet says.

I actually got her and the male from two different vendors. I got the female first, and didn't even think of getting a receipt for him or writing down the name of the vendor (VERY illogical mistake which I have now learned to avoid next time I buy).
I'll get her to the vet as soon as possible >.< Hopefully it's something they can fix.

Surely you would have noticed something like that at the expo...? Not trying to be mean but how could you not notice something like that? The seller should have mentioned it to you too if she had a kink.
My guess is when your brother grabbed her he broke her neck. They can be fragile as babies. A trip to the vet is definetly in order for some xrays.

Keep us updated and let us know how it goes!

Wow. I did not know they could be that easily injured.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chet1028

Wow. I did not know they could be that easily injured.

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Im not saying thats definetly what it is but thats what i think it is personally.

Have you ever held a human baby? You hve to support their scrawny little chicken necks bc they dont even have the muscles to hold up their own heads. They also have a soft spot on top of their head which is basically a self destruct button lol.

It would definitely be a logical explanation, though I really hope that's not what it is >.<

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

Im not saying thats definetly what it is but thats what i think it is personally.

Have you ever held a human baby? You hve to support their scrawny little chicken necks bc they dont even have the muscles to hold up their own heads. They also have a soft spot on top of their head which is basically a self destruct button lol.

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:rofl:

Poor girl, definitely take her to the vet asap! That looks broken to me. :(

This has me thinking... Would a snake cast even be possible. Obviously it couldn't eat, but it could move...kind of.

I'm sorry, but I can't not say this: Do you really expect us to believe that you wouldn't have noticed something like that? And what was your brother doing holding the snake in the vehicle on the way home? You may not have known this being a new BP owner, but moving can be a very stressful time for snakes. As a result, they should be left alone as much as is possible within the the first week or two of having them. As for the snake, it is pretty clear that she had a pretty severe injury to her spine, and as much as it sucks she will likely need to be euthanized. I hope that is not the case but I am a realist. While I hope for the best in any situation I like to prepare myself for the worst. Best of luck and keep us updated on her.

I agree - there's no way that would have been missed when you purchased her, and I don't think that the seller is responsible for this. Your brother probably knows that he caused this injury and didn't say anything to you at the time. That has to be very painful to this baby. Let us know what the vet suggests.

I would get to a get vet right away. Not sure that they would he able to do much for her, because that looks broke from here. And I don't know for sure, as I am not a vet, but I would guess euthanization is a possibilty. Your brother probably did it when he grabbed her would be my best guess. She should have been in a snake bag for travel. I hope things turn out ok for you.

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Any updates on this animal?

Those photos made me absolutely queasy. Oh gosh. I've dealt with broken limbs before on animals, and even then I didn't get light-headed like I did looking at that animal.

I say vet, and I say seriously consider the fact that this animal may have to be put down. When my Leo broke his limb (single break, away from a joint), there was nothing the vet could do. For this, with the movement associated with a snake, the amount of moving bones there... I can't honestly see this poor girl pulling through without severe immobility in her future, difficulty eating and possibly chronic pain.

I'm so sorry that this happened. I can't say 100% if this was after the purchase or before, but considering your brother grabbed her by the neck... It doesn't take much to cause a break, or dislocation.

I really hope that you were able to get her in sooner rather than later. That would be so very painful :tears:

I have an appointment with my vet scheduled for this Friday (The soonest possible, unfortunately). I have opened myself to the possibility that I may have to put her down.
I've talked to several vets via email though so far, and all have said that it is very unlikely that the injury was caused by her being held still by her neck (Details on that, he wasn't holding her just by her neck, he supported her body as well).

@AMgsarchie: Yes, I expect it to be believed, as I have utterly no reason to tell any falsehoods here. With the way it is bent, when she is coiled up it looks completely natural, and is only see-able when she has her neck straight. My brother is in the rattlesnake industry and was holding her to check for any problems that I may not have been aware of, as he usually does when I buy my corns. She was not being held on the drive home, this was while we were still at Repticon.

She no longer acts as if she is in pain, and is very social and docile. Perhaps she was just stressed (Thus her behavior), but she doesn't act as if it pains her right now.

Vet trip. ASAP. Please dont put off the vet visit searching online for home remedies. There are none.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by asingleterry

@AMgsarchie: Yes, I expect it to be believed, as I have utterly no reason to tell any falsehoods here. With the way it is bent, when she is coiled up it looks completely natural, and is only see-able when she has her neck straight. My brother is in the rattlesnake industry and was holding her to check for any problems that I may not have been aware of, as he usually does when I buy my corns. She was not being held on the drive home, this was while we were still at Repticon.

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Well then he missed a big problem...
What part of the rattlesnake industry does he work in?

I just don't see how anyone, experienced with snakes or not would not see that while inspecting the snake. It's probably just me, but something just seems a bit off here. I hope your little one is okay :(

He typically works with Eastern Diamondbacks, though he has some experience with cottonmouths as well.

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Originally Posted by asingleterry

He typically works with Eastern Diamondbacks, though he has some experience with cottonmouths as well.

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Doing what?

Generally he studies the behavior of bred females (Diamondbacks) in the wild, though he has obtained a few breeding pairs now and hopes to begin a small breeding operation next year, if things go accordingly.

In other words he should know that snakes normally come coiled not all zig-zag like.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by asingleterry

I have an appointment with my vet scheduled for this Friday (The soonest possible, unfortunately). I have opened myself to the possibility that I may have to put her down.
I've talked to several vets via email though so far, and all have said that it is very unlikely that the injury was caused by her being held still by her neck (Details on that, he wasn't holding her just by her neck, he supported her body as well).

@AMgsarchie: Yes, I expect it to be believed, as I have utterly no reason to tell any falsehoods here. With the way it is bent, when she is coiled up it looks completely natural, and is only see-able when she has her neck straight. My brother is in the rattlesnake industry and was holding her to check for any problems that I may not have been aware of, as he usually does when I buy my corns. She was not being held on the drive home, this was while we were still at Repticon.

She no longer acts as if she is in pain, and is very social and docile. Perhaps she was just stressed (Thus her behavior), but she doesn't act as if it pains her right now.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by asingleterry

Hello all ^^

I picked up a pair of ball pythons at the Tampa Repticon, and have noticed a very severe problem with my female.

She has a very severe neck issue... I am not sure if it is merely a muscle spasm, a kink, or a possible broken bone or pulled nerve. I am really very worried about her though, as she appears to be very agitated (As if in pain) all the time, and it prohibits movement (She's always getting it caught on things.)
I have not fed her yet (She was fed the day before Repticon, which was yesterday.) and am also worried about how eating is going to work.
As far as I know, she was not like this when I first bought her. If she was, perhaps I just didn't notice it.
Possible cause? My brother was holding her on the way home and she attempted to strike at him, so he grabbed her by the back of the neck to hold her still. Could this have caused something to go wrong?

I have tried to work her spine with my fingers, and have also tried gently pulling on either side of the spot to see if it would perhaps give, but nothing. It's been two days though, so it's not a stress thing.

I really have utterly no idea what to do, and as a first time BP owner, would accept any help or opinions given.

http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/004.jpg
http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/006.jpg
http://i782.photobucket.com/albums/y...eterry/005.jpg

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you say your brother was holdin the snake on the way home, yet now you claim he didn't?

Chances are, when he grabbed her after the strike, he broke her neck

I hope the vet can help you. A hard lesson learned if the "restraining" of the snake was the cause. To be honest, mosquito bites annoy me more than baby ball python tags.

Please keep us updated. The little one is in my prayers

- - - Updated - - -

Please keep us updated. The little one is in my prayers

Quote:

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Originally Posted by asingleterry

I have an appointment with my vet scheduled for this Friday (The soonest possible, unfortunately). I have opened myself to the possibility that I may have to put her down.
I've talked to several vets via email though so far, and all have said that it is very unlikely that the injury was caused by her being held still by her neck (Details on that, he wasn't holding her just by her neck, he supported her body as well).

@AMgsarchie: Yes, I expect it to be believed, as I have utterly no reason to tell any falsehoods here. With the way it is bent, when she is coiled up it looks completely natural, and is only see-able when she has her neck straight. My brother is in the rattlesnake industry and was holding her to check for any problems that I may not have been aware of, as he usually does when I buy my corns. She was not being held on the drive home, this was while we were still at Repticon.

She no longer acts as if she is in pain, and is very social and docile. Perhaps she was just stressed (Thus her behavior), but she doesn't act as if it pains her right now.

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Quote:

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My brother was holding her on the way home and she attempted to strike at him, so he grabbed her by the back of the neck to hold her still. Could this have caused something to go wrong?

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Something doesn't jive......:confusd:

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Something doesn't jive......:confusd:

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You smell something fishy too? :fishslap:

The reality of this situation is that it dorsn't matter how the snake got injured. Fact is, is that your snake is seriously injured and needs to see a vet ASAP. Most vets will work you in in emergency situations. your snake might have to be put down. If so make sure that it is done humanely.

I am guessing here, but I say your brother, who has experience with venomous reptiles { you claim } overreacted like an idiot when that tiny little thing struck at him, he broke her neck and won't admit it, and you are too ashamed to admit you know he did it.

If he "inspects" your snakes before purchase like you claim, there is no way on God's green earth he did not see that. A blind person could find that. He hurt her by being an idiot, and he doesn't want to admit it. So he hides behind his bluff and bluster "he's too experienced to have done that" and worse, you are letting him do it.

You both need to grow up, admit what happened, do the right thing by this baby who will never recover, and do some serious thinking before you rush out and buy another. If someone who handles venomous snakes was scared of a flea bite from that tiny little baby, maybe he should seriously consider NOT handling venomous snakes. That is just pathetic.

Gale

Was your brother the one to point out the severe neck kick? Surely if he was "checking her over" like you said he would have noticed it. just letting the snakes neck run through your hands you would notice it immediately. I can understand not noticing it at a show, especially if the snake is all balled up.

Both sides of the coin disturb me. The first side being that the breeder sold you an animal with a severe neck kink without notifying you. The other being that your brother might have grabbed this fragile baby ball python with his rattle snake hands and broke its neck.

Either way, the best thing you can do is get it to a vet and get some X-rays. If I were you I would not be happy with an appointment later than TOMORROW. This is not something you just let sit and wait and see what happens. If she does have broken bones you need to know as soon as possible, if mostly for your peace of mind! Surely your vet can make a small gap in his schedule to help you out? Especially if you've explained the situation. I wouldn't think a qualified vet would be like "oh could be a broken neck, well I can get you in next week sometime". Just doesn't sound right :(

I really hope you can find out whats wrong with your little one. If it is just a spinal kink she could live a happy and healthy life (assuming she can eat) though I would never breed her.

well its Monday...please tell us what happened!!

The appointment is for this Friday silly.

Jesus Christ! That poor snake!

No idea how you deal with a break in a snake like that, but I think its probably going to have to be put down, I mean, thats the only thing I can think of..

I honestly find the idea of you not noticing it, EVEN at a reptile show to be complete bull.

I mean anyone with half a brain would see that, sure maybe not completely noticeable if the snake is balled, but most arent completely balled when in their cases and you could have seen that.

Also, dont most places require the seller to issue a receipt to the buyer so they can verify if needed when you leave that you did in fact purchase the snake and not steal it or something.. ???

I dunno, sounds like a big false story to cover up the fact that your buddy broke its neck, which is FINE accidents happen, no need to lie! Lying wont help or hinder the snake at this point, so why do it?

Interested to see what happens with the vet visit..

I havnt checked on this thread in a few and checking up on it now I can not believe what I was reading. FRIDAY!!!!! ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!!! You have an animal with a major injury and your waiting til FRIDAY!!!!! ARE YOU RETARDED? What good can happen from the time of the injury and Friday? If anything could have been done Friday may be way to late. A spine injury is not a small problem, especially in an animal that is almost all spine. I would have been at the vet before they opened the doors and made sure that they helped my animal. If they refuse, which no vet has ever refused me in a time of need, I would be en route to the next vet and the next vet and the next until I got my PET the help it needed. Heres a thought go to the animal ER. Do you know they exist?

"just a spinal kink" - Id like to give you just a spinal kink and see how you feel. I live with chronic back pain from an injury and I can assure you that it is in no way a nice living.

This nonsense about your brother deals with hots. WHO CARES? I really doubt that he holds a hot like you hold a BP. But if he is that dumb then like its already been said why is he a puss, scared of a baby BP. I have been tagged some many times by my GTP that I lost count and not once did I think of grabbing it by the neck. I take the strike, which though not bad is worse than a BP bite and chalk it up to owning a snake.

THIS WHOLE SITUATION IS ABSURD AND I LIKE OTHERS ON HERE FEEL YOUR STORY IS BS. MAN UP, ACCEPT THAT THE ACCIDENT OCCURED AND BE A RESPONISBLE PET OWNER AND GET YOUR SNAKE THE HELP IS NEEDS AND DESERVES. RIGHT NOW YOUR PROVING THAT YOU DONT DESERVE THE RIGHT TO OWN ANYTHING LIVING!!!!!

THIS MAKES ME SICK!!!!!!

Emergency animal hospital with Vets who deal with exotics. Find one.

Challenge Accepted

http://www.gcvs.com/page14/page14.html

A few locations around Houston. I have one very near me. Had to take my last Old English Bulldog there dealing with liver disease. Part of being a responisble pet owner is to know where to go for emergency care.

So are you saying his actions are right, to wait til friday?

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Originally Posted by Dwish

Emergency animal hospital with Vets who deal with exotics. Find one.

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You have been a member since April and this is what you decided should be your first post. Good call. :confuse:

Wow...

Can we keep the "verbal abuse" to a minimum? It isn't going to help the animal and it certainly won't accomplish anything with the OP either. I would leave and not come back at this point if I were the OP. Yes, it sounds fishy as all get out, but name calling and "yelling" in all caps has no place here. Neither do accusations that are based off of a few sentences about her brother's experience with snakes (even though I'll admit I don't buy it).

To the OP - if you are still there reading this thread would you mind posting an update once you get the snake to a vet? I'm sure that if you walked in to a vet that dealt with herps that you would be seen the same day.

I must have missed the "thou shall not use all caps" rule. If after all the post telling the OP to seek a vet ASAP and they make an appointment for a week later isn't a time for all caps, I'm not sure when is.

You deal with animal cruelty with your little soft words and I'll deal with it with my hard BIG words.

If the OP is gone from here I hope its because they decided they are not fit pet owners.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mackynz

The appointment is for this Friday silly.

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Do you live in Tampa? Because if so, you have several options for qualified herp vets. There are two at Petsmart on Bruce B. Downs, and a wonderful herp vet named Dr. Schat at VCA on LaDue Lane off Dale Mabry. I know for a fact Dr. Schat would take you in IMMEDIATELY if you told him the condition of this animal. When my BP had an RI, he took me in same day and stayed over an hour late to do so. He's fantastic and I highly recommend him.

Find a different vet who will take you like NOW. There are other options besides some vet that won't look at an seriously injured animal until the end of the week!

Yeah, that's just unacceptable, IMO. If your dog had a kinked neck he'd be whining and crying in pain! Just because snakes can't tell you when they're in pain doesn't mean they aren't and it isn't up to you to decide whether they are or not. Assume the worst and get that snake to the vet YESTERDAY! No way would I have an animal in that condition in my care without a vet visit ASAP. You are responsible for a life, here!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KMG

You have been a member since April and this is what you decided should be your first post. Good call. :confuse:

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You have only been a member a few weeks and you decided that you should point out this user's first post. Good call.......:rolleyes:

Yeeeeeeeeeeee..... :X

That kind of looks a lot like this:

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forum...ine-x-ray.html


I suppose the "kindest" answer would be a deformity that happened in the egg.....but can she even eat like that?

IMO there's no way someone would be ballsy enough to purchase a table at an expo and sell an animal in that condition to someone. Anyone who breeds ball pythons and sees that come out of the egg would cull the snake on the spot. Why would you risk your entire breeding reputation to sell a small normal? The value of the snake is under 75 dollars. It definitely looks like its neck is broken to me. If that's the product of mishandling a scared, new, delicate pet of yours then shame on you or whoever did it.

As stated, it doesn't matter at this point when or how the snake became that way. Euthanize it humanely. That's what the vet is going to do.

Source: I emailed my sister, who is a vet (albeit not a herp vet), to look at the pictures. She was quite upset :rage::rage::rage: about the idea of waiting another second to get that animal to a vet. If you're unwilling to find an emergency solution, the best course of action is to humanely euthanize it yourself.

Please do the snake the favor of asking some questions before attempting that, if that's the route you choose.

This thread really makes me sad.

I think everyone needs to take a step back and relax. I know that these images bring up some uncomfortable feelings for us but we need to put everything into perspective. The OP is not likely to come back here and give us some follow up (which I know everyone would like) if we keep name calling and pointing blame. I doubt this person wants any harm to come to her new snake. She is here looking for help. Name calling, "yelling", and other harsh statements are not helpful. Remember there is a person on the other end of this who is reading these comments! It's easy to say mean things to an inanimate object like your computer. I doubt you would say such harsh words in person. Face to face conversation is much different.

They are the one with the injured snake who has to read the comment "just put it down" over and over again. I bet that isn't something you would want to hear, even if it is true.

I'm giving this person the benefit of the doubt. All we have are a few pictures and a few lines of text. We can't make a diagnosis based on that. We can make some logical inferences, but that is about it. Obviously the first thing this person should do is get to a vet. We still don't know whether or not they have so don't just assume they haven't. Not everyone is on the forum 24/7 like me. :)