Odd bit of advise from a breeder, need opinions on the accuracy of this info.

Ok, so my husband the wannabe ball python breeding expert got into a conversation with a fairly large local breeder at the last show. Now, this man has a lot of ball pythons, and always has a steady supply of very nice babies, so he HAS to be doing something right. He's been breeding for many years now, and is well respected in the business, especially here locally.

His advise to my husband, which I am having a hard time with, was to pop his male/males before putting them in with a female, each time and every time, and the purpose of this popping is to remove the sperm plugs. He claims if you do not so this, your success rate for fertile eggs will be much lower than if you do. He claims it's a big "breeder secret" that all the bigger people know and use but don't tell anyone about. He says the plugs prevent transfer of sperm, resulting in low fertility rates.

I have my doubts about this information. In the first place, I can't see bigger breeders taking the time to pop a dozen or two dozen males each and every time they pair them. Not to mention, the bigger the male the harder it is to pop them. But now my husband is convinced if we don't do this, we'll never get the number of babies we should. I think it's a waste of time, and since he can't pop and I can this slightly nasty task falls to me.

Can anyone verify or disprove this information ? Has anyone ever bothered to do this for an entire season ?

Gale

Hi,

I'm intrested to hear peoples opinions on this - I know I don't intentionally so that I can pop them when removing. If I see a sperm plug I tend to assume they didn't do anything.


dr del

Hmm that is an interesting thought. I've never done that. But I also haven't seen high numbers of
Slugs. If I was seeing high numbers of slugs maybe is think a little more about it. I would think that the plugs would remove themselves during courting, and also copulation.


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I do this to remove dried plugs, But not needed. as when they drag their hemis around scenting the plugs come off.

When i do this i use it to wipe on females back. But not doing it wont make your odds low

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

I do this to remove dried plugs, But not needed. as when they drag their hemis around scenting the plugs come off.

When i do this i use it to wipe on females back. But not doing it wont make your odds low

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I've never thought of this before! Would wiping a strong breeders plugs onto a female paired with a lazy male help him breed?

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Originally Posted by dart

I've never thought of this before! Would wiping a strong breeders plugs onto a female paired with a lazy male help him breed?

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Yes it does.

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Originally Posted by dart

I've never thought of this before! Would wiping a strong breeders plugs onto a female paired with a lazy male help him breed?

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yep.

This sounds a bit silly to me. While I've had some females reabsorb follicles, I've only had one female ever slug out, and one partial slug clutch. In 5 years, that's all. The rest of my clutches have been entirely fertile, with just the occasional single slug here and there. I've never mucked around with my males like that before pairing them--it sounds stressful for them. I know they certainly don't enjoy being popped, and doing it so often is likely to cause discomfort.

I have heard the trick about wiping a good breeder's sperm onto a female to inspire a lazy male, but haven't had the opportunity to try it, yet--I've never had a lazy male.

"Sperm plug" isn't really right, anyhow. In general, a sperm plug is something you would find in a female, after a male has bred with her, and its purpose is to block other males from successfully copulating. Ball pythons don't produce sperm plugs. The little stringy things the male produces are just bits of dried and partially dried semen caught in the hemipenal pockets, they aren't plugging anything. :)
I know it's in common use--perhaps the mistaken use of the term has confused a few people.

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

"Sperm plug" isn't really right, anyhow. In general, a sperm plug is something you would find in a female, after a male has bred with her, and its purpose is to block other males from successfully copulating. Ball pythons don't produce sperm plugs. The little stringy things the male produces are just bits of dried and partially dried semen caught in the hemipenal pockets, they aren't plugging anything. :)
I know it's in common use--perhaps the mistaken use of the term has confused a few people.

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I thought I just read a post recently that explained the same misconception, but rather than dried sperm it was said that the things that people were commonly calling "sperm plugs" were hemipene casts, like a shed from the hemipene. I can't recall exactly which post that was in, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but that was the impression (no pun intended) that I got . Does anyone else recall that conversation or have any info on whether there is such a thing as a hemipene cast?

I actually saw a sperm plug wedged inside of my het lavender female's vent after a particularly intense session with her boyfriend last season. I assumed it was probably a good thing, since it was probably carrying some extra sperm. Plus it proved that the boy knew what he was doing. The female went on to lay five beautiful fertile eggs.

...Buuuut this is only my second season, and that was a 2007 pair. That het lavender boy was going crazy the previous winters waiting for his girlfriend to come up to size, so I think he was really out to succeed.

I might try that plug-on-the-back-of-the-female trick with my pewter and het pied pair! I'm getting tired of watching them ignore each other.

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Originally Posted by Steve-J

I thought I just read a post recently that explained the same misconception, but rather than dried sperm it was said that the things that people were commonly calling "sperm plugs" were hemipene casts, like a shed from the hemipene. I can't recall exactly which post that was in, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but that was the impression (no pun intended) that I got . Does anyone else recall that conversation or have any info on whether there is such a thing as a hemipene cast?

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Yeah, in that sense, ball python "sperm plugs" don't function the way garter snake sperm plugs do. As alluded to earlier in the thread, garter snake sperm plugs prevent other males from accessing the female's vent. Ball python plugs don't block access or stop multiples-sired clutches.

But having seen a "sperm plug" hanging out of one of my girl's vents several times last season, I think it's likely that they do act as sperm traps, and could help insure that at least some of the babies will be sired by that father.

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Originally Posted by angllady2

His advise to my husband, which I am having a hard time with, was to pop his male/males before putting them in with a female, each time and every time, and the purpose of this popping is to remove the sperm plugs. He claims if you do not so this, your success rate for fertile eggs will be much lower than if you do. He claims it's a big "breeder secret" that all the bigger people know and use but don't tell anyone about. He says the plugs prevent transfer of sperm, resulting in low fertility rates.

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I've heard that one, too, though the rationale I was told was somewhat different -- I think the person who told me that said that it "fired up" the male, or something of the like.

I don't particularly believe it.

My guess is that it doesn't make a significant difference, but a lot of people have "tricks" they do to make it feel like they have more of a positive effect on their numbers. When it comes to breeding it seems (having no experience yet myself) that it either happens or it doesn't. Short of artificial insemination you can't force things. With the number of ball pythons out there, I doubt problems are significant enough to have to resort to that anyway. Stubborn pairs happen, new breeders who aren't experienced, but there are much more sound tips to consider in that situation (more experienced breeder's sperm on female's back, etc)

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Originally Posted by Steve-J

I thought I just read a post recently that explained the same misconception, but rather than dried sperm it was said that the things that people were commonly calling "sperm plugs" were hemipene casts, like a shed from the hemipene. I can't recall exactly which post that was in, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but that was the impression (no pun intended) that I got . Does anyone else recall that conversation or have any info on whether there is such a thing as a hemipene cast?

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If that were true, you would be able to remove them, and there wouldn't be any more there 3 weeks later. ;)

I haven't ever heard of doing that. I don't do it, and I still get fertile eggs.

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Originally Posted by SlitherinSisters

I haven't ever heard of doing that. I don't do it, and I still get fertile eggs.

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Ditto

Been doing this with males for years!

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