funny yet sad feeding attempt...

i dont know if most of u remember from previous post, but i have a fear of rodents, and feeding my BP is a big ordel for me, and consists of me wearing leather gloves and opening the little box thing the mouse comes in and pushing him into the tank, if he dosent take it it takes me like a hour and a few drinks just to dig into the tank (while still wearing my leather gloves of course) and grabbing that disgusting rodent by the tail and placing him back into the box and disposing of it. Well i havent had any issues lately cuz of course my BP has been fasting and mainly eating 1 mouse a month, 1 out of the 3 or so i offer, well he has come out of, or atleast i thought so, his winter fasting and has been out of his hide alot and took one mouse down with authority, and showed he was still hungry so 2 days later fed another and destroyed it, and then another again in 3 days. So i was like good, finally hes come out of it, and 5 days later i tried again, well this time he did not go for it. So of course after 5-10 minutes of not showing much interest in the mouse, and retreating back into his hide after the mouse got close to him i knew of course he wasent gonna take it. But ill be damn, if this was one of those "smart" mouses, u know the ones that get up close to the snakes head, takes a wiff, realizes that he is in a tank with a predator then runs away, well this mouse was the worse, i was trying to grab his tail but as soon as i got close he did one of those fast sprints to get away from my hand like a house mouse does when u turn on the lights. Then after a few minutes of me trying to catch him, he really got scared and started jumping trying to escape! At that point i was like dammit, trying to catch him but as soon as he tried to jump up and out of tank i immediatley jerked away. Meanwhile my bp is neatly tucked and barricaded in his hide. Well finally i had to, yeh this is embarassing, but i had to take a piece of plexi glass from my previous setup and used it to slide into the front of the hide of where my bp was to ensure he could;t get out, and i, yes, threw in a glue trap on the side by where the mouse was, the manipulated him with this long rod from the curtains in my room to run around until he finally got caught in the glue trap where i finally was able to snatch him up.

I feel like i should be wearing a skirt. Anyways just a embarassing moment i felt like sharing. Atleast none of you guys can laugh right to my face :oops:

You should only be feeding him once every 5-7 days :/

i knew somebody would point that out. No worries, im not a newbie BP owner, i know what im doing, and yes, u are right the last 3 feedings were too close together, but IMO its justified, given he is at nearly 1100grams, turned 1 in may, and has been feeding the last few months on 20-30g mouses once a month and LOOSING weight; Not significantly, but still there has been weight loss. I have not been feeding him like this always, this has been the only time i fed him 2 days later after a feeding, and that was because i SHOULD have fed him 2 mice that day, but i did;t think he was gonna take it at all so it was only one, the second feeding was a bit to soon (2 days) but the third feeding was at a descent 4 days wait. And the one he refused was 5 days later.

He should be eating rats - which are far easier to handle. Mice are the biggest pain - I hate them. A rat I don't mind handling at all, you rarely get biters, and most are extremely friendly and almost sweet.

You need to bump this snake up to rats. You're underfeeding the heck out of him - and you say he's losing weight. A medium sized rat every two weeks or so is where he should be (experts should check me on this), it's borderline abuse to underfeed this guy like that.

If the mice scare you, why don't you feed f/t? And please make your posts more literate. It's ridiculous, your punctuation, when you prove yourself capable of using words like "significantly", "justified" and "disposing" correctly. You're clearly not dumb, stop typing like you are. (Harsh, perhaps, but there is no excuse for it)

I'd put him on rats, actually...I'd put him on frozen/thawed rats! If you don't like rodents I think dead ones would be a LOT easier to handle. :)

What dragonsong said!

x2 what dragon said

wow, what turned out to be a quick post about a funny situation turned serious quick, but I will explain.

HaikyFin,

I’m not a English professor like you, but I am pretty sure the definition of the word abuse goes something along the lines of you purposely intended harm. As in I know I should be feeding him rats but just don’t care to do so and keep feeding him mice, or as in, I know his humidity is supposed to be above 50's but I am too lazy to spray his tank down, as in, I am sitting by letting him starve and KNOW it and just don’t care to do anything about it. That sounds about right for abuse. Here is what doesn’t sound like abuse. His setup up is PERFECT. And when I say perfect, I seriously mean perfect, and you can see it in the pictures in my profile but ill run it down real quick for you. 29g H aquarium, 1/4 inch plexi glass cover under the cage top to keep in humidity in, 2 digital thermometer, one in the cold side and one in the hot side, 2 Identical hides, aspen bedding with plenty of decor to make him feel secure, a water dish big enough for him to do what he wants with it (drink, soak, whatever), a ultratherm UTH on the warm side hooked up to a herpstat keeping it at a steady 88-89 degrees so says my PE-2 Temp gun, temperatures which I check every 2 days. Oh and the back and sides of the tank are blacked out. Ambient temps are checked twice a day if not more if I am not working that day, and fresh bottled water in the water dish which is changed everyday (I work for coca cola so I get free cases of water). And HaikyFin a whole paragraph on how I need to correct my spelling and punctuations on my post? I mean you actually sat there and wrote a whole paragraph just to point that out? Seriously???

Folks for the year or so I was on this board I never knew I had to spell check and make sure my grammar is spot on, I though the important thing here was to talk about the issue your having and get some feedback from members that have been thru this and can help.

Dragonsong93,

I have tried switching him over to rats, he actually was destroying small rats within the first few months I got him but he slowly started turning them down. Right before winter he just never took them at all, he would come out of his hide during feeding time take a few licks at the rat and retreat to his hide. With a mouse he would come out take a few licks then strike so I know the reason he wasn’t taking them was BECAUSE they were rats. I tried the leaving a rat in dirty mice bedding overnight trick a few times and still got nothing. So it came to a point where it was either mice or he would not eat. So it seemed best to just give him what he wants, since its better he eat something then nothing at all, you know BP's are picky eaters as it is, I was just reading on a post about how one guy just had his BP come off a 9 month hunger strike, and I would rather be the guy who has a BP that even though is not eating what he should be eating, he’s at least eating something every few weeks, as supposed to nothing for almost a year.

As far a f/t my living conditions wont allow it. I live in a small cramped pretty much studio apartment and I simply cannot have a pack of dead rats in the fridge I use (which I share) The only way that would ever work is if I was to go to petland and buy a pack of f/t and just use one of them and throw away the rest. So that’s not going to happen.

Now I have to copy this whole post and paste it onto my MS Word, spell check it, and paste it back here. I wouldn’t want to get a F on this post from Professor HaikyFin!

Okay, there is no need for this type of conflict. I don't understand why things like this always turn into fights. HaikyFin -- this isn't YouTube comments, it's a forum. I see no need for correcting the OP's grammar the way you did. It's impertinent to the topic and very rude.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

29g H aquarium, 1/4 inch plexi glass cover under the cage top to keep in humidity in, 2 digital thermometer, one in the cold side and one in the hot side, 2 Identical hides, aspen bedding with plenty of decor to make him feel secure, a water dish big enough for him to do what he wants with it (drink, soak, whatever), a ultratherm UTH on the warm side hooked up to a herpstat keeping it at a steady 88-89 degrees so says my PE-2 Temp gun, temperatures which I check every 2 days. Oh and the back and sides of the tank are blacked out. Ambient temps are checked twice a day if not more if I am not working that day, and fresh bottled water in the water dish which is changed everyday (I work for coca cola so I get free cases of water).

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Sounds good! ;) It's always helpful when trying to determine the source of a problem to know a snake's setup. The source isn't your setup, it would seem. :gj:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

Folks for the year or so I was on this board I never knew I had to spell check and make sure my grammar is spot on, I though the important thing here was to talk about the issue your having and get some feedback from members that have been thru this and can help.

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I agree with this completely.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

As far a f/t my living conditions wont allow it. I live in a small cramped pretty much studio apartment and I simply cannot have a pack of dead rats in the fridge I use (which I share) The only way that would ever work is if I was to go to petland and buy a pack of f/t and just use one of them and throw away the rest. So that’s not going to happen.

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You could always get a cheap mini-fridge and stuff it in a corner somewhere. That's a great way to keep f/t separate from food and save space.

I think you could be a little more open with trying feeding techniques, but otherwise, you're doing fine. There is no wrong way to feed. It's not awful to feed him as often as you do, considering mice won't take long to digest compared to rats. As long as he's eating something, that's good. You can't overfeed a BP on a diet of mice. If you ever decide to try f/t, a little zombie dance goes a loooong way. I think it would be worth trying in your situation.

rebelrachel13

yeh, i usually dont get so defensive, but when i see the word "borderline abuse" used towards me, i just lost it. I give so much for my BP, time, money, well everything, and go out of my way to make sure he has it all and that he is happy and healthy, to have somebody say something like that, no way.

anyways moving on from that, the small fridge setup up also wont work, as where i live i dont even have a a/c cuz this building is so badly put together (i live in NYC) that since every other tenant has a a/c and the abusers on the 1st floor have 3 a/c in one apartment, if i connect anything that sucks up so much energy (such as a a/c or fridge in this case) it flips the breakers and everything shuts down. Hell, i barely get away with a space heater in the winter time when the regular heat dosent work.

I'am going to try a small rat again, just to see if i get lucky, but i usually do not like to do that, because if i throw in a rat and he refuses, he usually gets into like a panic mode for like 10 days, where he wont even come out of his hide at all. As opposed to mice, where if he refuses a mice, i can try again in 4 days and he might take it. But ill take a chance and give it one more try. I might get lucky, its been a long time since i offered a rat. Maybe he forgot he dosent like them :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rebelrachel13

Okay, there is no need for this type of conflict. I don't understand why things like this always turn into fights. HaikyFin -- this isn't YouTube comments, it's a forum. I see no need for correcting the OP's grammar the way you did. It's impertinent to the topic and very rude.

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I agree that he was harsh, but I also found this very hard to read.

It is good that this didn't devovle into a flame war though.

If you're that squeamish with the rodents, why did you buy a rodent eating pet? Why didn't you buy one that was eating F/T?

You mention 'disposing' of the food when the snake refuses. If your using a glue trap to remove them from the tank, I'm really disturbed by the thought of how you 'get rid' of them. What did you do to the mouse after you stuck it to a trap? What was the problem using leather gloves and 2 hands to grab it again?

You're obviously entitled to disagree, but since this is a discussion forum I'm entitled to share the opinion that you're pursuing the wrong hobby for yourself. Do yourself the favor and pass the snake on to someone who is comfortable providing proper care for both the snake and its feeders. They are sacrificing their life so your pet can eat, voluntary or not. The least you could do is treat them humanely.

It's normal for adult males to go off food over the winter, but they should pick up eating in the late spring, and develop a real appetite at that point. May be time to try rats again!

If his appetite does NOT pick up significantly, then it should be vet time, for a fecal check. Once he's back on food, a 5 day schedule should be great--pack the food on, as much as he will eat, since he is likely to fast next winter, too.

MrLang

Where do i start, with you. First you say "If you're that squeamish with the rodents, why did you buy a rodent eating pet?" Without loosing my temper and saying things that will make me the bad guy here, i will just say this, the same reason why i joined the army in a time of war. Just like your stupid comment, people used to ask me the same stupid question, instead of going to school or getting some other job, why get a job where you will be sent to war and be blown up? Unfortunately i joined not just for the benefits but to be able to say that i made a SACRIFICE and fought to defend the freedoms of "people" like you. When i say unfortunately i do not mean i regret my time in the army, i say i regret when i encounter stupid ignorant people, and not just you, just any general scum bag i meet, that makes me question "wow, did i really sacrifice the possibility of loosing my life to defend people like this?

I like BP's, i dont like rodents, the joy of owning a BP outweighs the SACRIFICE of having to deal with a rodent once a week. Understand? Its called a making sacrifices.

you say "You mention 'disposing' of the food when the snake refuses. If your using a glue trap to remove them from the tank, I'm really disturbed by the thought of how you 'get rid' of them. What did you do to the mouse after you stuck it to a trap? I only used the glue trap deal once, which is why i made the post cuz it was a funny situation. And here is the best one "They are sacrificing their life so your pet can eat, voluntary or not. The least you could do is treat them humanely. "

Wow, if u care so much about being humane to mice, , WHY DO YOU OWN A MOUSE EATING PET, THAT BITES AND STRANGLES A MOUSE TO DEATH TO SURVIVE?


and last but not least "Do yourself the favor and pass the snake on to someone who is comfortable providing proper care for both the snake and its feeders."

do YOURSELF a favor and be like those PETA folks that dont wear fur and protest the sale of leather and fur, and give away your rodent murdering pet to somebody else, since clearly you care so much of the life and "humane" treatment of rodent.

Sorry guys, first i get a "borderline abuse" and now this guy? one can only endure so much before just loosing it and being angry. :mad:



Wingeswolfpsion,

yeh he has picked up his appetite alot, its just he did this one refusal, i mean he did take down 3 mouses within a 11 or so day period so its not odd that he did refuse, and today he did take down another mouse with authority, ill probably try next week a rat to see what happens, but im not posting any more on this thread, im starting to get more stressed out than my BP with some of the "people" making stupid comments.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

MrLang

Where do i start, with you. First you say "If you're that squeamish with the rodents, why did you buy a rodent eating pet?" Without loosing my temper and saying things that will make me the bad guy here, i will just say this, the same reason why i joined the army in a time of war. Just like your stupid comment, people used to ask me the same stupid question, instead of going to school or getting some other job, why get a job where you will be sent to war and be blown up? Unfortunately i joined not just for the benefits but to be able to say that i made a SACRIFICE and fought to defend the freedoms of "people" like you. When i say unfortunately i do not mean i regret my time in the army, i say i regret when i encounter stupid ignorant people, and not just you, just any general scum bag i meet, that makes me question "wow, did i really sacrifice the possibility of loosing my life to defend people like this?

I like BP's, i dont like rodents, the joy of owning a BP outweighs the SACRIFICE of having to deal with a rodent once a week. Understand? Its called a making sacrifices.

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I respect what you have done for our country. I don't see how that sacrifice is even close to being on the same level as dealing with a rodent once a week... The things you probably saw and you are squeamish about a rodent? I don't get it. I guess as you said, you joined up for the benefits and to be able to tell people you did, not out of a sense of dedication to the country. If that was it I would have thought that would have been the first thing in the list.

Finally, I will recommend with the heaviest of sarcasm that you use Snake Sausages, delicious and nutritious.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HaikyFin

He should be eating rats - which are far easier to handle. Mice are the biggest pain - I hate them. A rat I don't mind handling at all, you rarely get biters, and most are extremely friendly and almost sweet.

You need to bump this snake up to rats. You're underfeeding the heck out of him - and you say he's losing weight. A medium sized rat every two weeks or so is where he should be (experts should check me on this), it's borderline abuse to underfeed this guy like that.

If the mice scare you, why don't you feed f/t? And please make your posts more literate. It's ridiculous, your punctuation, when you prove yourself capable of using words like "significantly", "justified" and "disposing" correctly. You're clearly not dumb, stop typing like you are. (Harsh, perhaps, but there is no excuse for it)

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Man, you need to chill. Yeah he could be feeding a med. Rat, but mice are great for problem feeders. It isn't abuse, so shut it! :rage: Second of all, who cares about the grammar. He wasn't asking how to write. He was telling a story, I'd guess that's why you decided to let your curiosity get the better of you. So quit your pettifogging and your criticism. Don't talk as if you're his hierarchy. This transcendental-type arrogance pisses me off!!! He's not inferior to you my majesty, so don't control him! It's a forum, not a 3 page essay to Mark Twain!!!

mackynz

i did not bring that up to compare, its just when he said "why own a snake when u dont like rodents" it reminds me so much of when people used to ask me "why join the army when u can die" Im not saying its in the same level, its just something that popped in my head right away, because when i was 21 and enlisted, everybody and there mother was asking me the same question, i just kept hearing the same question over and over, why did get into such a dangerous job when u have so many options. And when i bought my third BP (after not owning one for years) i was also hearing the same question. "hey, arent u afraid of rats? how are you gonna buy a BP when your afraid of rats bro??" Same thing here.

And like i said it wasent just the benefits, it was the fact that i can say i contributed to something. I stood out in society. I went above and beyong if you will. That was very important to me, if not just as important as the benefits (i.e my family being taken care of)

wow, this post is really getting way of the subject.

Everyone leave the guy alone, okay! He is another guy that loves the snakes, but not the rodents. Wow, that sure is shocking isn't it?!!! That was sarcastic!!! Just quit the instigating. Quit picking' on other people, and leave. I'm assuming there's a no cursing rule on the forum. I would love this forum because people give great advice and comments; but, there are a lot of jerks that just criticize and judge. You aren't any better than anyone else! So quit being arrogant, and SHUT UP!!!:rage:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

mackynz

i did not bring that up to compare, its just when he said "why own a snake when u dont like rodents" it reminds me so much of when people used to ask me "why join the army when u can die" Im not saying its in the same level, its just something that popped in my head right away, because when i was 21 and enlisted, everybody and there mother was asking me the same question, i just kept hearing the same question over and over, why did get into such a dangerous job when u have so many options. And when i bought my third BP (after not owning one for years) i was also hearing the same question. "hey, arent u afraid of rats? how are you gonna buy a BP when your afraid of rats bro??" Same thing here.

And like i said it wasent just the benefits, it was the fact that i can say i contributed to something. I stood out in society. I went above and beyong if you will. That was very important to me, if not just as important as the benefits (i.e my family being taken care of)

wow, this post is really getting way of the subject.

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I misunderstood you then, I apologize. It came across as you being one of those people who signs up for show. Some of us are quick to anger, and I apologize.

Quote:

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I misunderstood you then, I apologize. It came across as you being one of those people who signs up for show. Some of us are quick to anger, and I apologize.

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there is no need to apologize, its cool. If anything i should be apologizing because im the one keeping this going, i should have just let these guys say the things they said and just kept quite and let the post die, i let my anger get to me, and i fired back.

Quote:

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I would love this forum because people give great advice and comments; but, there are a lot of jerks that just criticize and judge. You aren't any better than anyone else! So quit being arrogant, and SHUT UP!!!

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yes! whats going on here, i remember a year or so back when i REALLY had some dumb questions, i would always get a great response from the people on this forum, i don't know if some of these guys are new members or something, but boy, they are quick to insult you and say u dont know what you are doing. I mean wow, im hearing "abuser" and "give your BP to somebody who knows better" damn, these guys are something else. What ever happened to "you did this and that wrong and here is how u fix it".

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

there is no need to apologize, its cool. If anything i should be apologizing because im the one keeping this going, i should have just let these guys say the things they said and just kept quite and let the post die, i let my anger get to me, and i fired back.



yes! whats going on here, i remember a year or so back when i REALLY had some dumb questions, i would always get a great response from the people on this forum, i don't know if some of these guys are new members or something, but boy, they are quick to insult you and say u dont know what you are doing. I mean wow, im hearing "abuser" and "give your BP to somebody who knows better" damn, these guys are something else. What ever happened to "you did this and that wrong and here is how u fix it".

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First of all Thank you for your service.:gj:
second , I can't get the picture of a man dressed in a skirt throwing sticky traps at a mouse while standing on a coffee table,:taz:
funny stuff!:rofl:

It's the opposite for me lol i love the rats, they're cute to me. But i got a snake that eats rats so i gotta do what i gotta do :)

I bet if I had to feed spiders to my snakes I would be in a similar position!

I do think it is a little funny you are scared of rodents, they are so tiny and cute! They are probably way more scared of you than you are of it.

As for the random criticism from people, just brush it off. It doesn't seem to me like you are doing anything wrong. I particular dislike it when people tell others they shouldn't own a snake for such and such reason. Who are we to tell you what you should and shouldn't do? As long as you are taking care of it (which you are) I don't see a problem. It reminds me back in Architecture school when some horrible person told multiple students (whom worked very hard) they shouldn't be Architects... So mean!!

So, if I have 22 ball pythons and pet rats, and listening to a poorly struck rat scream in agony sends me into the other room, I guess I better give them to someone who doesn't care, hmm ?

Grow up.

So what if he's squeamish about rodents ? Who the heck cares as long as his snakes are cared for ?

And get off your high horse about the rat thing. Half of my snakes eat mice, and they grow and breed and shed just fine. Who made it a law ball pythons have to eat rats ? As long as the snake eats something, I'd feed it a salad if that is what it wanted!

I'm into my third winter of males fasting, and I have no qualms about offering mice to a 2000 gram male if that is what he wants after his winter fast. After not eating for 6 or 8 months while breeding, if he wants an ice cream cone he can have one, just eat something!

Now that I have that out of my system, I'd like to ask the OP a really dumb question. Have you ever considered feeding tongs ? I use a stainless steel pair with locking handles and gripper teeth at the tips, and are about 18 inches long. They are fantastic for handling mice and rats both. And I don't have to worry about getting bitten. You do of course need to be gentle with them, but they are very effective for grasping a squirming rodent by the tail and moving it around. How it would work for you I imagine would be to invest in a pair of tongs and a small plastic critter keeper. You would take the keeper with you when you buy your food, and the store will happily put it in the keeper for you. Once home, you can open the little trapdoor in the lid, reach in with the tongs and snag the mouse or rat. Gently grasp it just hard enough to hold it, if it squeaks and tries to bite the tongs you grabbed it too hard. Have the keeper right next to his tank, and just quickly lift the rodent out of the keeper and drop it into the tank. If he decides he doesn't want it, the rodent almost never runs from the tongs like they do your hand, and you just reverse the procedure.

I think feeding tongs would help you a lot with feeding.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...y2/Misc/43.jpg

Gale

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

wow, what turned out to be a quick post about a funny situation turned serious quick

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I have to wonder how funny the glue trap was to the mouse...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankieCarbone

His setup up is PERFECT.

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Begging your pardon, I don't consider any tank set up to be perfect.


And, there is nothing wrong with using proper grammar, spelling and punctuation. If you don't choose to use them, that's up to you, but you shouldn't get upset with anyone for pointing it out. Honestly, you should expect it and just understand it's the price of admission for choosing to post in that manner. If you consistently drive faster than the speed limit, you can't be too surprised when you get pulled over, right?

It's not about being an English major, it's about communicating and being understood.

Maybe I am wrong in this, but I think most pet stores will sell you f/t in whatever amounts you would like. I have bought them one at a time previously. Just for the heads up since you are at the pet store anyway every week for a live mouse, picking up the week's f/t wouldn't be going out of your way or clogging up your freezer. They tend to be cheaper too!

The valid question of how you "dispose" of the rodents that aren't eaten was never answered, so now I am curious how you do it. Because it is feeder rodents that keep my snake alive, I have as much respect, if not more respect, for them than I do for my snake.

What do you do with the rodents that aren't eaten?

woahh.. im the noob around here. haha didnt know snake forums were so threatening. maybe im not cut out to be in this snake mafia business! hahahaha

But anyway, i was wondering if my setup is good enough for my new 8 month old BP. i have a 20gallon long tank. hide on both hot and cold side. a log piece that extends from the middle to the top of the of hot side. and a water bowl. not sure if i need some more cover to make my BP feel more comfortable. NOt sure. Any help or advise would be great. maybe some fake shrubs or something??

Quote:

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Originally Posted by alexr

woahh.. im the noob around here. haha didnt know snake forums were so threatening. maybe im not cut out to be in this snake mafia business! hahahaha

But anyway, i was wondering if my setup is good enough for my new 8 month old BP. i have a 20gallon long tank. hide on both hot and cold side. a log piece that extends from the middle to the top of the of hot side. and a water bowl. not sure if i need some more cover to make my BP feel more comfortable. NOt sure. Any help or advise would be great. maybe some fake shrubs or something??

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Temps, humidity?
If you're using a uth is it regulated by a thermostat?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

Temps, humidity?
If you're using a uth is it regulated by a thermostat?

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around 78 on cool side with about 50% humidity and about 94 on hot side with 43ish% humidity. using just day light and night light. not hard to keep temps and humidity up too much because i live in Louisiana