May I preach to the choir for a moment?

In the attempt to find out whether or not my guy is a bcc or a bci I have been pissed off. I emailed the source of my little guy and got a curt response. It was like I was bothering him. I totally understand that he didn't have a ton of info but a blanket response of "Columbian" when I inquired about whether or not he is a bcc Guyana really bothers me. Geeze... Thanks dude. That didn't answer my question. When it comes to these guys it's important to know what you can. Do I intend to breed? Absolutely not but the care for a bcc is more specific than a bci from further north. They need higher humidity, seem to like temps on the lower side, fed a bit differently, tend to be larger, etc. All of this seems to be pretty important. A bci can be 2-4' smaller than a bcc. This distinction seems awfully important to me. Ugh. You would think that he would appreciate my attempt to gather info to provide the best care possible.

Post a pic, I'll tell you if he's a BCC or BCI.

Lol There's tons in my other thread.

Head shape
http://i594.photobucket.com/albums/t...m/9347b90a.jpg

Body shape and a good visual of his saddles. Some are peaked.
http://i594.photobucket.com/albums/t...m/598d02ee.jpg
http://i594.photobucket.com/albums/t...m/6c93867c.jpg

http://i594.photobucket.com/albums/t...m/99a7ed97.jpg

The consensus seems to be that at very least there is a very strong bcc influence. I've seen a few different terms tossed around.

Oh yes... He goes through DRASTIC color changes. He can go from really light, almost totally grey in appearance to flaming pink with grey markings.

Definitely a BCI :) The saddles aren't the right shape for a BCC.

Maybe a mix since I do see a couple very slight peaks, either way I'd treat it as a BCI, the saddles just don't scream BCC at me in any way.

Edit: Have you considered posting the picture on redtailboa.net? I'm almost positive they could give you a better idea.

Thanks hon! I appreciate all opinions. And yeah.. then there's those that have confirmed bcc's without the peaks. I don't think I'll ever know for sure. Even bcc experts aren't sure.

I have, I think? Lol. I'm on another forum too. They are the ones that are damn sure there's a very strong bcc influence. They never said what lead the
To believe that. Something about the bubbles in the saddles and a few other things.

I am ;) :D

I guess as he grows up you'll start to get a better idea. Those red tails don't stay vibrant red like that forever if they are BCI. I'm leaning more towards BCI mainly because BCCs are much much more expensive than BCIs, and BCIs are much much more common than BCCs, and then the saddles. Keep us updated with pics, I don't think the temp difference is too much between the two so I wouldn't beat yourself up over it, it'll get exhausting lol :)

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Originally Posted by LGray23

I guess as he grows up you'll start to get a better idea. Those red tails don't stay vibrant red like that forever if they are BCI. I'm leaning more towards BCI mainly because BCCs are much much more expensive than BCIs, and BCIs are much much more common than BCCs, and then the saddles.

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Tis true. Only time my tell at this point. I was hoping for some sort of answer so I can plan for his permanent enclosure but I think I am going to have to err on the side of caution and go with an expandable enclosure just in case. Cost... this guy and his other tank mates came from the same guy. He ends up with snakes that are impounded, adoptions, given to him to sell, etc. This guy came from a "breeder" in Seattle from his pet snake. Of course there's no contact info because the guy moved.

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Originally Posted by LGray23

Keep us updated with pics, I don't think the temp difference is too much between the two so I wouldn't beat yourself up over it, it'll get exhausting lol :)

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Will do and tis also true! He seems to be doing well so I try not to stress too much. ;)

I'm seeing more BCC in that snake. It's probably a mix of some sort that will be impossible to nail down with certainty but if it were BCI I'd expect a more subdued tail and a greater number of saddles. Here's an excellent site that describes BCI and BCC, they even go so far as to offer descriptions for the localities as well, pictures included!

http://www.boa-constrictors.com/en/b...or_constrictor

Thanks John1982! I've been reading through that site.

If the count is from head to vent... 20 saddles. Actual saddles... there's only 13. How do you count saddles?

Exactly why I said in your other thread that I think he's a mix. I believe he's most likely half N half. He does show strong BCC influence. The 13 saddles, the head shape, the color and drastic color changes. But he is also lacking some key characteristics. Eyelash markings, connected saddles (the line along the sides which usually appears on the ones who lack major peaks), any peaks.

While my own Suri lacks many peaks, most of her peaks connected to form partial stripes. Perfect peaked saddles are not always THE indicator for BCC but don't get worked up over it.

So what if it's a Colombian or a mix. Honestly if the person it originally came from said Colombian that's what it is. Wether it has other blood mixed in there or not.

If you ever do decide to breed boas, unfortunately you won't be able to market it's offspring as anything other than BCI but that doesn't mean you can't mix it with some awesome BCI genes. Like albino, motley, etc..

Like another poster said, give it time. Age, color, size, may all tell you eventually if it is more likely to have BCC in there.

The housing differences are not drastic enough to matter. Mine is kept in a Boaphile cage stack with other snake species in the stack and she favors the hot side. saying they like it cooler doesn't apply to her.

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

But he is also lacking some key characteristics. Eyelash markings, connected saddles (the line along the sides which usually appears on the ones who lack major peaks), any peaks.

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His head is so light in color. I think I see some markings above the eyes but I just can't tell. I am so excited to see his pattern and markings develop as he gets older. He does have a grand total of 4 peaks lol but no complete connection between his saddles. My pictures suck. Little booger does not sit still like ever.

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

The housing differences are not drastic enough to matter.

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This is good to know and what was my major concern. Others seem to think that it is a big deal and thus why I am/was concerned. Thank you for letting me know that in all reality I don't need to worry about those differences. :gj:

The tail screams BCC to me, but I'm still on the fence. And know that not all BCCs have the {} shaped/peaked saddles, some have the the )( saddles as well and yet they are still a BCC.

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

Exactly why I said in your other thread that I think he's a mix. I believe he's most likely half N half. He does show strong BCC influence. The 13 saddles, the head shape, the color and drastic color changes. But he is also lacking some key characteristics. Eyelash markings, connected saddles (the line along the sides which usually appears on the ones who lack major peaks), any peaks.

While my own Suri lacks many peaks, most of her peaks connected to form partial stripes. Perfect peaked saddles are not always THE indicator for BCC but don't get worked up over it.

So what if it's a Colombian or a mix. Honestly if the person it originally came from said Colombian that's what it is. Wether it has other blood mixed in there or not.

If you ever do decide to breed boas, unfortunately you won't be able to market it's offspring as anything other than BCI but that doesn't mean you can't mix it with some awesome BCI genes. Like albino, motley, etc..

Like another poster said, give it time. Age, color, size, may all tell you eventually if it is more likely to have BCC in there.

The housing differences are not drastic enough to matter. Mine is kept in a Boaphile cage stack with other snake species in the stack and she favors the hot side. saying they like it cooler doesn't apply to her.

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Very well said and I totally agree.

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Originally Posted by WifeOfSlasher

This is good to know and what was my major concern. Others seem to think that it is a big deal and thus why I am/was concerned. Thank you for letting me know that in all reality I don't need to worry about those differences. :gj:

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I still tend to recommend a 6x2 for a BCC, but as Foschi said, the housing requirements are not significant enough to be a concern. And a male BCC (and we've already established its a boy) should be just fine in a 4x2. I apologize if I made it seem like the caging differences were a big deal - they aren't.

There are actually fewer differences between a BCC and BCI than one would think. All in all, they are ALL Central American Boas and their care is pretty much the same as dictated by their native environment. Not that it really matters in the end, but I do believe yours is a BCC or at least a mix of BCC and BCI blood. You don't see a tail like that on a BCI without some BCC influence....

I'm sorry you had to deal with a jerk when inquiring for more information. In a perfect world, we'd all be dealing with conscientious and respectable breeders who care about every animal they produce. I had a feeling this was the attitude you'd get though. Good breeders don't usually sell to pet stores - even good pet stores.

Enjoy your little guy - whatever he is! He is super nice and will be an awesome pet for you! :gj:

Once he reaches about 1 year or so in age, you will definitely be able to tell whether he is BCC / BCI by the shape of his head...

Sent from my Motorola ATRIX using Tapatalk.

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

I apologize if I made it seem like the caging differences were a big deal - they aren't.

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You didn't, no worries ;)

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

I'm sorry you had to deal with a jerk when inquiring for more information. In a perfect world, we'd all be dealing with conscientious and respectable breeders who care about every animal they produce. I had a feeling this was the attitude you'd get though. Good breeders don't usually sell to pet stores - even good pet stores.

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Yeah... I told my husband that we won't be making that mistake again. I had a brief love affair with the thought of getting one of the coral albino females they had there. The guys are really nice and they appear to be reputable but I was already given a huge amount of misinformation.

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

Enjoy your little guy - whatever he is! He is super nice and will be an awesome pet for you! :gj:

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Thanks hon :D I will. I will also be sure to bomb from time to time with better pics.

Usually when a Boa is labeled Colombian, it's BCI

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...1/9/8/isis.jpg Here is my Colombian BCI 4 y/o sub adult so you can get an idea.

she's the smaller of my pair. My male is 5 y/o and over 6 1/2 feet - I thought I had a picture of him on me so you could see but I must have deleted it :( I'll post it when I get home from work in the morning :)

She's purdy!!!

Either way I happy with him. He's a beautiful little guy.