Would you buy an ASF eater?

Just trying to get an idea of everyone's' feelings towards this subject.

No, I wouldn't.

If I think I have a good chance of converting, I might, i.e. hatchling. If it's an adult that will only eat them, no.

I breed them, so I would. But even if I didn't, if I found a snake that I really wanted, being started on ASFs wouldn't be a deal breaker. It would just make me try harder and be more determined to get them to switch, knowing that I got the exact animal I wanted...

No.

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I would never buy an adult that has been on a steady diet of ASF. Never again. I would consider buying a hatchling so that I have the opportunity to get them onto F/T to problem. My buddy is a well established breeder in my area and he feeds ASF. He is also breeding his own stock.. LOL.. His animals are amazing quality and at good prices so I do/ will continue to buy from him even though his hatchlings are fed ASF hoppers.

I only have a few that are not ASF eaters.
If I buy a ball that is a rat eater, they soon become an ASF eater.
That is still thier natural food.

I have bought snakes that eat only asf's, but then I breed them so it's no issue for me.
The problem is most people do not breed them or have access to them, so you are limiting your potential sales to that small group that does.

I would, and I would much rather purchase an ASF eater then a mouser.

We started our BP collection in '07, and I started breeding ASF's at that time.
Our collection was made up of mostly '07 hatchlings at that time.

ASF's are so prolific that I was able to feed our collection of 50 snakes every 5 days from 12 ASF breeder colonies of 1.5 each.

Once our hatchlings reached somewhere around the 500g mark, it was taking too long for the ASF's to grow out to be a decent sized meal, and the snakes were getting 2-3 ASF's per feeding.
Our collection was not only growing in size, but also in numbers.

I decided to start breeding regular rats to feed everybody, and with the exception of one snake, I had no issues switching them over.

I had picked up an Adult female Normal from Eugene Bessette back then, that was also an ASF only eater.
She is an aggressive rat eater.

I also picked up two female Cinnamons from Mark Batch that he swore were ASF only eaters and would not take regular rats.
I never fed either of those snakes an ASF, and they are both very aggressive rat eaters.

i would, but i started the post below so that is kinda obvious:D. The snakes poop less with them, seems like they put more of the rat on than a norway (even though norways get bigger) they consistently eat on them, easy to breed, and here in michigan pretty easy to find, smell less than norways and its bp's natural food, so naturally they all love them..:banana: haha i love this banana guy

Interesting responses so far. Keep em coming!

there are plenty of BPs out there that have only seen errday rats

No, because you can't get ASFs in CA as they are illegal here.

ASFs aren't easy to come by here. I could get them at the monthly reptile show if they're not sold out by the time I get there. Sometimes a local shop has some for sale. Sometimes (often, actually) not.

So I currently would not buy a snake that eats ASFs only. If they became more easily obtainable, such as in if Rodent Pro carried them in frozen and sold them at the monthly show, they yeah, I would consider an ASF only snake.

I'm puzzled why most of the rodent suppliers don't carry ASFs in frozen stock.

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Originally Posted by Inknsteel

I breed them, so I would. But even if I didn't, if I found a snake that I really wanted, being started on ASFs wouldn't be a deal breaker. It would just make me try harder and be more determined to get them to switch, knowing that I got the exact animal I wanted...

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I second this reply!! :D

As I've stated in other threads, my breeders and hold backs are fed ASFs. However, snakes I plan on selling, I feed frozen/thawed rats. I will start hatchlings on ASFs, then switch them over to F/T mouse hoppers, then move them over to F/T rats.

I'm in California (where asf's are illegal. I'll be moving out of state in the near future though)....so unless I ABSOLUTELY HAVE to have the asf eating snake, I would pass it up 99.99% of the time. I only own the "normal rat" eaters.

I would but only if they were heavy enough to survive a good couple/few months without eating if they go on strike.

I would buy an ASF only eating snake, and I have. That's because:

1. I breed them
2. It's either ASFs or mice, and I'd rather have them eat the larger prey item. It's illegal to have live regular rats here, and it's expensive to get regular f/t rats locally. I'm not paying 9 dollars for a small rat.

I have and will again.

Only if it was an amaizing deal. Otherwise no

Nope I can't find asfs easily here in vt.


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Nope. I even started a colony of 50 ASFs to breed and sell, it was a terrible idea. My answer as to why can be summed up in one word, evil.

Can someone tell me what is wrong with ASFs? When I bought my BP, that's what the previous owner fed him. I have since found an ASF breeder in my area, and continue to feed him the same, and he's doing really well. Is it just that they are hard to come by?

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Originally Posted by MisterDespair

Can someone tell me what is wrong with ASFs? When I bought my BP, that's what the previous owner fed him. I have since found an ASF breeder in my area, and continue to feed him the same, and he's doing really well. Is it just that they are hard to come by?

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they can be hard to come by and in some states are illegal, some breeders will say that once a snake eats one its hooked, this in my opinion is false as i have a decent sized collection and have no problems giving rats or mice if i run low on asf's, but you will hear this argument made on both sides that they will and wont get hooked, some people say that they are mean, i again say this is false as i can pick mine up with no issue and have only been bitten twice in the 2 years i have been breeding them so i guess it all depends on how you want to look at them, i look at them as being ball pythons original and natural prey item (and they eat them like they are) but others view them as a horrible animal that no snake should ever be allowed to eat.

I don't think I would, only because I've read quite a few conflicting sides of ASF eaters. I've never personally dealt with ASFs, and they are very hard to get in my area, so for the sake of the snake I probably wouldn't. If I can't guarantee that I can get a food item for a snake readily available, then I'd pass on it.

The only three con's I have noticed so far is they take a while to breed, a while to grow, and are real flighty and like to jump around. Not really anything that would not make them acceptable as an option.

Somethings I have read are that they are serious chewers and mortor style tubs are a no go. Not sure as to the accuracy of that as the pair I have barely chew on a paper towel roll. They also have a plastic bottle that has not been chewed yet :gj:

A wheel almost seems like a must. They love it and seem to have a lot of fun.

I would but that is because I have my own supply of them. Personally I think they are a superior source of food for balls compared to rats/mice and really get a bad reputation.

They do chew but have yet to chew out of my rack with concrete mixing tubs. Have had them for about 2 years.

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Originally Posted by Focal X

The only three con's I have noticed so far is they take a while to breed, a while to grow, and are real flighty and like to jump around. Not really anything that would not make them acceptable as an option.

Somethings I have read are that they are serious chewers and mortor style tubs are a no go. Not sure as to the accuracy of that as the pair I have barely chew on a paper towel roll. They also have a plastic bottle that has not been chewed yet :gj:

A wheel almost seems like a must. They love it and seem to have a lot of fun.

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Originally Posted by 98bcobra

I would but that is because I have my own supply of them. Personally I think they are a superior source of food for balls compared to rats/mice and really get a bad reputation.

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couldnt agree more!

no.
spooky

F/T rats ONLY 'round here.

Balls are NOT that big of a challenge to feed. ASFs are totally unnecessary and make things more complicated than they need to be. If I see ASF in an ad, I stop reading. The only way I would consider one that had been fed them is if they also take rats, cause once they come to me, they'll never be offered an ASF again.

K-I-S-S.

I have raised asfs and will never have anything to do with them again, including a snake that eats them.
I raised asf's to sell the people that were buying imported ball pythons from the local pet shop that was buying them and not getting them eating, (my wife and I owned a pet shop and only sold captive babies) but it was a good deal, they buy the ball from me and get a good eater or buy one from them and pay 6-10 bucks a piece for asf's from me. I will admit I over charged for them buy hey supply and demand right

Anyway after dealing with the little buggers they bite alot, that doesnt bother me, but it does bother me when they bite so much I become alergic and every time they bite me my hand sells up for days at a time.

I have a hard time believing the poll results. I think some people are possibly answering that without thinking about how difficult it can be to acquire ASF. They are even tough just to keep and breed compared to rats. No ASF eating snakes at my place ever. I skip ads that say ASF when I'm looking for snakes.

Regards,

B

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Originally Posted by Simple Man

I have a hard time believing the poll results. I think some people are possibly answering that without thinking about how difficult it can be to acquire ASF. They are even tough just to keep and breed compared to rats. No ASF eating snakes at my place ever. I skip ads that say ASF when I'm looking for snakes.

Regards,

B

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I have bread rats and I currently breed ASFs and find ASFs to be much easier. They require less room, smell less and have large litters. You don't have to separate the females to give birth or care for their litters. The only thing I don't like about them is they take so long to grow up, but that has its advantages when you have a bunch of baby balls around.

Also, my adult snakes have switched from rats to ASFs, back to rats and to ASFs again with no problem. All of my babies were started on ASFs, but the ones I plan on selling have been converted over to F/T rats. People who have purchased snakes from me have reported that those babies are eating fine, regardless of what the buyer chooses to feed.

Yes, there are picky snakes but you could just as easily have a ball python that was started on mouse hoppers being stuck on mice. I don't think ASFs are as evil as people make them out to be.

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Originally Posted by Simple Man

I have a hard time believing the poll results. I think some people are possibly answering that without thinking about how difficult it can be to acquire ASF. They are even tough just to keep and breed compared to rats. No ASF eating snakes at my place ever. I skip ads that say ASF when I'm looking for snakes.

Regards,

B

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I have a hard time believing the results too, based on all of the fear mongering I've been seeing around here. :rofl:

And ASFs are way easier to breed than rats, by the way. Have you tried, or are you just repeating what you've read?

I would buy an ASF eater.

However, I would not sell ASF eaters, lol. I feed my snakes on Norway rats only, because there are so many people that are turned off by ASF eaters.

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Originally Posted by spitzu

I have a hard time believing the results too, based on all of the fear mongering I've been seeing around here. :rofl:

And ASFs are way easier to breed than rats, by the way. Have you tried, or are you just repeating what you've read?

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I had a couple of ASFs that would not breed for 3 MONTHS! Then finally I wrapped a towel around my hand (they were biters), and closely examined them. They were both male.

Like previously stated if its a ball I really want I wouldn't call it a deal breaker but would prefer all my snakes on rats. To those who say the Asfs aren't mean you have clearly never put your hand in a tank with a litter of babys! They bite HARD! Besides that they take FOREVER to grow. They have their uses but I avoid them if possible.

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Originally Posted by meowmeowkazoo

I had a couple of ASFs that would not breed for 3 MONTHS! Then finally I wrapped a towel around my hand (they were biters), and closely examined them. They were both male.

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Ya' got, I said Ya' got the wrong plumbing son.
:8:

... and I hope that does not mean they started breeding after 3 Months.
(Not that there's anything wrong with that.)
:rolleyes:

I breed ASF as a source of food mostly for my non-snake animals. When I have some excess I'll feed a round or two(or three) to my snakes and it doesn't seem to affect their affinity for the F/T I typically feed.. These snakes that get hung up on ASF are ones fed them from hatchling status or what?

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Originally Posted by spitzu

I have a hard time believing the results too, based on all of the fear mongering I've been seeing around here. :rofl:

And ASFs are way easier to breed than rats, by the way. Have you tried, or are you just repeating what you've read?

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No need to try to flip this around into something it isn't :) I'm here to learn too.

You're the first handful of people that I've heard say great things about ASF. I have a lot of friends in the hobby and some even have... *gasp* ASF colonies (or had them). No one has ever told me they are easy to keep. I haven't bred ASF because I don't have anything I feed eating them. They aren't readily available in my area (or many areas) either. Reptiles aren't as prolific where I live. The community is much smaller than many parts of the US. I've only seen a few colonies in person and they weren't local. Rats are easy to keep, breed, and are almost universally available in all areas. That's why they are my preference.

How did you get into ASF rats?

Regards,

B

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Originally Posted by Simple Man

No need to try to flip this around into something it isn't :) I'm here to learn too.

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Yeah sorry, I didn't mean for that to come out quite like it did.

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You're the first handful of people that I've heard say great things about ASF. I have a lot of friends in the hobby and some even have... *gasp* ASF colonies (or had them). No one has ever told me they are easy to keep. I haven't bred ASF because I don't have anything I feed eating them. They aren't readily available in my area (or many areas) either. Reptiles aren't as prolific where I live. The community is much smaller than many parts of the US. I've only seen a few colonies in person and they weren't local. Rats are easy to keep, breed, and are almost universally available in all areas. That's why they are my preference.

How did you get into ASF rats?

Regards,

B

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ASFs weren't plentiful here when I was looking for them either. It took me over a month to find a guy nearby that was getting rid of some. I didn't buy them because I had ASF eaters... I went out and bought them specifically because I wanted to breed them and feed them to our snakes.

Yes, they can sometimes be nippy when not handled much, but I have been maintaining anywhere between 500-1000 of them daily and have probably been bitten less than 10 times since I started. None of those drew blood. You just have to learn how to handle them.

I think the best thing about them is that they're the perfect size. I don't understand why people complain about having to feed 4+ to their BPs. Those ASFs are either too small, or they're way overfeeding. We don't usually feed more than 1 or 2 a week, and almost every single one of the hatchlings we bought last year has put on over 1000 grams.

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Originally Posted by spitzu

Yeah sorry, I didn't mean for that to come out quite like it did.



ASFs weren't plentiful here when I was looking for them either. It took me over a month to find a guy nearby that was getting rid of some. I didn't buy them because I had ASF eaters... I went out and bought them specifically because I wanted to breed them and feed them to our snakes.

Yes, they can sometimes be nippy when not handled much, but I have been maintaining anywhere between 500-1000 of them daily and have probably been bitten less than 10 times since I started. None of those drew blood. You just have to learn how to handle them.

I think the best thing about them is that they're the perfect size. I don't understand why people complain about having to feed 4+ to their BPs. Those ASFs are either too small, or they're way overfeeding. We don't usually feed more than 1 or 2 a week, and almost every single one of the hatchlings we bought last year has put on over 1000 grams.

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No worries. Things can come across wrong on "teh internets".

That's pretty amazing. Have you switched over to feeding ASF exclusively?

Regards,

B

Yep, we switched around March or April once we had our colonies producing enough for everyone.

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Originally Posted by rjk890

Ya' got, I said Ya' got the wrong plumbing son.
:8:

... and I hope that does not mean they started breeding after 3 Months.
(Not that there's anything wrong with that.)
:rolleyes:

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:rofl: No, they were breeding the whole time, which is why I didn't suspect anything for 3 months.

I bought one that was eating ASF's and he moved over to rats with no problem.

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Originally Posted by spitzu

Yep, we switched around March or April once we had our colonies producing enough for everyone.

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You and i sound to be on the same page, i have switched mine over about year and a half ago, been bittin 2 times and its my own fault (had my hand in their food cage) but once i wean mine everytime i feed they are usually in a big pile in the tub so i just rub them all like i would my dog and i dont seem to have any aggression at all. Dont have issues with chewing, and my snakes seem to be packing on weight like crazy with these guys, and i only feed once a week, usually a touch under girth.

I feel kinda like this--

IF ASFs were a reliably available feeder in this area and IF they were readily and reliably available as frozen feeders, I would not hesitate to buy ASF feeding snakes.

They aren't, in my area. The availability is spotty--mostly only at the monthly reptile sale, and not always even there. They aren't available f/t around here either. Those that are available are priced higher than rats of a comperable size.

For the benefit of my snakes, I prefer to feed that which is readily and most reliably available--rats. I do have a few rodent colonies started up but there will probably be times when my production runs short and I don't plan on putting my snakes on a fast when that occurs, I plan on buying them food. That food has to be obtainable, and I can't count on finding ASFs locally.

Next year (hopefully) when my girls are old enough to breed, any offspring are going to be started on rats. When I sell or trade them I want the new owner to receive an animal that they can obtain prey for easily and relatively cheaply. If ASFs were readily available and rats were not, I'd be starting them on ASFs.

I feed what works for my hatchligns, 100% of them will take asf,rat,mouse no problems for the customers.

Adult asf/mouse eaters are a different story as their harder to get to switch, But IMO dont matter what their eating so long their eating.

Theres a few online suppliers that sell frozen ASF which is legal in CA and GA to have.