Super Pastel or Super Pastel Lesser

Picked this one up at a show. Hasn't even had it's first shed yet. I know I'm taking a risk buying a snake without even having it's first meal but I got a good deal on him

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/2602/splv.jpg

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So... Does it have the lesser gene?

Thanks

I don't see lesser, and why would you buy a snake that hasn't even had its first shed?

Edit: nevermind you already answered my question, but it seems like a huge risk. One I personally wouldn't take. Good luck and give us a pic once it sheds.

What was it sold to you as?

There's no problem buying a snake without having its first meal. Many times I've bought pre-shed animals and they did better than snakes that were already feeding. It's just professional courtesy for most breeders to sell their animals after having the first couple of meals so as to guarantee a healthy snake, but I haven't seen or heard any ill effects of either/or.

The parents were a lesser/pastel and a pastel. The seller orginally had it marked as Super Pastel Lesser but was a little unsure if it had lesser in it so he discounted it.

I would recommended waiting until it sheds first before asking so we can all see the true colors of the snake.

From the current photo, I'm not sure. It seems a lot more reduced in pattern compared to the average super pastel, which is more typical of a lesser influence.

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I cant believe they sold it to you before it even had its first meal. Doesnt sound like any body I want to do business with...

No Lesser in that one...Still Nice though!

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Need a better picture but it's absolutely gorgeous regardless!


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Originally Posted by satomi325

I would recommended waiting until it sheds first before asking so we can all see the true colors of the snake.

From the current photo, I'm not sure. It seems a lot more reduced in pattern compared to the average super pastel, which is more typical of a lesser influence.

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*sings* I see your true coloooors and that's why I looooove you so don't be afraaaaaid to them show.

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looks like a super pastel lesser to me honestly, bands being that dark and it being more yellow than any fresh born super I've seen. like everyone else I would wanna see post shed pictures, but my vote goes toward super pastel lesser.

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Originally Posted by steeler

The parents were a lesser/pastel and a pastel. The seller orginally had it marked as Super Pastel Lesser but was a little unsure if it had lesser in it so he discounted it.

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Was the pastel paired with a pastel and a lesser male? Like 2 different snakes? Or was the pastel paired with a 2 gene Pastel Lesser male?

I'd call it a Super Pastel.

Super Pastel...No Lesser. 100% positive. I prefer to buy a snake before it has had it's first meal or shed. You can get them much cheaper and they get established quicker. just my experience.

how much did you pick him up for? just curious

Super nice Super Pastel!

I'll post pics after it's shed. I know it's kinda hard to tell till then, but I thought I would try. He looks very much like the pics on WoB for Lesser Super Pastel.

I picked him up for $450. My thoughts were if it's a Super Pastel Lesser then I got a steal, if not then I got a really nice super pastel which I don't have in my collection. It's a bit much for a super pastel, bit at least its a nice one.

Dad was a Pastel Lesser and mom a Pastel... at least that's what the seller said.

I took a different pic to hold us over until he sheds.

http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/563/spl2.jpg

I'm guessing super pastel lesser

Awesome super pastel, but not seeing any lesser in there...

Im gonna also vote super pastel lesser. The marking scream lesser to me. If not thats one killer super pastel.

Super pastel, I'm not seeing any lesser at all there.

Very nice Super Pastel, that's a bit high of a price for one but at least it's a nice one.

I've also bought plenty of snakes in the past that hadn't even had their first shed yet and most of them did just fine. Often better then some 'well started' babies I've bought in the past. Of course then you're taking a risk (a fairly low risk) that it will not thrive, but what fun is a hobby without risk?

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Originally Posted by Andybill

I cant believe they sold it to you before it even had its first meal. Doesnt sound like any body I want to do business with...

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Why not? As others have said, there is nothing wring with buying an unstarted bp, as long as thats how it is advertised. The only problem would be if they sold it as shed and feeding when it wasnt yet.

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Originally Posted by aalomon

Why not? As others have said, there is nothing wring with buying an unstarted bp, as long as thats how it is advertised. The only problem would be if they sold it as shed and feeding when it wasnt yet.

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True there's nothing wrong with it. But most reputable breeders wait till they know the animal is feeding readily before selling to limit negative feed back. If you continually sell animals that way, your bound to have some problem animals.

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Originally Posted by Rob

True there's nothing wrong with it. But most reputable breeders wait till they know the animal is feeding readily before selling to limit negative feed back. If you continually sell animals that way, your bound to have some problem animals.

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I'll have to disagree with that. For one, buying an unstarted animal shouldn't lead to any negative feedback because the breeder didn't screw up. That's like saying you should only sell proven breeders because otherwise eventually you are going to sell an animal that doesn't breed.

Second, by selling an unstarted animal you don't face the trouble of having to mirror exactly how the breeder was feeding. I have had multiple bps that I've bought where there was some small difference between the breeders feeding style and mine and so I had to go back and try to trouble shoot what it was to get the animal to eat.

Agreed! I don't personally care if the animal is feeding or not as long as this information is disclosed. Lots of breeders offer nice discounts on non started animals so that's kinda nice. I think if both parties agree to the terms of the sale then all is hunky dory. Other people shouldn't be saying things like "well a respectable breeder would..."


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I know I'm a little late but that's a sexy super pastel, I don't see lesser there but feel free to ship it my way ;)


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1.0 normal bp- Blitz
1.0 Nicaraguan boa- Gavin
0.1 Red Tail Boa- Tara

I personally think it is lesser.
I think since it's shed it will become very evident. He's still got his hatch colors and I reckon he'll look a lot creamier once he sheds out.

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Originally Posted by aalomon

I'll have to disagree with that. For one, buying an unstarted animal shouldn't lead to any negative feedback because the breeder didn't screw up. That's like saying you should only sell proven breeders because otherwise eventually you are going to sell an animal that doesn't breed.

Second, by selling an unstarted animal you don't face the trouble of having to mirror exactly how the breeder was feeding. I have had multiple bps that I've bought where there was some small difference between the breeders feeding style and mine and so I had to go back and try to trouble shoot what it was to get the animal to eat.

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Agree 100% I have bought all stages of BP's and by far without question, the healthiest, best eaters are the ones I bought right out of the egg before their first shed and feeding. I set the conditions and they get use to the way "I" do things. I bought an entire clutch of Orange Ghosts. all but one ate great. I assist fed the no-eater twice and she kicked in on her own after that and is now up with the rest of them.
I bought a well started Lesser girl from BHB, a very well know breeder, and she ate for me once and shut down. She is VERY skittish. I may have to return her. Brian is very understanding and helpful. I think since she was well started (500 grams) and spent several months at his facility is what made her adjustment so difficult. His place is a huge warehouse where the lesser girl rarely if ever had contact with anyone. My house is a lot different than the BHB warehouse.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aalomon

I'll have to disagree with that. For one, buying an unstarted animal shouldn't lead to any negative feedback because the breeder didn't screw up. That's like saying you should only sell proven breeders because otherwise eventually you are going to sell an animal that doesn't breed.

Second, by selling an unstarted animal you don't face the trouble of having to mirror exactly how the breeder was feeding. I have had multiple bps that I've bought where there was some small difference between the breeders feeding style and mine and so I had to go back and try to trouble shoot what it was to get the animal to eat.

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There's an upside to a lot of things it doesn't mean there isn't the alternative as well. All I'm saying there's a reason Breeders like BHB are so successful, they avoid shipping out a problem product as much as possible. And by making sure there animals are feeding they are taking one less risk.

Ok, since I was the first to say I think its risky let me explain. I don't think buying a snake before its first shed is bad. What I think is risky is why would you put a snake under stress of transporting it from point a to b have it sit on display then have several interested parties handling it only to say no thanks and walk on then take it from point b to c. Then have it shed out and hope its calmed down enough to take its first meal. Then what if it has to be assist fed by a person who doesn't know what they are doing (not saying the OP doesn't). Plus OP paid 450 for a snake that might be just super pastel and IMO that's too much. To each his own, I know. And I still think its just a super pastel, reduced pattern can be passed with out passing a mutation. I've seen normal babies from a lesser x normal clutch with reduced pattern.

I don't believe either side of the topic is wrong. There are reasons to say you will buy a animal before its "started" and there are also reasons to support not wanting to.