Why don't we do something about reptile products manufacturers lying?

So all the time people will blame pet store employees for spreading terrible information about reptile husbandry, especially when it comes to heat sources/temperature measurement... But I have never seen anyone talk about companies like Zoo-Med or Exo-Tera who's product packaging has the same misinformation printed on them that pet store employees spread?

For instance the Zoo-Med UTH packaging clearly states that a thermostat is not required unless the room temperature gets above 80 degrees.... which we all know is a bunch of crap, this UTH's can easily fry a snake if they are not regulated properly in a room below 80 degrees.

On the same packaging it said that you should use their stick on thermometers to monitor temperatures when using their UTH's... and once again we all know that UTH's do not change the air temperature in the cage rendering those stick on thermometers useless.

These are just 2 of countless examples that I could come up with when it comes to products that are marketed as designed for reptiles. Why don't we as the reptile community hold these companies accountable for things like this that inevitability will lead to numerous reptiles getting seriously injured, or even possibly killed.

I know that business is business and that there are far worse things happening in this world right now, but when it comes to the wellbeing of thousands of animals that are effected by these companies who claim to know what's best I can't stand by and let things like this happen.

Does anyone else feel the same way?

I just don't purchase products from those company's.

I don't either, but it isn't experienced keepers that I am worried about, these companies are preying on inexperienced/new keepers that are easily convinced that they need things like Zoo-Med Repti Shedding Aid and other bogus crap... as well as potentially frying their new pet with an unregulated UTH...

Think of how many people come to this site because of misinformation like this...

Personally, I don't buy their products and I agree 100% with you.
I doubt they will listen to a small group like us and change all their information. They need to hear from a larger group or bigger names for any kind of influence.

Yeah. I always am drawn to walk down Petsmart's reptile aisle, but usually I just end up seeing the same, overpriced, pointless items. In particular, I strongly dislike most of ZooMed's "husbandry" products. A lot of it is completely unnecessary, like the shedding aid stuff. And then some of their things can even be dangerous, like the non-regulated UTHs.

Why in the world are they still making this useless crap? Obviously because people are buying it, thinking it's well-made or necessary. So yes, I do think we need to spread some general awareness about the bad products marketed toward reptile owners.

However, what really peeves me is that these companies aren't selling their crap out of ignorance. Most of them have quite a few good products, and yet they continue selling the dumb ones. ZooMed and Exo Terra sell great-looking caves, bowls, and those neat display terrariums; however, both also sell things like: faulty dial thermometers, heat rocks, heat caves, water conditioner (lol), and giant snake hooks for "taming" your ball python. Two or three nearly identical companies seem to have a monopoly on Petco and Petsmart's reptile departments, and instead of using that to advocate and facilitate proper reptile husbandry, they use it to deceive and make a profit.

...And don't even get me started on Arctic Mice brand feeders.

The world is made of compromises and half truths.

Pretty much EVERY product on the market has some 'misinformation' on the label.

It's up to the consumer to make intelligent decisions with anything they purchase.

Zoo-Med reccommends using a heat rock as a secondary heat source for snakes... Once again unregulated. I'm completely outraged by things like this.

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Originally Posted by Soterios

The world is made of compromises and half truths.

Pretty much EVERY product on the market has some 'misinformation' on the label.

It's up to the consumer to make intelligent decisions with anything they purchase.

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I have to agree - I think the OP might be a little overreacting when saying that the companies are "lying." It is really all about education... What kind of warnings are there on choke collars? None last time I checked, but they are still sold. (And make excellent keychains, BTW.)

And, at least for our geckos' needs without ZooMed and 'Zilla we wouldn't have access to what we need where we live! Not only do we have fake plants from the "big bad companies," we have a few hides, several UTHs(with no thermostats! Gasp! Because I'm a heat transfer engineer and do all the calcs and check with a heat gun) and not to forget we have a whole bottle of ReptiMist shed product... I don't understand the ire here. We know what we are doing, we hate supporting the petstores the products come from, but I've never seen anything on a package that was an out and out lie. Sure, I don't like that they have heat rocks and freeze dried crickets, but somebody is going to make them because somebody is going to buy them and that is just the way it works. Not really something to get worked up about IMHO.

Now, if my plants get some of those same chemicals they find in dog toys, I'll raise up and find an alternative... until then, next week I plan on buying two more sets of fake leaves because it is about time to replace the crested's as a sanitizing soak is just not going to be enough this time!:P

Well, someone certainly COULD start a petition, and go to the lengths necessary to advertise it to the pet community, in an effort to get these companies to remove their worst products from the market.

So, are you volunteering?

Just be sure the products you pick are universally reviled. (I think we can all agree heat rocks, and faulty dial thermometers, need to go away....on the other hand, I know some experienced reptile folks who swear by 'Shed-Ease' to get off stuck shed quickly, even if I think it's a waste of shelf space).

the more people buy of course the more their going to sell. its true they should atleast label the proper way to use some of their products but their more to focused on selling their products. the other part of not using their products the correct way is all on the customer for not doing a little research before getting those products.

i at some point bought some of their products but since i joined this website i have learned alot more on how to care for my snakes and know to avoid such products or atleast use them the correct way.

I think the first thing to do, is get a list together of all the misinformation of one companies products, have a non aggressive but intelligent response of why it is misinformation, then send it in to the company asking for a response. Then go public with the response or the fact that there was no response after "X" amount of days.

Let me get this straight, this is a post about how a company is advertising a produst or use that may or may not be accurate. Welcome to the wonderful world of capitalism.

I am with you serpent merchant. But if you can figure out how to accomplish this, then Wow, it will go well beyond reptile products.

As far as unregulated UTH's go, a better approach may be to show Zoo Med and others the profit margin in coming out with their own thermostat and have them recommending that one should be used. Just point out a few of the respectable models in the $30 dollar range and they can reverse engineer something and call it their own. In the end, the reptile community will feel better as animals will be better cared for and Zoo Med will be happy because $$$$. WIn, win.

If you want to fix your store get a job there, climb the ladder, and change the s.o.p. aside form that complain to the higher ups with enough voices until it changes

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

I don't either, but it isn't experienced keepers that I am worried about, these companies are preying on inexperienced/new keepers that are easily convinced that they need things like Zoo-Med Repti Shedding Aid and other bogus crap... as well as potentially frying their new pet with an unregulated UTH...

Think of how many people come to this site because of misinformation like this...

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That's why I've come to this site.... Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

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Originally Posted by sleepygeckos

UTHs(with no thermostats! Gasp! Because I'm a heat transfer engineer and do all the calcs and check with a heat gun)

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Are you recommending the use of unregulated ZooMed UTHs? Or are you recommending them for geckos? Trying to understand your point.

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Originally Posted by kayrussell

That's why I've come to this site.... Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

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You coming here to learn about husbandry is not a bad thing at all.

ZooMed and Exo-Terra are all that is available in my area. And yeah, I noticed a difference between what they say on the label, but getting things shipped to my area cost almost the same price as the products I want shipped, and I can't afford that right now unless I want to step into my emergency vet bill money, which... I'd much prefer to keep.

I do believe ZooMed has a thermostat, a dual one as well. I was looking at buying it for my single tank, and then getting a herpstat when I get a chance to get my cages. I'm already pushing my manager at my petstore to get in thermostats. Even if they get in ZooMeds, at least then it is a push in the right direction where I can push it.

However, let me tell you something about a lot of people who buy from pet shops, and a lot of customers I talk to... Only about 2% really CARE about the absolute safety of their pet, and want the best for their pet... More believe it's only a gimmick. I keep talking anyway, but they don't give a flying hoot. It's to the point where I'm amazed at how little some people care about their pets.

I'm all for changing the misinformation on products. I'm all for encouraging the companies to put the correct information and encourage a thermostat. Pet Store employees often learn about the products that they are selling from what is on the packaging of the bottles, and by doing research about the product itself. They don't always know they are spreading bad information. And those that do shouldn't be working there.

Even when I get my boss to bring some in, I can't guarantee that I'll be able to even sell them, because most customers won't care, and go with the "I never needed one before!" argument, to the point where you're backed in a corner.


And I believe I went off topic... In some places, Zoo-Med and Exo-Tera are all that some people have (Like meeee!) so if someone took away the products, I wouldn't be able to show the positiveness of reptiles to customers because we wouldn't have much reptile equipment available to us. I'm all for encouraging companies to put the right information, and hey! if they realize they can make an extra few dollars by pushing another product, they could very well do it.

Just don't be too aggressive when writing the letter. Most people respond better to a respectful and helpful letter. x3

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Originally Posted by Slim

Are you recommending the use of unregulated ZooMed UTHs? Or are you recommending them for geckos? Trying to understand your point.

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Pretty obvious that she was saying that in her case, at least, an unregulated UTH doesn't exceed her geckos' comfortable temperature range. Is it best to have a thermostat? Sure, but not everybody can afford a Helix or a Herpstat at $110+, and plenty of people get by just fine without them by either using lamp dimmers to clamp the max output to a safe level or just closely monitoring the temps in the enclosure.

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Originally Posted by olstyn

Sure, but not everybody can afford a Helix or a Herpstat at $110+, and plenty of people get by just fine without them by either using lamp dimmers to clamp the max output to a safe level or just closely monitoring the temps in the enclosure.

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There are some inexpensive but adequate thermostats out there for people who cant afford $100+. Hydrofarm makes a good one. Here is a link:

http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-MTPR.../dp/B000NZZG3S

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Originally Posted by rlditmars

There are some inexpensive but adequate thermostats out there for people who cant afford $100+. Hydrofarm makes a good one. Here is a link:

http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-MTPR.../dp/B000NZZG3S

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That begs the question of which corners got cut in the design and production of that thermostat that enables it to be 1/4 of the price of the "good" ones that are commonly used by reptile keepers. Is it an on/off only, rather than a proportional? Is it failure-prone? What's the catch?

You have to keep in mind that many/most of these products are sold for "reptiles" in general. The packaging for these products can't possibly be labeled for every possible situation or animal. There are animals and situations that an unregulated UTH isn't even enough and there are animals and situations that a heat rock is a great option. These are just examples of an entire line of products manufactured and marketed for a very general/broad range of needs. Money makes the world go 'round! You have to realize that un-educated choice is an issue with EVERY kind of animal that is bought on a whim from a pet store, animal shelter or even reptile expos. Heck we can even go so far as to say this is an issue with people having children! Until human choices are 100% regulated, we will have to put up with unregulated UTH being sold!

i just use a hair water sprayer for the tough skin on my reptiles, i agree they have some nice and useful stuff bt mostly its just crap. the heatrock is the worst, it can really hurt the snakes and they can try to use the cord as a way to get out. im trying to upgrade my area for my snakes bt i have no way to keep the heat up for them without over heating myself..lol so i found the heat pad ok as long as i keep an eye on it to make sure it dont over heat or anything

I've never heard of heat rocks being a 'great option' for any species. Can you name one?

Faulty thermometers need to be pulled because they do not work as advertised, so there's a REAL case to be made, there.

The solution to the UTHs is to convince them to simply include a rheostat (at the VERY least) as part of the UTH, not as a separate unit. Human heating pads have them, why shouldn't a reptile heat pad? They aren't very expensive.

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Originally Posted by olstyn

That begs the question of which corners got cut in the design and production of that thermostat that enables it to be 1/4 of the price of the "good" ones that are commonly used by reptile keepers. Is it an on/off only, rather than a proportional? Is it failure-prone? What's the catch?

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i use hydrofarm with no issue works just fine for me. it does turn off when the set temp is reached, it will also shut off if it reaches 110F or more. as for a catch i dont think there is one this thermostat is used for growing plants not for reptiles but it seems to work just fine.