PVC Enclosures - How to Heat ?

Here are some pictures of the PVC enclosure I am about to buy for my BP. They are made by All Reptiles in Toronto, Canada. I plan on going to check them out before buying one. Has anyone dealt with these guys before, and if not, what are some important things I need to be looking for when it comes to plastic snake cages?

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2...losurepvc1.jpg
http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/2...losurepvc4.jpg
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/1...losurepvc3.jpg
http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/3...losurepvc2.jpg

They said that they use these tanks in their own store and use flexwatt underneath to heat them. Do these seem like good cages to you guys?

My friend bought a colombian pastel from there, healthy as can be, so I trust them a little already. Just thought that buying an enclosure might be smarter for now, until I am more familiar with snakes.

Right now my female BP is in a regular 20 gal glass, Im thinking of moving her within the next 3-4 months into a 48 Long x 24 Wide x 12 Deep PVC enclosure. She is very small for her age, 3 years old and 30 inches.

Is that size of an enclosure too big for her? I saw this guys enclosure and I wanted something similar.
http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/a...n/DSC00892.jpg
I think 48 x 12 x 12 might be better since shes probably not going to get too much bigger..

Heres a link to the store im buying it from: All Reptiles

Since heat lamps arent an option, I plan on getting a radiant heat panel to control air temps and to have a flexwatt as a hot spot. Is this a viable idea for such a big space ? Please let me know what the best way to heat such an enclosure is.

The lower ones just a uth will work the taller it is likely to need a RHP or CHE of some sort. PVCx isn't the best to heat through but it holds heat really well and maintains ambient temps.

They look nice, I don't have any from them.
I use flexwatt underneath and radiant heat panels inside, both with thermostats and works well

I haven't actually used my RHP yet so I don't know how well it works, but if I had a PVC enclosure like that I would probably install one on each end and use two separate tstats to control the hot/cool sides.

I would think that flexwatt has to get pretty hot to heat through PVC like that.

My PVC cage is heated with a radiant heat panel.

i have some heated with flexwatt and some heated with heat pannels. the pannels are the way to go.

IMO, radiant heat panels are the best way to heat PVC cages, unless your cages are in a temperature-controlled room that is between 80 and 82 F.

Although those cages do look very nice, in my experience ball pythons do much better in rack systems than in cages.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wh00h0069

IMO, radiant heat panels are the best way to heat PVC cages, unless your cages are in a temperature-controlled room that is between 80 and 82 F.

Although those cages do look very nice, in my experience ball pythons do much better in rack systems than in cages.

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Rack system probably wouldnt work for me though, right? I only have one BP at the moment, plan on getting another BP and another Boa in the future, and I want them all in their own cozy cages. Still trying to decide between wood and pvc; however, wood seems much harder to heat than pvc. Would have to deal with putting a UTH or flexwatt with a layer of plexi over top (dont really wanna go this route because I like to clean cages frequently)

Is my best bet to actually go in to the store and check the cages out? Maybe I should ask those guys what the best way to heat the cages is.

Im guessing a single RHP or a single Flexwatt isnt going to be enough to keep the temps up in a 48 x 24 x 12 enclosure. My house ambient temp is around 75 right now, but it will drop even lower as winter comes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mattchibi

Im guessing a single RHP or a single Flexwatt isnt going to be enough to keep the temps up in a 48 x 24 x 12 enclosure. My house ambient temp is around 75 right now, but it will drop even lower as winter comes.

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I use a single (properly sized) RHP in my pvc cages and they do a fantastic job. My house temp is usually 74 and I have no trouble maintaining temps for my IJ's, Corn and BRB Boaphile cages.



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My reptile basics is heated with a radiant heater.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Clementine_3

I use a single (properly sized) RHP in my pvc cages and they do a fantastic job. My house temp is usually 74 and I have no trouble maintaining temps for my IJ's, Corn and BRB Boaphile cages.



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I dont really understand how they work. most people ive seen have put the RHP in the middle of the ceiling.

But, if you put it in the middle, you wouldnt have a hot spot in your tank, right? if you were using just a rhp, wouldnt it be smarter to put it just on one side (say the left side), and then would it act like a heat lamp?

It would really help to know the dimensions of your pvc cages, as well as the temperatures needed for your snakes. Also where / what brand is your rhp? Thanks man :)

EDIT: Also, Im considering BOAPHILE plastics, anyone tried these enclosures before?

OK, here we go!
I have the Boaphile that is 24 x 48 x 18" and use a Pro-products RHP that is 12 x 18" and 65 watts. It is mounted in the upper right corner, the long way.
I just took temps for you, the cool side floor is 77.8, the warm spot (on top of the stack) is 90.7 and it is 83.3 where the snake is. It is 74.6 in the room.
The Corn's temps are 84.7 and 76.3, the boa's are 85.4 and 77.1. Those are floor temps, they don't have the stacked ledges that my IJ's have.
Here is a quick pic so you can sort of see what I am saying...
http://tapatalk.com/mu/aefc23c3-7c19-bbfb.jpg
Edit: I use Herpstat thermostats :)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by mattchibi

Rack system probably wouldnt work for me though, right? I only have one BP at the moment, plan on getting another BP and another Boa in the future, and I want them all in their own cozy cages. Still trying to decide between wood and pvc; however, wood seems much harder to heat than pvc. Would have to deal with putting a UTH or flexwatt with a layer of plexi over top (dont really wanna go this route because I like to clean cages frequently)

Is my best bet to actually go in to the store and check the cages out? Maybe I should ask those guys what the best way to heat the cages is.

Im guessing a single RHP or a single Flexwatt isnt going to be enough to keep the temps up in a 48 x 24 x 12 enclosure. My house ambient temp is around 75 right now, but it will drop even lower as winter comes.

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I use 80 watt RHPs in my 4x2x1 cages, and they work perfectly. My room is usually around 70 - 75 F. They don't run constantly either.

If you are going with a cage, then XPVC is the way to go. Some ball pythons do fine in cages, but I have noticed that mine do better in racks. Some people keep theirs in stand-alone tubs, but I would be too worried about them escaping. The rack encloses the tub, so the changes of that would be very slim. Racks also tend to hold heat in, since most are closed on all sides except the front.

If you are going to own more than one ball, then a rack would be the way to go. You could also keep the boas in the rack until they are too large.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mattchibi

I dont really understand how they work. most people ive seen have put the RHP in the middle of the ceiling.

But, if you put it in the middle, you wouldnt have a hot spot in your tank, right? if you were using just a rhp, wouldnt it be smarter to put it just on one side (say the left side), and then would it act like a heat lamp?

It would really help to know the dimensions of your pvc cages, as well as the temperatures needed for your snakes. Also where / what brand is your rhp? Thanks man :)

EDIT: Also, Im considering BOAPHILE plastics, anyone tried these enclosures before?

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Yes, you should place them on one side of the cage. That will give you a hot side and a cool side. The benefit of RHP of flexwatt is that RHPs heat the ambient temp as well as the floor, while flexwatt only heats the floor.

Thanks so much you guys! Both of the last posts helped me alot.

Just purchased a pvc enclosure from All Reptiles, looks like this: (Dimensions are 4 x 2 x 1)

It smells a bit tho, of something glue-ish or rubber, so im going to keep the glass open and let it air out for a week. I dont plan on putting my bp in until I order the RHP or flexwatt. Im pretty convinced if I make a setup like Clementine (where she has the option to bask), then the RHP would be the way to go.

Height wise, its a small enclosure, only 12" high. If I placed the RHP at the top of the right side, and offered it a raised basking spot, is there any risk of my BP touching the RHP and getting burned ?

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2...losurepvc1.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mattchibi

Thanks so much you guys! Both of the last posts helped me alot.

Just purchased a pvc enclosure from All Reptiles, looks like this: (Dimensions are 4 x 2 x 1)

It smells a bit tho, of something glue-ish or rubber, so im going to keep the glass open and let it air out for a week. I dont plan on putting my bp in until I order the RHP or flexwatt. Im pretty convinced if I make a setup like Clementine (where she has the option to bask), then the RHP would be the way to go.

Height wise, its a small enclosure, only 12" high. If I placed the RHP at the top of the right side, and offered it a raised basking spot, is there any risk of my BP touching the RHP and getting burned ?

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2...losurepvc1.jpg

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Also, I was wondering how/ if I should light up the enclosure ? Drilling a hole for the bulb and then drilling on a bulb guard as well ?

They can't burn themselves! That is one of the great features, no burns.
My Boaphiles had lights installed, but yes, drill holes for the cord and screws and mount it. I would use a small under the cabinet florescent type, they have covers and will be plenty bright. Cut the plug off so you only need a small hole then buy a snap on replacement. If your RHP didn't come that way the do the same.
Don't forget, the bulb will add a few degrees of heat, keep an eye on that...

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Personally with a one foot tall enclosure I'd go with flex watt or stick on uth (no sagging issues with them) over a RHP they are usually used in taller enclosures and arboreal animals.

It is also a lot cheaper and you could put the money saved toward a good t-stat.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kitedemon

Personally with a one foot tall enclosure I'd go with flex watt or stick on uth (no sagging issues with them) over a RHP they are usually used in taller enclosures and arboreal animals.

It is also a lot cheaper and you could put the money saved toward a good t-stat.

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Already have a herpstat ;) thanks for the advice tho. I think I may go with RHP just because in the past, my UTH (zoomed) hasnt heated up too hot for me and Im concerned whether it will penetrate the pvc or not. And if they cannot be burned on the RHP, thats another plus.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Clementine_3

They can't burn themselves! That is one of the great features, no burns.
My Boaphiles had lights installed, but yes, drill holes for the cord and screws and mount it. I would use a small under the cabinet florescent type, they have covers and will be plenty bright. Cut the plug off so you only need a small hole then buy a snap on replacement. If your RHP didn't come that way the do the same.
Don't forget, the bulb will add a few degrees of heat, keep an eye on that...

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Do radiant heat panels usually come with seperate snap on plugs ? that would make a lot more sense. If it doesnt come like that, where can I buy snap on plugs ? and how would I cut the original plug off / set it up?

Yeah that was one of the main reasons I was gonna go with boaphile, cuz it came with the light fixture.. but I decided to support my local reptile shop instead ^^ I have been advised to use LED strips if I just want simple lighting, but I may consider the long fluorescent bulbs w/ covers.

My panels came with snap on plugs. You can pick them up in the hardware store, they are really cheap and easy. Just cut the actual plug off and pop the new one on to the end of the cord.
I have used them for a few things around the house, they come in handy when puppies chew cords :O

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I have an Animal Plastics T12 (48x24x24). Animal Plastics cages are made from 1/2 inch thick PVC. The cages that you are looking at I believe are only 1/4 or 1/8th inch thick PVC. I use 11 inch flexwatt on one side to provide a hot side, but I also have a 11x40 inch IR heat panel on the top the heat panel is regulated by my herpstat 4 to control the ambient air temp in the cage. this way the entire cage stays at 80 and the flexwatt provides a hotspot of 92

How hot are your RHPs getting? I just installed my Pro Heat panel in a 2x2 melamine cage and it is barely getting the bottom of the hot side to 82-83, and the surface temp of the panel is 180 degrees according to my temp gun.

I have no issues with heating through PVCx (1/4 and 3/8 inch and 1/2 Pvc) with UTH systems. I would be concerned at having any surface that is hotter than 100ºF inside the enclosure. The RHP I have encountered have all been to heat arboreal snakes where the heat gradient goes up and down not horizontally. It seems poor efficiency to heat horizontally with a vertically mounted panel. In 12 inches how much height does the panel take 2 inches or more? That is getting hard to reach back for cleaning.

Tubes inside an enclosure do a wonderful job of raising ambient temps inside the enclosure and acting as a passive 'engine' for a ventilation method. I use tubes in all my custom enclosures to help keep the ambient temps during the day. Mine are on 12 hours and allow the temp to ramp up in a very natural way and down over night. (at 6 hour intervals starting at 9am 77ºF, 84ºF 82ºF 79ºF)

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Originally Posted by spitzu

How hot are your RHPs getting? I just installed my Pro Heat panel in a 2x2 melamine cage and it is barely getting the bottom of the hot side to 82-83, and the surface temp of the panel is 180 degrees according to my temp gun.

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how long has it been running and what size is it?

i have two heat pannels in PVC cages and neither get that hot and i have hot spots in the 88-90 degree range.

It's a 12"x10" and I've had it on for a few days now. Think I'm going to grab the next size up.

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