I need opinions on these.

I have produced a very interesting clutch as a result of breeding a dinker male back to one of his daughters. The dam of the clutch from which the daughter (dam of this clutch) hatched was a banded female who has proven dominant. These babies look similar to classic jungles/labyrinths but I don't think they are. Who get's an entire clutch of those? I think they may be the homo version of the sire but only more breeding will tell. What do you all think?
Babies http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics038.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics037.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics026.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics028.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics023.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics014.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics016.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics039.jpg
Sire
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics040.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics046.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics044.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics043.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics042.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics041.jpg
Dam
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics049.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics048.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics047.jpg
Dam's male sib
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/...hnspics051.jpg

I can't answer any of your questions, but I love those busy patterns!:gj:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by koloo921

I can't answer any of your questions, but I love those busy patterns!:gj:

---

Thanks. They are even cooler in person. They haven't shed yet but I can tell the really light one is going to glow. I hope it does turn out to be geneticly inheritable and not classic jungle. The moustaches make me worry but I would love to see what that pattern would do to a clown.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnAvilla

Thanks. They are even cooler in person. They haven't shed yet but I can tell the really light one is going to glow. I hope it does turn out to be geneticly inheritable and not classic jungle. The moustaches make me worry but I would love to see what that pattern would do to a clown.

---

I can't wait to see them after they shed! Keep us posted:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by koloo921

I can't wait to see them after they shed! Keep us posted:)

---

Will do. Anyone else have an opin?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnAvilla

Anyone else have an opin?

---

Yes, they look like beautiful normals, I'm not seeing anything that makes me think otherwise :confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by snakesRkewl

Yes, they look like beautiful normals, I'm not seeing anything that makes me think otherwise :confused:

---

I've seen plenty of norms and morphs and I've got to disagree there. My photography skills aren't the greatest but they are at least jungles if not something more. Normals don't have black moustaches.

I love that crazy pattern. I don't know much about the black staches going on. I have a picture of a friends normal that has a very light one but not as obvious as your guys. They look like crazy awesome normals but only more work can really tell. Good luck- it looks like a great project:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cendalla

I love that crazy pattern. I don't know much about the black staches going on. I have a picture of a friends normal that has a very light one but not as obvious as your guys. They look like crazy awesome normals but only more work can really tell. Good luck- it looks like a great project:)

---

I agree 100% Much more work to prove them out. I've never seen a light stach before. Do you have pics? I would be interested to see. It's probably a jungle. Does it have a spot on its head and a busy pattern? So far, to the best of my knowledge only Classic Jungle/Labyrinth have moustaches. That is why I am asking opinions. That morph is totally random or at best a very complex mix of genes. I am hoping I have something more reproducible but the staches make me doubtful. The cool thing with balls is you never know what the combos will look like and considering what leopards are doing I can see these having some great combo potential if the prove to be reproducible. I just can't see an entire clutch coming out with the same random look, all having the laby pattern, at random. I am guardedly hopeful.

Nice babies! Love the patterns.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnAvilla

I agree 100% Much more work to prove them out. I've never seen a light stach before. Do you have pics? I would be interested to see. It's probably a jungle. Does it have a spot on its head and a busy pattern? So far, to the best of my knowledge only Classic Jungle/Labyrinth have moustaches. That is why I am asking opinions. That morph is totally random or at best a very complex mix of genes. I am hoping I have something more reproducible but the staches make me doubtful. The cool thing with balls is you never know what the combos will look like and considering what leopards are doing I can see these having some great combo potential if the prove to be reproducible. I just can't see an entire clutch coming out with the same random look, all having the laby pattern, at random. I am guardedly hopeful.

---

Sorry it took so long- I had to dig through about 400 pics to find them.
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/img_1056.jpg

These are rescued siblings (so they were told). Both have the light facial marking and both are female. They aren't going to breed them because they had too much damage when they took them in five years ago (bad neglect and abuse). They both have similar patterns but big color differences. The heads too different too. This is the best I can find showing the facial marks. It's even on both sides. Not nearly as dark as yours but certainly there.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/img_1063.jpg

I would assume they are normals just from looking at them, but I am no expert so I'll leave that up for discussion. Nice looking babies though!

I feel like the guy with the sulfer here LOL. Thanks for the input. I am telling you though, in person these do not look normal. Even my wife who wouldn't know a black pastel from a normal thought these looked "weird". Cinderella, check out nerd's collection page. I can't make out too much in those pics but the spot on that first ones head along with the stach makes me think jungle. Usually they are lighter but there is some variation. Thanks for posting.