Fire and vanilla comparison pics

With fires and vanillas looking similar, especially as they get older. I figured I'd throw some shots of comparison to help distinguish the two.

Can you tell which is the fire and which is the vanilla?

Example #1
http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/...-45-57_870.jpg

Example #2
http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/...-45-05_609.jpg

Example #3
http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/...-44-32_504.jpg

1. Van - Fire
2. Fire - Van
3. Fire - Van

That is my guess from the brightness of the yellows.

Top photo:

Left is Fire, Right is vanilla

Middle photo and bottom photo :

Left is vanilla, right is fire.

Nice animals

Gale

Vanilla-fire
Fire-vanilla
Fire-vanilla
Very pretty snakes and this guy is jealous lol

I think the lighter one is the vanilla. If not, I'd better learn, because I'm getting both this summer! Very nice snakes! :gj:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by angllady2

Top photo:

Left is Fire, Right is vanilla

Middle photo and bottom photo :

Left is vanilla, right is fire.

Nice animals

Gale

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+1

This is exactly what I'm talking about. These two morphs carry so many of the same qualities that it can be difficult to tell which is which. With so many breeders looking to breed these two morphs to get vanilla creams, it's important to know the difference. Especially when you have normals in the mix.

I will announce which is the fire and which is the vanilla this evening to give more ppl a chance to give there opinion.

Fire-Vanilla
Vanilla-Fire
Vanilla-Fire

Very pretty snakes.

Thank you all for the compliments!

There is a reason they look so similiar. They are on the same allele. Vanilla Creams cannot reproduce themselves. The Vanilla Cream acts like a super. Just throwing some info in there for people that might not have heard yet. There was some speculation but it's been confirmed by several people now.

Regards,

B

First of all I believe they are same 2 snakes in all 3 examples. Lol. The lighter one is fire and the darker one is vanilla IMO. If it isn't it should be cause fire is brighter than vanilla beans or extract. Lol.

Yeah, it would be good to develop an eye for it. I have a 3 gene girl coming with Vanilla in her, and the effects seem different than Fire.

I am just glad the allele thing has been sorted out, that was getting ugly for a while. BUT, turns it into a Lesser/Butter thing when trying to determine which is which. I do think the genes have more profound difference of effect in combos that Lesser/Butter or Mystic/Phantom though.

Not to derail this, but any official word on Fire/Sulfur?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Simple Man

There is a reason they look so similiar. They are on the same allele. Vanilla Creams cannot reproduce themselves. The Vanilla Cream acts like a super. Just throwing some info in there for people that might not have heard yet. There was some speculation but it's been confirmed by several people now.

Regards,

B

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I didn't see where it was confirmed by anyone, but I believe it, just curious who has confirmed it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jinx667

Yeah, it would be good to develop an eye for it. I have a 3 gene girl coming with Vanilla in her, and the effects seem different than Fire.

I am just glad the allele thing has been sorted out, that was getting ugly for a while. BUT, turns it into a Lesser/Butter thing when trying to determine which is which. I do think the genes have more profound difference of effect in combos that Lesser/Butter or Mystic/Phantom though.

Not to derail this, but any official word on Fire/Sulfur?

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There not going to be a butter lesser by any means, super vanilla vs super fire, there no arguing that. Fire and Sulfur are on the same locus, how ever I wouldn't call them a butter lesser thing either since the super sulfurs seem to throw a lot more color in the lucys.

Vanilla - Fire
Fire - Vanilla
Fire - Vanilla

Quote:

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Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser

I didn't see where it was confirmed by anyone, but I believe it, just curious who has confirmed it?

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Kevin McCurley.

Regards,

B

Official Results:

Example #1:
Fire - Vanilla

Example #2:
Vanilla - Fire

Example #3:
Vanilla - Fire


I picked these two snakes because it can be deceiving. The vanilla has a more prominent head stamp vs the fire. The vanilla has a more jungle pattern.

Thanks everyone

I just wanted to say that I was wrong about Kevin confirming it. I thought I heard it in a video but couldn't confirm it after watching them again. I might have talked about it with him last time we chatted but I don't recall specifically since it was a few months ago. I just wanted to apologize for the post. I'll update again after I talk to him.

I did talk to Chris @ Gulf Coast Reptiles where my Super Vanilla Hypo male is coming from. They originated both Vanillas and Vanilla Creams. They have not been able to get the Creams to reproduce themselves. They bred the first Cream to two Super Vanillas and only produced Super Vanillas and Creams. They don't believe the Cream can reproduce itself but can't say for sure yet. They have not bred the Creams to normals because obviously at this time combos are more important than proving a point.

Regards,

B

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Simple Man

They bred the first Cream to two Super Vanillas and only produced Super Vanillas and Creams.

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That's no different than breeding them to normals as far as information goes. Thanks for the follow up.

Ok, this is the final update. I talked to Kevin this morning and he reconfirmed that Vanilla Creams CANNOT reproduce themselves. He stated they can only produce Fire or Vanillas. Sorry for the confusion but figured everyone would like to know :)

Regards,

B

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Simple Man

Ok, this is the final update. I talked to Kevin this morning and he reconfirmed that Vanilla Creams CANNOT reproduce themselves. He stated they can only produce Fire or Vanillas. Sorry for the confusion but figured everyone would like to know :)

Regards,

B

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Thank you for that. I know there is a lot of talk in regards to this topic. It proves what most were thinking, so that's good.

I got my fires from Constrictors unlimited and they look nothing like your fire. Mine are closer in color to the vanilla. I think there is a huge variance in colors of the fire lines out there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Domepiece

I got my fires from Constrictors unlimited and they look nothing like your fire. Mine are closer in color to the vanilla. I think there is a huge variance in colors of the fire lines out there.

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This fire as well came directly from Mike Wilbanks. How old is your fire?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vitto

This fire as well came directly from Mike Wilbanks. How old is your fire?

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Shes a 2008

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Domepiece

Shes a 2008

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I'd love to see a pic! I have a 2009 female that looks similar to the male in the picture. The difference is that she is lighter and brighter. But that follows the typical "better as they get older" saying that come with fires.
I do agree that with fires and any morph there are different variables that can change the appearance even within the same line. With that said, it's important to know the clues and signs of similar looking morphs to identify accodingly. Especially when they statistically can be in the outcome of a clutch.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vitto

I'd love to see a pic! I have a 2009 female that looks similar to the male in the picture. The difference is that she is lighter and brighter. But that follows the typical "better as they get older" saying that come with fires.
I do agree that with fires and any morph there are different variables that can change the appearance even within the same line. With that said, it's important to know the clues and signs of similar looking morphs to identify accodingly. Especially when they statistically can be in the outcome of a clutch.

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http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/...981/Fires2.jpg
http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/...e1981/0012.jpg
These pics are from last years breeding season.
On top is the female left and male right.

Thats a wicked vanilla, and a sweet fire, nice thread idea. Until now I only suspected vanilla creams were similar to superstripes genetics wise, but only now is it ocnfirmed, so thanks for that! Seriously love that vanilla though... Caylan.s.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jinx667

1. Van - Fire
2. Fire - Van
3. Fire - Van

That is my guess from the brightness of the yellows.

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My guess is just the opposite, from the top down:

Fire - Vanilla
Vanilla - Fire
Vanilla - Fire

edit: just realized results were already posted, lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Inugohan

Thats a wicked vanilla, and a sweet fire, nice thread idea. Until now I only suspected vanilla creams were similar to superstripes genetics wise, but only now is it ocnfirmed, so thanks for that! Seriously love that vanilla though... Caylan.s.

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Thanks alot. I have her sister who has a pretty sweet pattern as well, but with cooler head stamp. She's in shed, but can post pics if you like.

Post away, who produced them?? I love vanilla... Caylan.s.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Domepiece

http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/...981/Fires2.jpg
http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/...e1981/0012.jpg
These pics are from last years breeding season.
On top is the female left and male right.

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I don't see much difference between my fire and yours. I do see that the pattern is more "jungle" like in comparison. But color is pale, light and soft. I find the color of a vanilla to be more rich and deep. But that's just what I see.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vitto

I don't see much difference between my fire and yours. I do see that the pattern is more "jungle" like in comparison. But color is pale, light and soft. I find the color of a vanilla to be more rich and deep. But that's just what I see.

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Yep I see what you mean, they are very similar.

I'll be picking up a vanilla from the NARBC show at tinley part in march, now I know what to look for, thanks for the comparison pics.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Inugohan

Post away, who produced them?? I love vanilla... Caylan.s.

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I get pictures of her once she sheds. Should be soon.

I also got to look through my files to get the name of the breeder that I got them from.