boas cohabitating with pythons

So I have your average RTB (well, he's not average, he's awesome), who is about 9 months old. He's three-ish feet long and about 2.5kg. I also have two ball pythons, a male and a female, who are now almost two years old. The male is a little less than 2kg, and the female is right about as big as the boa.

I'd like to keep them in the same tank, as I have a very large tank for the pythons (who have lived together for most of their lives). Mainly, I'd like them in the same tank as it's quite large and simplifies my life, and the boa is now getting too big for the tank he is in. The boa is eating twice a week, and the pythons are eating once a week (when they're not being moody, but it's winter, and they kind of slow down in winter).

Anyways, I've kept the boa segregated from the pythons for purposes of quarantine. He's quite healthy and the pythons are of course healthy. I'm comfortable with them coming into contact (I've been careful to clean up before handling them in sequence, before cleaning tanks, etc, so they haven't been introduced in any sense yet), but I am wondering if there are any sort of procedures for making sure nobody gets unhappy in the tank.

The boa is quite easy going, and the pythons are, well, sweet like ball pythons are. It's kind of cute, they're inseparable.

Oh, the other thing is, seems to me now would be a good time to introduce them, given the boa is only going to get bigger, and the pythons are going to grow into their five-to-six-feet while he does that. I'd rather not introduce an eight foot snake to a pair of five-foot-snakes.

You should not be housing any snakes together. They are solitary animals. I suggest putting the boa in the big tank and keeping the bp's in two smaller but separate tanks.

What Reakt20 said. Keeping snakes together is asking for problems, whether they're the same species or not, whether they've grown up together or not, and whether the cage is big or not. If one gets sick, the other will almost unavoidably get sick too. If one has mites, the other one gets mites. I've seen many a post with feeding accidents resulting from two or more snakes being in the same enclosure, where the animals were fed and then one went after the other because it was still in feeding mode.

Not to mention with adding the boa, it's been seen that if they're given enough time most boas will eventually end up killing the python and potentially eating it.

Like Reakt20 said, get two smaller enclosures for the BPs and give the boa the large one.

You might not be able to notice, but they are stressing each other out. What you consider inseparable is probably them competing for hide space or warm spots. them piling on each other is more or less a dominance thing. I strongly suggest, as will everybody else, to separate them.

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Originally Posted by Alexandra V

What Reakt20 said. Keeping snakes together is asking for problems, whether they're the same species or not, whether they've grown up together or not, and whether the cage is big or not. If one gets sick, the other will almost unavoidably get sick too. If one has mites, the other one gets mites. I've seen many a post with feeding accidents resulting from two or more snakes being in the same enclosure, where the animals were fed and then one went after the other because it was still in feeding mode.

Not to mention with adding the boa, it's been seen that if they're given enough time most boas will eventually end up killing the python and potentially eating it.

Like Reakt20 said, get two smaller enclosures for the BPs and give the boa the large one.

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I couldn't have said it better myself. Weather it simplifies your life or not, it doesn't simplify theirs. Giving your RTB and bps the best life possible should be your aim, not simplicity.

I don't mean this to sound too harsh, but you should NEVER house snakes together from the SAME species, let alone different ones. You are talking about species that are drastically different sizes and need different requirements. Go get two 30-40 gal tubs for your ball pythons and put your boa in the big one you already have. You will regret it big time if you keep them together, your snakes will become sick, stressed, and possibly dead if the boa gets defensive. You will not find a single reputable source that tells you housing balls and boas together is ok.

Also, if your balls are male and female, you are going to eventually get eggs whether you want them or not. Are you prepared to care for them? Either way, separate them. If you want to breed them, research what needs to be done and put them together only to breed.

I would suggest spending an hour or so reading through the bp husbandry section on here and make a thread asking questions if you still have any after doing some research. there is great knowledge to be found there about keeping healthy ball pythons. Read through the boa section as well.

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Originally Posted by Reakt20

I would suggest spending an hour or so reading through the bp husbandry section on here and make a thread asking questions if you still have any after doing some research.

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You know, I did search, actually. I just did a poor job of it. After your post, I went looking through google and found the answers that have been posted above. Thanks for your replies.

As others have said, it's a bad idea to house two snakes of even the same species together but housing different species together is a huge no no. You are just asking for a world of problems if you keep them together.

Courtesy of a goggle image search (notice that the two snakes are similar in size, the boa actually regulated the ball python because the meal was too big):
http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/m...istic_boa4.jpg

You need to think about what's best for the animals not what's most convenient for you and please separate your ball pythons. They hate being house together and if you really do have a male and a female of those sizes then you could end up with eggs you aren't prepared for.

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Originally Posted by Reakt20

You should not be housing any snakes together. They are solitary animals. I suggest putting the boa in the big tank and keeping the bp's in two smaller but separate tanks.

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this.

smh.......read a little bro...

Perhaps someone can help me understand a little here. I'm not trying to be contrary, but I've been reading a lot on the web because I was quite surprised by the answers. Seems to me when we go see snakes at the zoo, they are often kept 2-ish to a tank. Same would be true of juvenile snakes I see from breeders on youtube. And then there are pet stores (hardly the best-and-brightest, but I've seen lots of pythons kept in the same tank over the years, and in a couple of instances, boas and pythons kept together).

The word on the web seems to be that you can keep ball pythons together, but with the caveat that a) you'll wind up with eggs and b) diseases become a problem with a distant c) of one may eat the other.

A couple of places say that the attitude has changed over the years, which may be why I was misinformed; I've kept ball pythons since 96 or so, and they've always been together (fed separately of course). These two are just the newest. But back then we didn't have forums where I could ask questions. This is my first boa.

Anyways, it would be helpful if somebody could explain a little if there have been changing attitudes on the concept, or if I am missing something when I see a few large burms at the zoo, and so on.

Thanks everyone for your replies.

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Originally Posted by womsterr

smh.......read a little bro...

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I don't think snide sounding comments are what needs to be posted. The OP is here looking for help and guidance, not to be made to feel stupid or talked down to.

I'm not trying to sound snide or [mean] either, just wanted to say that I'm sure we ALL have things to learn and bp.net is a wonderful place for that and to help out other herpers :)

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Originally Posted by avriette

Perhaps someone can help me understand a little here. I'm not trying to be contrary, but I've been reading a lot on the web because I was quite surprised by the answers. Seems to me when we go see snakes at the zoo, they are often kept 2-ish to a tank. Same would be true of juvenile snakes I see from breeders on youtube. And then there are pet stores (hardly the best-and-brightest, but I've seen lots of pythons kept in the same tank over the years, and in a couple of instances, boas and pythons kept together).

The word on the web seems to be that you can keep ball pythons together, but with the caveat that a) you'll wind up with eggs and b) diseases become a problem with a distant c) of one may eat the other.

A couple of places say that the attitude has changed over the years, which may be why I was misinformed; I've kept ball pythons since 96 or so, and they've always been together (fed separately of course). These two are just the newest. But back then we didn't have forums where I could ask questions. This is my first boa.

Anyways, it would be helpful if somebody could explain a little if there have been changing attitudes on the concept, or if I am missing something when I see a few large burms at the zoo, and so on.

Thanks everyone for your replies.

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I see where you're coming from with the remark about seeing them often kept a few to a cage in zoos, videos and stores. Thing is though, all of those situations are situations in which they have limited space. Either they know that it's not the best but they do it anyways simply because they have no other choice, or they don't know better and just do it because they think it's fine.

And as for the changing attitudes, there definitely have been changes in the attitudes of keepers over the years, and there will continue to be changes as time goes on because that's how the pet industry works. We're constantly learning more and more about the animals we keep and make adjustments to the way we keep them accordingly.

For instance, come back with me to the 30's; people kept dogs and fed them table scraps and foods that were practically plastic for all we know, and that was perfectly fine in their minds because nobody knew better. They thought they were doing the best for their dogs, and the dogs did alright with it, despite it not being ideal. Then people did more and more research as time went on, and all the way up to today people are becoming more and more conscious of what they're feeding their dogs (and cats for that matter) and we're seeing a rise in consumers buying higher quality and holistic pet foods for their animals because we've learned that it tends to be better for them. Back in the thirties, that would have all been nonsense.

Same thing goes with the snakes. They used to be kept together because nobody thought much of it. There were occasional incidents of disease or cannibalism etc, but people just thought it a fluke, and thought it more or less unnecessary and inconvenient to house them separately. Now we're seeing better caging systems that save space and allow us to house snakes separately while keeping a lot of free space, as well as more and more people figuring out that it's better for them to be separate, so views have changed.

We do learn more and more over the years. And with the explosion of the internet, people are learning more and faster than ever.

I will say that there is not a specific "ONE RIGHT WAY" to keep ball pythons, or most any species. Different people have different methods that work for them.

With regard to snakes living together, you mentioned the caveats yourself. There are RISKS associated with doing so...some serious like potential illness or one killing the other...some less serious, such as them simply stressing each other out. People DO choose to accept these risks. Does that make it right? Those of us who choose not to accept those risks don't think so. And we'll be quick to tell you why.

The way I see it...so long as we do our best to make you AWARE of the risks and pitfalls of the snakes living together, the rest is up to you to decide.

I would NEVER use a pet store as a yardstick for measuring how to properly care for any animal. Even the really good pet stores have to take shortcuts that most of us would not dream of. And very few pet stores are anywhere close to "really good." Do they get away with it? Sure...so far as you know. Doesn't make it right.

Zoos are an entirely different matter. First off...not all of them take proper care of their animals either. I've worked in a zoo that was horrible. It's not pretty. The good zoos that I've seen DON'T house animals together that should be housed individually. When they DO house animals together, they can do so successfully because they have professional keepers with years and decades of experience who know how to make sure the animals are thriving, and are willing to make changes if the animals are not thriving.

You can only use your own experience and your own judgement. We can only offer advice based on ours.

Opinions are always going to change, especially with the web. We are able to better share information now thanks to the internet.

I have books on ball python care that go all the way back to 1989 that tell me every ball python I find is going to be wild caught, sick and infested with parasites and I just got into ball pythons last year.

Our knowledge of their care has greatly expanded in the past few years which is how we have arrived at the opinion that you shouldn't house two snakes together. It stresses them out. Honestly you listed the caveats to housing them together, so why would you want to even chance it?

Technically they can be housed together, but no one recommends that any more because of the risks involved. Zoos and pet stores also aren't the best examples to look at. They both have lots of problems that I don't feel like going into right now, suffice to say they run on procedures that were written years ago and they aren't willing to change. I recently read an article about a zoo keeper who was fired for killing a corn snake on accident because of their feeding procedures.

I don't know what videos you have seen, but some breeders will keep baby snakes together until they shed for the first time which is different than permanently housing them together. Housing snakes together at shows is also different because it's temporary.

At the end of the day it's ultimately your choice on what you want to do in regards to your snakes, but I don't know anyone here who would recommend you house any snake together.

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Originally Posted by Kinra

Technically they can be housed together, but no one recommends that any more because of the risks involved.

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Well, this clears a lot up. I suppose I will start looking into housing for them. More complicated than I thought; I thought it was going to be easier now that they'd all be living in the same tank! Sheesh!

Thanks, all.

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Originally Posted by avriette

Well, this clears a lot up. I suppose I will start looking into housing for them. More complicated than I thought; I thought it was going to be easier now that they'd all be living in the same tank! Sheesh!

Thanks, all.

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I would look into a rack or stackable enclosures. Building a rack is easy and cost effective. Buying one is more expensive but ensured quality. Stackable enclosures may also be expensive but are ideal. All are great as far as space efficiency go though.

Regular Sterlite or Rubbermaid sweater tubs (storage bins) work great as well and cost you around anywhere from 5-20 bucks! Make sure they have enough holes in it for air circulation and a regulated UTH for it and they work great! Holes can easily be made by a soldering iron or a dremil tool.

I do applaud you for being interested in learning more.

I agree to never use pet stores as your guide. The animals there are meant to housed temporarily. If every animal was sold within a week or two, it might not be so bad, but so many of them spend years living together.

When you see two snakes "cuddling" together, it is not the least bit affectionate. They are usually competing for a heat source. Cold blooded animals cannot give off body heat, so they cannot keep each other warm by "cuddling." When you have multiple snake and only one heat source, not all snakes can properly thermoregulate. That leads to digestive problems, sickness, and even death. If you have as many heat sources as you do snakes in one enclosure, chances are your ambient temp will skyrocket to deadly levels. All around, the safest, easiest solution to every problem is separate homes for each snake. They will be much happier, and you will save on vet bills in the long run.

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Originally Posted by avriette

So I have your average RTB, who is about 9 months old. He's three-ish feet long and about 2.5kg. I also have two ball pythons, a male and a female, who are now almost two years old. The male is a little less than 2kg, and the female is right about as big as the boa...
...The boa is eating twice a week, and the pythons are eating once a week.

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What are you feeding the boa? Twice a week is a little much. I suggest a 7-10 day feeding schedule. 2500 grams seems a little over weight for a 3 foot long snake....

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Originally Posted by Vypyrz

What are you feeding the boa? Twice a week is a little much. I suggest a 7-10 day feeding schedule. 2500 grams seems a little over weight for a 3 foot long snake....

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The boa eats small rats I would say every five days. I buy them in (frozen, of course) three packs from The Gourmet Rodent. He's too small to eat anything bigger.

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Originally Posted by avriette

The boa eats small rats I would say every five days. I buy them in (frozen, of course) three packs from The Gourmet Rodent. He's too small to eat anything bigger.

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Could you post a picture of him? Now that it has been mentioned it does seem like he could be over weight. My year and half old boa is about 3ft and only about 500-600g (I haven't weighed her in a while). Boas aren't supposed to be round like pythons. A healthy boa will have a box like shape to it and unlike ball pythons boas will eat anything at anytime.

My boa for example:
http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/...y/IMG_3102.jpg

I'll have to get a picture of him. We just moved (hence the discussion of tanks etc) and things are kind of chaotic at the moment. I would say that he is quite "boxy".

Some species do better than others when housed together. Ball pythons do not seem to do very well, because of dominance. It is very important when housing snakes together to ensure that each snake has access to proper heat. For example, you may need multiple under tank heaters...

When housing animals together, you increase the chance that all will become ill if one does. You also increase the chance that they will breed if they are opposite sex.

I personally would never suggest housing multiple species together, because I would fear that they would kill each other.

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Originally Posted by Wh00h0069

Some species do better than others when housed together. Ball pythons do not seem to do very well, because of dominance. It is very important when housing snakes together to ensure that each snake has access to proper heat. For example, you may need multiple under tank heaters...

When housing animals together, you increase the chance that all will become ill if one does. You also increase the chance that they will breed if they are opposite sex.

I personally would never suggest housing multiple species together, because I would fear that they would kill each other.

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You know, it's interesting that you post -- green tree pythons are one of the species I see together a lot.

Back when I was a young lad I made the mistake of housing 2 boas together. When I went to feed I fed one a rat and went to feed the other one a rat right away. Long story short, the one that was eating was struck at and wrapped on by the one without a rat and all hell broke loose. Boas were striking at any heat source and it was very scary and hard to seperate the animals. DO NOT house together it is pointless. They gain nothing from it and you could find yourself in the same situation. If you don't have the money to house them seperately then don't purchase animals. Husbandry should be figured out before you buy animals.

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Originally Posted by avriette

You know, it's interesting that you post -- green tree pythons are one of the species I see together a lot.

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where are you looking? unless they are very young neonates right out of the egg or adults that are breeding, I can't recall ever seeing chondros (or any morelia for that matter) cohabitating.

you've been given some good advice, but ultimately it's up to you whether you intend to put it into practice. I'm not sure your best angle is to try to look for inconsistencies in the husbandry of other animals that don't pertain to your collection.

good luck and keep us posted.

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Originally Posted by wwmjkd

where are you looking? unless they are very young neonates right out of the egg or adults that are breeding, I can't recall ever seeing chondros (or any morelia for that matter) cohabitating.

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I know Garrick DeMeyer keeps his GTP in pairs year round.

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Originally Posted by heathers*bps

I don't think snide sounding comments are what needs to be posted. The OP is here looking for help and guidance, not to be made to feel stupid or talked down to.

I'm not trying to sound snide or [mean] either, just wanted to say that I'm sure we ALL have things to learn and bp.net is a wonderful place for that and to help out other herpers :)

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My point is this. When one first becomes interested in exotics, you need to do the research BEFORE you bring them home, not after. I have taken in too many sick and dying exotics that were brought home by folks with good intentions but a "ready, shoot, aim" approach to animal husbandry. These have included both balls and boas (add parrots and dogs as well). Perhaps that is why i don't demonstrate much patience for poor husbandry.

Both are solitary animals, Boas have a tremendous feeding response and if you ever saw a really hungry or jazzed up boa hit a rat I would think you would have second thoughts of ever housing it with another snake. There are caresheets for both listed here....read them. Ask your breeder, the pet store etc...

The only thing I want to add is that boas can contract minor diseases that are fatal to pythons. You might be able to "get away with" housing the two pythons together, but putting a whole 'nother genus of snake in with them is certain trouble.

And of course the obvious size difference. I have two females that are probably a half year apart in age. My ball is about 3 ft and 620g's. My boa is 6.5 ft and 5 pounds. At the VERY least my boa could easily crush my ball just by moving over her. In other words, she wouldn't even need to be trying to kill my ball to do it. It could be a total accident, but why would you want to take the chance at all?

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Originally Posted by avriette

The boa is quite easy going, and the pythons are, well, sweet like ball pythons are. It's kind of cute, they're inseparable.

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I agree with what everone else has suggested, i dont think that it is a good idea to house your snakes together. First off in the wild a rtb and bp dont even really live at all near eachother. South america vs. africa. In the wild ball pythons live in burrows of rodents or termite mounds. They live by themselves in the burrow. The only times that two bp's would "live together" would be during the breeding season when they mate. But besides that they are solitary snakes. And you said its cute how they inseparable but they dont really have a choice to be seperate since theyre in the same tank competing for a hot spot or a hide.
Just my 2 cents.

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Originally Posted by womsterr

My point is this. When one first becomes interested in exotics, you need to do the research BEFORE you bring them home, not after. I have taken in too many sick and dying exotics that were brought home by folks with good intentions but a "ready, shoot, aim" approach to animal husbandry. These have included both balls and boas (add parrots and dogs as well). Perhaps that is why i don't demonstrate much patience for poor husbandry.

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While I can completely sympathize with your frustrations, and agree wholeheartedly with the desire for people to do things responsibly and in the right order...it's very counterproductive to get an aggressive attitude when someone finally does come here (or someplace like here) looking for help.

The harsh reply doesn't CHANGE anything that a person has already done in the past...but it CAN change how well they perceive the advice people are trying to give them NOW and how willing they might be to consider and accept it.

Just something to think about. :)

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Originally Posted by twistedtails

If you don't have the money to house them separately then don't purchase animals.

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Originally Posted by twistedtails

. DO NOT house together it is pointless. They gain nothing from it and you could find yourself in the same situation. If you don't have the money to house them seperately then don't purchase animals. Husbandry should be figured out before you buy animals.

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:gj: X2

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Originally Posted by wwmjkd

where are you looking? unless they are very young neonates right out of the egg or adults that are breeding, I can't recall ever seeing chondros (or any morelia for that matter) cohabitating.

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These were on the first page on Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uiyFOXaK98
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJliuALcXTY

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you've been given some good advice, but ultimately it's up to you whether you intend to put it into practice. I'm not sure your best angle is to try to look for inconsistencies in the husbandry of other animals that don't pertain to your collection.

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I hope I haven't given the impression that I'm disagreeing with everyone. I am just trying to figure out how I became so misguided (frankly, I thought I was being pretty responsible!), and it looks like there's a lot of bad information out there. As I said earlier, when I started keeping snakes, I couldn't hop on a forum and ask people who had snakes. My first ball python was a rescue, as was my second. And both were full-grown. So what little I knew, I learned from the people who had been keeping them (which, in hindsight, was not a great idea) and from the pet stores where I purchased their rats -- which, of course, I fed them live because I didn't know any better! On this second piece, I thought I was doing the right thing by asking people that were (clearly) more knowledgeable than I was. I just started looking around for people who were already keeping snakes, and who had been keeping them longer. There isn't an inherent "rating based on correctness" on Youtube, so I was misled.

Particularly moving are these couple:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1t0hlS1mqY (enormous argentine boas)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPq80TaeEAA (a pair of green anacondas that seem to be kept together)

I saw them and thought, huh, so snakes with that much of a size discrepancy seem to be doing okay together. That's all. I hope you can see it would be easy to be misled. When I had "done this research," I thought to myself, well, I should probably go ask b-p.net what the correct way to do this is, because I don't want to put them together the wrong way -- never questioning the notion that they should be together in the first place. Does that make sense?

I also want to make clear this isn't about money or anything, I just thought it would be easier to clean one tank at a time instead of two (or three!). Clearly, it's not a good idea to have them all in one enclosure.

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Originally Posted by avriette

These were on the first page on Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uiyFOXaK98
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJliuALcXTY



I hope I haven't given the impression that I'm disagreeing with everyone. I am just trying to figure out how I became so misguided (frankly, I thought I was being pretty responsible!), and it looks like there's a lot of bad information out there. As I said earlier, when I started keeping snakes, I couldn't hop on a forum and ask people who had snakes. My first ball python was a rescue, as was my second. And both were full-grown. So what little I knew, I learned from the people who had been keeping them (which, in hindsight, was not a great idea) and from the pet stores where I purchased their rats -- which, of course, I fed them live because I didn't know any better! On this second piece, I thought I was doing the right thing by asking people that were (clearly) more knowledgeable than I was. I just started looking around for people who were already keeping snakes, and who had been keeping them longer. There isn't an inherent "rating based on correctness" on Youtube, so I was misled.

Particularly moving are these couple:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1t0hlS1mqY (enormous argentine boas)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPq80TaeEAA (a pair of green anacondas that seem to be kept together)

I saw them and thought, huh, so snakes with that much of a size discrepancy seem to be doing okay together. That's all. I hope you can see it would be easy to be misled. When I had "done this research," I thought to myself, well, I should probably go ask b-p.net what the correct way to do this is, because I don't want to put them together the wrong way -- never questioning the notion that they should be together in the first place. Does that make sense?

I also want to make clear this isn't about money or anything, I just thought it would be easier to clean one tank at a time instead of two (or three!). Clearly, it's not a good idea to have them all in one enclosure.

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Its very tempting in life to see someone doing something with no apparent side affects and think its OK to do the same. Its completely understandable that you were mislead. The only way to try and minimize the number of times this happens is to be skeptical. Just today someone told me you "You know the word golf comes from the phrase Gentlemen Only, Ladies Forbidden." I said "Sounds plausible but I am a bit skeptical. I will have to look that up." 10 minutes later the person came back and said "Yeah I looked it up, you were right to be skeptical." You were right to go looking for answers. I am glad you got good info in the end.

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Originally Posted by Vypyrz

What are you feeding the boa? Twice a week is a little much. I suggest a 7-10 day feeding schedule. 2500 grams seems a little over weight for a 3 foot long snake....

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Actually, I misremembered. I just weighed him and he's just 895 grams. Not sure how that happened?? Must be going senile.

So the animals in the you tube videos (because everyone in a youtube video is an expert...) aren't even the same species you're talking about. Those animals might be together for breeding, "socialization".... or they may be housed together. We don't know.

I'll put my canned reply on why you shouldnt house two ball pythons together here, just for kicks, but in short, no, you shouldn't house these animals together.

Regarding the boa and the BPs together specifically... Boas get big, even a male boa will get about 2x the size of a ball python easy. Would you want to live in a room with someone 2x your size? Their requirements aren't even the same. Balls are native to Africa, Standard boas are native to South America.

Regarding your large enclosure; ball pythons typically do much better with smaller more cramped enclosures, boas usually do better where they have room to move around.

Standard (red tail, etc) boas can be asymptomatic carriers for a disease called IBD, inclusion body disease. Search the forum for it, the results can be devastating to your collection. There are also other communicable diseases that can be spread around, Respiratory infections, other bacterial or fungal infections, etc.

CANNED REPLY:
To quote another post on the exact same topic (PS: search feature is your friend). Take this post with a grain of salt, but please understand why it is better for your animals to each have a home, than to have to share one. (This post was also made for someone who was already housing animals together).

NO, you should not.

it is NOT good for the animals to be housed together. There are a multitude of reasons for this, including but not limited to the following;

1. You didnt quarantine your new addition and if its carrying something, chances are your older animal has it too anything from parasites, worms, sickness and disease, (even if there arent any symptoms yet)

2. Did you get these animals sexed from a reliable source? Or are you trusting the pet store.. This means you could have two opposite genders and you have the chance that they could now breed early causing the female (if one is a female) problems and possibly killing her

3. Cannibalism is known to occur in a few documented cases involving BPs

4. If one of your animals is sick, you probably wont know which one because you cant tell their feces/urates/regurges apart

5. If one gets sick, they both get sick and now you have to spend 2x the amount of money in vet care.

6. Actions we see as "cuddling" are actually one snake competing with the other. They both may be eating fine now but how long is that going to last? The smaller one is especially at risk for stress which could lower immune levels. They will constantly be competing for the best hide spots and best heating spots, etc.

housing two animals in one enclosure when they arent social isnt something novice keepers should do. Each animal should have their own space to thrive. If cost is the problem then maybe you need to take one back or rehome him until you can provide a sutible environment for any animal that comes into your home.

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I hope you understand i'm not trying to be snarky, you came here asking good questions and you look like someone who wants to do the best for your animals.

avriette, i understood what you meant. I have often seen GTPs housed together as juveniles or babies.
In pet stores especially. They are just trying to save space, and it IS a money thing for them. Boo to them! *lol*

When we first got our first ball python a year ago, my husband was convinced that if we got another they could live together. I go around and around with him about this, as i insist they all be separated.
It is totally what someone else said about say, dog food, though. I work at a pet store, and one thing that has happened over the years is that people have realized what companies have been putting in dog food...and are now going for better ingredients, which has led to healthier animals, and longer lives.
I think the same thing is with the snakes...people have learned that housing separately is better for husbandry.

I have to say though, that i have been to a few popular zoos, and i honestly can't remember seeing snakes housed together. San Deigo, Santa Barbara, L.A., Portland, and recently to a few in Australia. I don't *Remember* but this was over a few years, and before i was really into snakes. Mostly though, my old photos and my old memory says housed alone :)
It's harsh on the house space, but totally worth it to have all the snakes...muwah!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by avriette

So I have your average RTB (well, he's not average, he's awesome), who is about 9 months old. He's three-ish feet long and about 2.5kg. I also have two ball pythons, a male and a female, who are now almost two years old. The male is a little less than 2kg, and the female is right about as big as the boa.

I'd like to keep them in the same tank, as I have a very large tank for the pythons (who have lived together for most of their lives). Mainly, I'd like them in the same tank as it's quite large and simplifies my life, and the boa is now getting too big for the tank he is in. The boa is eating twice a week, and the pythons are eating once a week (when they're not being moody, but it's winter, and they kind of slow down in winter).

Anyways, I've kept the boa segregated from the pythons for purposes of quarantine. He's quite healthy and the pythons are of course healthy. I'm comfortable with them coming into contact (I've been careful to clean up before handling them in sequence, before cleaning tanks, etc, so they haven't been introduced in any sense yet), but I am wondering if there are any sort of procedures for making sure nobody gets unhappy in the tank.

The boa is quite easy going, and the pythons are, well, sweet like ball pythons are. It's kind of cute, they're inseparable.

Oh, the other thing is, seems to me now would be a good time to introduce them, given the boa is only going to get bigger, and the pythons are going to grow into their five-to-six-feet while he does that. I'd rather not introduce an eight foot snake to a pair of five-foot-snakes.

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I was reading through this And I will say you have gotten ALOT of good info. And I will as well, we all make.mistakes. I've personally owned reptiles as pets for under a year. BUT! I learned all of my.knowledge from a pet store I volunteered at... some right some wrong, that's how life is.

To housing snakes together... its just not worth it in the end.. we currently house together two.males BECAUSE we took in our pastel and HAD a tank for him. Sadly.my fiancée destroyed it... so How we have two snakes housed together, and yes I'll be honest they feed better, but I believe they're trying to outcompete each other.

In the end, just house them all by themselves and you'll do.just fine. The only way around this is when you're breeding.

Just NEVER, NEVER house different species of snakes together. Would you house a BP with a king cobra? ;)

http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/sho...t=cohabitation

graphic images.

I don't think it's really necessary to continue telling the OP why not to keep her ball and boa together. :)

It's awkward timing, but welcome to BP.net! ;)