One of TWO brand new babies!

So today I went to visit my friends Kelly and Art of Kelly's Balls and I ended up bringing home TWO beautiful new babies! Now, the thing about these babies is... The parents were a Het Clown female and a Het Clown/Het Ghost male. NEITHER parent is a pastel and mom has never been bred TO a pastel. However....

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-c...2B20.34.56.jpg

the yellow on the sides is actually a bit more orange-ish in person and you can see a little bit of the blushing, as well as the flames on it's side. Just a stunning little baby!

The best I can come up with is one of the parents carrying a recessive pastel gene. they both are visual normals. This is PERPLEXING!!

there is no het for pastel. you could maybe said a pastel was het for super pastel but thats about it

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Originally Posted by BallsUnlimited

there is no het for pastel. you could maybe said a pastel was het for super pastel but thats about it

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I never said het for pastel. I said het ghost/het clown.

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Originally Posted by DeadLegs

So today I went to visit my friends Kelly and Art of Kelly's Balls and I ended up bringing home TWO beautiful new babies! Now, the thing about these babies is... The parents were a Het Clown female and a Het Clown/Het Ghost male. NEITHER parent is a pastel and mom has never been bred TO a pastel. However....

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-c...2B20.34.56.jpg

the yellow on the sides is actually a bit more orange-ish in person and you can see a little bit of the blushing, as well as the flames on it's side. Just a stunning little baby!

The best I can come up with is one of the parents carrying a recessive pastel gene. they both are visual normals. This is PERPLEXING!!

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thats what got me confused on what you were saying

It doesn't really look like a pastel to me, can you get better pics ?

Belly shots and some face shots would tell you right off.


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nice looking and the fact that its poss het clown and poss het ghost make it that much better!!!
does look pastel'ish. but not convinced its a recessive trait. het ghosts will usually have a lighter color and it may just be one hell of a normal. better shots of belly and face are for sure required as stated by the previous poster.
adam jeffery

you did say pastel recessive o.O it's probably just a very pretty normal (with poss hets) :)

Better pics would help, but it looks like an Enchi...

Thanks guys, I'll try to get better pictures once they settle in. I used the word "recessive" because it's the first thing that popped in my head, since neither parent is a pastel. but these guys really are BRIGHT, like brighter than my actual pastel when I got her originally.

Again though, I'll take s'more pictures in a few days when they've settled down.

At the dismay of this little one, I took a couple of more pics today to hopefully give a clearer view. Keep in mind, this baby's parents are both VERY normal looking. Mom is 100% het for Clown, daddy is 66% het Clown, 50% het Ghost. Mommy has NEVER been bred to a Pastel.

Here's baby #1:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-y...2B17.19.11.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-m...2B17.19.45.jpg
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/--...2B17.20.23.jpg
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-T...2B17.21.29.jpg

And here's baby # 2
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Y...2B17.49.48.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-l...2B17.49.59.jpg
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-C...2B17.50.31.jpg

I am still perplexed!! They KIND of have Enchi characteristics in some ways, but then they don't. They KIND OF have Fire characteristics in some ways, but then they don't. They look at face value like Pastels but NEITHER parent is a pastel nor has ever been bred to a Pastel.

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Originally Posted by DeadLegs

I used the word "recessive" because it's the first thing that popped in my head, since neither parent is a pastel.

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Recessive is het.

My opinion is that the female was bred to a pastel at some point judging by the second baby, for two reasons. One, females can retain sperm from the previous breeding season, and two, it's not uncommon for breeders to accidentally put in a male they didn't mean to, or forgot they did. It really looks like a pastel to me and since pastels aren't recessive.... Does the breeder have a pastel male? And how old was she when the breeder got her?

They are both beautiful!! I have noticed het babies being a different color! Especially carriers of the ghost and clown gene! I bet they will prove out for you! If not send them my way. I have a few extra tubs sitting around;)

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Originally Posted by SlitherinSisters

Recessive is het.

My opinion is that the female was bred to a pastel at some point judging by the second baby, for two reasons. One, females can retain sperm from the previous breeding season, and two, it's not uncommon for breeders to accidentally put in a male they didn't mean to, or forgot they did. It really looks like a pastel to me and since pastels aren't recessive.... Does the breeder have a pastel male? And how old was she when the breeder got her?

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I know that recessive is het, like I said it was just the first thing that popped into my head. I couldn't think of another word so I went with it, lol.

I understand your "argument" also, I know females can retain sperm from previous locks, etc. However, accidental pairing? I can get this angle to some point. but any responsible, intelligent breeder would still realize that an "accidental" pairing should still be kept on record in the event that something of this nature does occur and I can speak as a genuine witness of how meticulous and, dare I say, OCD my friends are about record keeping.

They also are not breeders on HALF of the level of BHB or NERD, for example. They don't have thousands or hundreds of animals to attempt to keep track of. This, in my thinking, means much less room for error in recording.

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Originally Posted by koloo921

They are both beautiful!! I have noticed het babies being a different color! Especially carriers of the ghost and clown gene! I bet they will prove out for you! If not send them my way. I have a few extra tubs sitting around;)

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TeeHee, nice try! ;)

I've got their breeding planned out already. Since obviously the male will be the first to mature and be breedable, I'm going to pair him with my adult pastel female. If I get super pastels, I know what I've got. If not, there's some kind of weird fluke going on in their colors and I'm still stumped, lol.

I'm not a huge breeder and I put the wrong male in once this year. There were a couple breeders just this year who had accidental breedings and didn't notice till the eggs hatched. They were what I would consider very good breeders with lots of records. It happens, and not just with large or bad record keeping breeders.

I agree with Stephanie. The first one looks like a nice reduced normal and the second looks to be a low grade pastel. Stuff happens and everyone makes mistakes. Good luck proving them out for whatever you think they might be!

Regards,

B

most likely a HET. Het clowns and HET ghost look very impressive. I know of several breeders who high a very HIGH sucess rate at 66% by the look

I purchased the mother to these animals in 2007 as a 2006 cb baby. She was 300-400g at purchase. The father was purchased as a sub adult in 2008. This female "Stoney" was bred only to the male "Krusty" in 2008. No eggs where laid. In 2009 Stoney was again bred only to Krusty producing 5 eggs on 6/26/2010. We produced 4 normals and 1 that looked different. Pastelish like these guys. In 2010 Stoney was again paired with Krusty once a month from Nov to March. I also paired her with Warrick (the only other male ever put in the cage with her) a spider a 50% het pied. (this was the oops breeding. but it was logged.) When I get home I will post some pics of the sibling from last year, she is pastelish in appearance. The offspring from last year and this year have white lips, mostly clear bellies and yellow lines in their eyes and resemble lower end pastels. It is a dinker project of ours. We can't sell them as pastels since they may not be but I hope there is something going on. Steve knows that pastel isn't recessive and so do we but he was expressing my sentiment when I was trying to describe them. After 2 breedings it appears that this male and female produce animals that closely resemble pastels.