Feeding your ball python

Hey y'all i have a question... This is my first snake/ ball python so i don't know everything but i feed him on mondays and by wednesday he is out hungry again... i am feeding him hoppers and he is taking three at each feeding... is there such thing as feeding him to much should i be worried?

Welcome to BP.net!

I'm going to assume this is a young ball python, please let me know if that is incorrect.

A good general rule of thumb for feeding young BPs it to offer them a prey item that is 10-15% of the snake's weight every 5-7 days. They grow just fine on this type of schedule, and it has been used successfully many times over.

In order to do this well, you'll need a scale so you can weigh both your snake and it's food. You can find inexpensive kitchen or postal scales at places like Wal-Mart, Staples, or Office Depot.

It sounds to me like you might want to move your snake up to a larger prey size if it is taking three hoppers at a time.

Please take a look at this when you get a chance:

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ius)-Caresheet

There is most definitely such a thing as overfeeding.

Why are you feeding him 3 hoppers at a time? why don't you feed him 1 larger rodent? (does he not take larger rodents?)

How big is he (weight in grams is preferred)

I feed my young BP's every 4 days, but by the time that they weigh 500-600 grams I move them to an 8 day feeding schedule.

There are 2 ways to judge how much rodent to offer a BP, diameter and weight.

The easiest way is to just feed a BP a rodent that is as big around as the Bp is at its widest point

The other way (and this really only works for young BP's is to feed them 15% of their body weight.

So say you have a BP that weighs 100 grams. You would feed that 100 gram Bp a 15 gram rodent (100 grams x 0.15 = 15 grams)

*EDIT*

Slim beat me to it for once lol

I haven't got a scale yet and i had gotten him rat pups to try it but he was having a little trouble eating it like it was to big for him... would it help y'all if i posted a pic of him? and i was told to offer him food every 4 days and he does take it each time... as for feeding him three hoppers i was told if he takes the first on or second one really quick to give him a third one but not to pass three in one sitting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rburger27

I haven't got a scale yet and i had gotten him rat pups to try it but he was having a little trouble eating it like it was to big for him... would it help y'all if i posted a pic of him? and i was told to offer him food every 4 days and he does take it each time... as for feeding him three hoppers i was told if he takes the first on or second one really quick to give him a third one but not to pass three in one sitting.

---

Define "rat pup". There seems to be a LOT of variation in size of what people consider a rat pup. Some call pinks/fuzzies pups (common among pet shops trying to rip you off), but breeders generally consider pups to be that stage between fuzzies and weaned where their eyes are open and they are mobile, but not quite ready to leave mom. Pups are about the size of an adult mouse. Unless your ball is fresh out of the egg, a mouse hopper is probably a small meal for it and is why it accepts three in a row. It is amazing the meals they can eat. Most people new to snakes are amazed when they see how big an appropriate sized meal is and how they can eat it with very little effort.

As the folks above me have said, invest in a cheap digital food processing scale (Wal-Mart has them for about $12). Then just follow the 10-15% body weight theory every 5-7 days and you'll be all set.

As a final note, don't believe everything the pet store employee tells you. Some may or may not be correct, but the fact is they generally make minimum wage (that isn't enough incentive to learn for most), have no real life experience with reptiles other than maybe a company provided care sheet (which are generally very inaccurate!) and they are taught to try and up sell everything to make the company more money. Most of the folks here have been keeping and/or breeding reptiles for many years and they know what they are talking about and are very passionate about passing along the knowledge. :gj:

the "rat pup" i fed him was the size of a small adult mouse and its eyes were not open yet... as for the scale i am picking one up this afternoon... and he had a little trouble figuring out how to eat it i guess buzz it took hime about 45 mins to eat it.. compared to the 10 15 mins it takes hime to eat a hopper mouse

here he is

that is a size 12 Mens US

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...photo_copy.jpg

He looks like he can handle the pup fine. To be exactly sure though you do need a scale. 15% of total body weight is the perfect meal.
Scales are a great resource to have anyways. You can grab one for
Most Walmart, or even ride aids, target etc.


Check out what's new on my website... www.Homegrownscales.com

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rburger27

here he is

that is a size 12 Mens US

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...photo_copy.jpg

---

Oh yeah, hopper mice are too small. Definitely bump him up. :gj:

All this weighing the food stuff is ridiculous...talk about overcomplicating things...holy cow...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

All this weighing the food stuff is ridiculous...talk about overcomplicating things...holy cow...

---

Call it whatever the freak you want to, I call it a successful method that has yet to fail me. While your freakin' milage may vary, don't discount the freakin' method. Out :rage:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

All this weighing the food stuff is ridiculous...talk about overcomplicating things...holy cow...

---

how is it complicated? you weigh the ball python... and get a rodent that is about 15% of the BP's weight (when buying frozen they are sold in weight ranges)

it isn't rocket science.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Slim

Call it whatever the freak you want to, I call it a successful method that has yet to fail me. While your freakin' milage may vary, don't discount the freakin' method. Out :rage:

---

It is absolutely, positively, without a doubt unnecessary to run out and spend money on a food scale to figure out what size rodent to feed a bp...it's absurd...Over....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

how is it complicated? you weigh the ball python... and get a rodent that is about 15% of the BP's weight (when buying frozen they are sold in weight ranges)

it isn't rocket science.

---

Neither is using the eyeballs in your melon to visually figure it out...it ain't that hard...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

It is absolutely, positively, without a doubt unnecessary to run out and spend money on a food scale to figure out what size rodent to feed a bp...it's absurd...Over....

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

Neither is using the eyeballs in your melon to visually figure it out...it ain't that hard...

---

Oh yeah, I forgot, you are prefect...a condition I am not afflicted with. I'll stick to my absurd and unnecessary scale. Some how in my blind ignorance of your melon to eye ball ratio method, it's managed to get me this far :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Slim

Oh yeah, I forgot, you are perfect...a condition I am not afflicted with. I'll stick to my absurd and unnecessary scale. Some how in my blind ignorance of your melon to eye ball ratio method, it's managed to get me this far :rolleyes:

---

Do we really need to further confuse newbs by telling them to buy a scale and weigh both the snake and food??? Is it really necessary???? How has anyone managed to feed snakes before digital food scales came along???? Over...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

Do we really need to further confuse newbs by telling them to buy a scale and weigh both the snake and food??? Is it really necessary???? How has anyone managed to feed snakes before digital food scales came along???? Over...

---

How is taking a simple measurement with a tool that any good snake keeper should have anyway a complication of things?

I can promise you like the sun will come up tomorrow that I will always advise BP keepers, especially newbies, that weighing the prey item is a better method than just winging it and going TLAR (That Looks About Right)...

How can you keep accurate feeding records if you aren't weighing the prey?

It isn't a bad idea to keep an eye on you snakes weight especially if it is on a hunger strike. It is simple and quick. I don't think it is overcomplicating anything. It helps me to know what weight to feed because my eyes are bigger than her stomach by the time I select the live feeder at the shop. I find it easier to know I am getting the right size. Use what works. Est for you. After all it is only $15-20 there are worse things to spend money on.

Do I need to put you two in time out? :rolleyes:

A scale helps, especially when you're new to keeping snakes. Underfeeding is a major issue in this hobby. Do you have to have scale to successfully keep a ball python? No. Do I rely on mine 100% and weigh every meal? Nope, but it helps sometimes and those new to keeping them might not know exactly how big of a meal is best and a scale helps teach them. People also like to keep track of their snake's growth.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Slim

How can you keep accurate feeding records if you aren't weighing the prey?

---

Like this...
5/17 - SR
5/23 - SR
5/29 - SR
etc...

Do you really weigh every rodent you feed to every snake you have?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AK907

Do I need to put you two in time out? :rolleyes:

A scale helps, especially when you're new to keeping snakes. Underfeeding is a major issue in this hobby. Do you have to have scale to successfully keep a ball python? No. Do I rely on mine 100% and weigh every meal? Nope, but it helps sometimes and those new to keeping them might not know exactly how big of a meal is best and a scale helps teach them. People also like to keep track of their snake's growth.

---

I'll bet the majority of underfeeding issues are due to "Bob" at Petco telling the new snake customer "just give 'em a mouse every couple of weeks and it will be fine. They're snakes, they can go months without eating..."

That or laziness or cheapness...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AK907

A scale helps, especially when you're new to keeping snakes. Underfeeding is a major issue in this hobby. Do you have to have scale to successfully keep a ball python? No. Do I rely on mine 100% and weigh every meal? Nope, but it helps sometimes and those new to keeping them might not know exactly how big of a meal is best and a scale helps teach them. People also like to keep track of their snake's growth.

---

X2.
To the OP, a scale is not an absolute neccesity right away, but it helps later down the road.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

I'll bet the majority of underfeeding issues are due to "Bob" at Petco telling the new snake customer "just give 'em a mouse every couple of weeks and it will be fine. They're snakes, they can go months without eating..."

That or laziness or cheapness...

---

Laziness and cheapness is what you have shown in this thread

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

Laziness and cheapness is what you have shown in this thread

---

How so?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

How so?

---

I dont mean to bust any balls it's just that unless you're a breeder of hundreds of snakes, how hard is it to place a feeder on a $20-$70 scale? You're already writing down fed SR (which is already the least amount of effort for identifying a small rat btw). A small rat ranges from what 40-80 grams? That's a pretty big variance. It's nothing to worry about but if you are closely monitoring the snake after an illness, Wanna keep neat paperwork to see growth rate, compare to your other snakes... I only have 2 ball pythons but i know i can feed both a small rat every 7 days but one snake could be getting a 40g and the other 80g for their meals. Then you have people starting a thread asking 'why is mr wiggles so much bigger than ms curls?'. You accuse slim of giving confusing information while youre doing exactly that. Not everyone can just eyeball an appropriate feeder, so the 10-15% rule is pretty fail safe and great for new owners to follow.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

I dont mean to bust any balls it's just that unless you're a breeder of hundreds of snakes, how hard is it to place a feeder on a $20-$70 scale? You're already writing down fed SR (which is already the least amount of effort for identifying a small rat btw).

---

RP = Rat Pup
WR = Weaned Rat
SR = Small Rat
Why make it more difficult?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

A small rat ranges from what 40-80 grams? That's a pretty big variance. It's nothing to worry about but if you are closely monitoring the snake after an illness,

---

And after 7 years or so I've never had to monitor a snake after an illness because I've never had a sick snake. Guess I'm just lucky...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

I only have 2 ball pythons but i know i can feed both a small rat every 7 days but one snake could be getting a 40g and the other 80g for their meals.

---

I only have 17 snakes and I know every one of them very well, so I don't need to weigh their food...I figure out who's eating that night and pick out an appropriate sized rat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

Then you have people starting a thread asking 'why is mr wiggles so much bigger than ms curls?'.

---

I would point them to the caresheet posted on this site that says:

"What size and how often to feed is always up for debate. Many keepers hold to the standard of feeding a rodent that is as big around at its widest point (the hips) as the snake is at its widest girth."

Pretty simple and reliable...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

You accuse slim of giving confusing information while youre doing exactly that. Not everyone can just eyeball an appropriate feeder, so the 10-15% rule is pretty fail safe and great for new owners to follow.

---

The OP has ONE (1) snake...he doesn't need a scale...if someone can't follow the guideline above that was taken from the caresheet posted here they're an idiot...

Don't follow the crowd just to follow the crowd...if you call me out, you should probably be able to back it up...no offense and I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but people spew....um...stuff here on a daily basis...it's not rocket science despite how hard some people try to make it....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

RP = Rat Pup
WR = Weaned Rat
SR = Small Rat
Why make it more difficult?



And after 7 years or so I've never had to monitor a snake after an illness because I've never had a sick snake. Guess I'm just lucky...



I only have 17 snakes and I know every one of them very well, so I don't need to weigh their food...I figure out who's eating that night and pick out an appropriate sized rat.




I would point them to the caresheet posted on this site that says:

"What size and how often to feed is always up for debate. Many keepers hold to the standard of feeding a rodent that is as big around at its widest point (the hips) as the snake is at its widest girth."

Pretty simple and reliable...



The OP has ONE (1) snake...he doesn't need a scale...if someone can't follow the guideline above that was taken from the caresheet posted here they're an idiot...

Don't follow the crowd just to follow the crowd...if you call me out, you should probably be able to back it up...no offense and I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but people spew....um...stuff here on a daily basis...it's not rocket science despite how hard some people try to make it....

---

Congrats on your collection. I've never had an illness in a reptile either but i acheive this by doing due dilligence as an owner. I don't have a rheostat controlling my pets-thats guessing temperatures. So i dont guess my weights. Your legend of rats is what i use to write down...for the first month of owning a snake. After that I just wanted better paperwork and like to know whats going on, maybe thats me. Considering how much nicer snakes cost, how much feeders cost (my local stores are $4.70 each on sale)- why cheap out and not just pick up a $20 scale from sprawl mart or wherever. I dont have a 70 lb 70$ scale for big snakes but if owned any i would definately buy one, even if i only had 1 big snake...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

Congrats on your collection. I've never had an illness in a reptile either but i acheive this by doing due dilligence as an owner. I don't have a rheostat controlling my pets-thats guessing temperatures. So i dont guess my weights....

---

I've done my due diligence...and guessing weights of feeders versus knowing your temps are not even in the same ballpark...and I use Herpstats, if you must know...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

Your legend of rats is what i use to write down...for the first month of owning a snake. After that I just wanted better paperwork and like to know whats going on, maybe thats me.

---

Efficiency is my friend...SR = Small Rat, why make that harder? Spelling out "Small Rat" adds no value...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

Considering how much nicer snakes cost, how much feeders cost (my local stores are $4.70 each on sale)- why cheap out and not just pick up a $20 scale from sprawl mart or wherever. I dont have a 70 lb 70$ scale for big snakes but if owned any i would definately buy one, even if i only had 1 big snake...

---

Please point out where I said I don't have a scale. I'll save you the trouble....I never said I don't have a scale. I have one, and only use it occassionaly to weigh the younger snakes, more out of curiousity than anything else...like I said, I know my snakes. I don't have to rely on a gadget to tell me how to feed them...
You sure seem to do a lot of assuming...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

I've done my due diligence...and guessing weights of feeders versus knowing your temps are not even in the same ballpark...and I use Herpstats, if you must know...



Efficiency is my friend...SR = Small Rat, why make that harder? Spelling out "Small Rat" adds no value...



Please point out where I said I don't have a scale. I'll save you the trouble....I never said I don't have a scale. I have one, and only use it occassionaly to weigh the younger snakes, more out of curiousity than anything else...like I said, I know my snakes. I don't have to rely on a gadget to tell me how to feed them...
You sure seem to do a lot of assuming...

---

You seem to have forgotten what this thread is about. My responses on it are not towards your husbandry, they are towards the OP and your lazy, cheap, know it all posts in this thread only. Good day

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

You seem to have forgotten what this thread is about. My responses on it are not towards your husbandry, they are towards the OP and your lazy, cheap, know it all posts in this thread only. Good day

---

Yeah...it's about some dude with ONE ball python and how it's doomed to die because he doesn't weigh every meal he gives it...:rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

Yeah...it's about some dude with ONE ball python and how it's doomed to die because he doesn't weigh every meal he gives it...:rolleyes:

---

Your sarcastic humour comes off as immaturity. But i dont know you, and there are far better/worse threads i couldve used my first posts on

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

Your sarcastic humour comes off as immaturity. But i dont know you, and there are far better/worse threads i couldve used my first posts on

---

You're right on...I'll be the first to admit I'm immature...and I'm a big fan of sarcasm...:) And although I'm no expert, I do know a thing or two about keeping bp's...and since I'm not too bright, they are simple, yet effective...The KISS theory was developed for people like me...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sho220

Do you really weigh every rodent you feed to every snake you have?

---

Yes I do.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunnyvale420

I dont mean to bust any balls it's just that unless you're a breeder of hundreds of snakes, how hard is it to place a feeder on a $20-$70 scale?

---

This stuff does not have to be rocket science and precise down to the gram. If it works for some people great. If someone can eye ball it and knows the size of rodent that is appropriate for the animal that's just fine too. Neither way is superior to the other if done correctly, to each their own.

To the OP

I am be to BP's and snakes. Started out with a Beardie and Leo. I am a bit of a control freak so i read every caresheet i could find. I read tread after thread and a couple of outdated books. Regardless of my research I still ran into problems and question and with the help of many great people on this forum (Slim, Rob, Kitedemon, Serpant Merchant, Mattchibi to name only a few), I was able to get my BP eating and she is starting to become a very strong eater now.

One of my problems was eyeballing the food items. My eyeballing skills sucked. The first couple small rats I brought home were great (probably a touch on the big side) and she ate them. Te next two were too big. I didn't realize how big until I weighed my next on and saw what 15% looked like. By the time I got to the pet store my snake was bigger in my mon I guess. The scale also put my worried min at ease do I could make sure se wasn't losing weight when she didn't eat.

I also enjoying tracking her growth with it. I am getting better at judging the feeder size now but I will probably weigh most feeders so I know that if she isn't feeding for me it isn't my feeder size. It is also the same reason I have a T-Stat. I know if she isn't eating it isn't because of temps. Life for me is easier knowing things instead of guessing.

I do not wish to contribute to any bickering here but I wanted to share my experience with you. I am definitely NO expert.

Ps sorry for such a long post.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...31938410003173

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...he-Golden-Rule

If you want the full article, let me know.

-------------------------------------------

IMO though buying a scale seems like a bit overkill if you only have a few snakes. In the wild, the animals experience wide varability in available prey. I reccomend paying attention to your snakes behavior and keeping at least some record of feeding frequency and size (by your own metric). But would having a scale hurt? No.

I try to judge the husbandry by the health of the snake, not by the gadgets and equipment used to achieve it. For example, I read a post by a person who didn't have a thermostat or rheostat or any heat source. You might first think that person is an idiot, until you read that he lived in the natural range of the BP in Africa...

My issue with eyeballing the food is the general inconsistent sizing of prey based on who is selling it.

I go to shop A and ask for a small rat. I get a 40 gram rat that is the exact size I need.

Next time, shop A is out, so I go to shop B and ask for a small rat. That one ends up being 75 grams, and is too big for my snake.

Next time I catch a sale at shop C and ask for a small rat. This one is barely 25 grams, and is smaller than what I want.

However, if I go to shop A, B, or C and ask for a 40 gram rat, I get a 40-45 gram rat. It saves me frustration, and that to me is worth a $15 digital scale that I can use for all kinds of things besides snake husbandry.

Gale

I have a food scale that automatically shows me digital grams for weighing my BP. And i usually go by her girth to determine the size of the rat to feed Perry. As far as I know, length doesn't really matter, the size of your Bp's girth would make me think to either get a large mouse or rat pup depending on what you preferr to feed. When it get's a little older and thicker, try a fairly small adolescent rat. I'm no expert but this has always worked for me. It makes it easier since my BP is a VERY easy eater. Hope this helps!

To OP, I would get him on a rat "pup" or equivalent to three hoppers. One larger meal.

As far as the whole scale arguement goes, here is my two cents. It is probably a good idea for a newbie to weigh prey, then they can start getting and eyeball for size to weight comparison. Yes, snake will be fine if size fluctuates a wee bit each time. For those into keeping detailed records, they weigh each and every time and know exactly what was eaten each time. I weigh my snakes more often than I weigh prey. I eyeball them, there also isn't usually a large selection to pick and chose from where I get my feeders. If one looks particularly large or small, I weigh it. And it most always falls between the 10-15% mark. Mine are all growing and eating great. IMO, whatever floats your boat. :)
Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Personally, I have always just eye balled it. I pull a rat out of one of the racks that looks about right, or thaw one that looks about right. Honestly, most of the time I am just grateful IF they eat! If it comes down to going to a pet store to get a feeder, I would strongly recommend picking it out yourself. If they wont let you then refuse until you get what you want! I am sure the scale thing is a good thing for a perfectionist, but I dont have time for that! This is something I would call an "internet fact". It must be that way because everyone on the internet says so!

Oh, bp.netters. Sometimes you make me laugh. Of all the things to get all of your panties in a bunch about... Weighing food??