Why wont he eat? :(

So I bought a very lovely '09 breeder spider male from South Central Herp, and he is gorgeous! (maybe I should post some pics of him later :D)

But he is acting totally uninterested in food. I tried with a live medium rat, he really didn't care and removed the rat after watching for about 20 minutes. I figured out he eats f/t and live no problem and he should be okay to eat again now. But I tried a f/t today and he was like "Whatever" :( Im kind of nervous, but then again maybe I just have those 'new hobbiest' jitters! Hah!

Check ur temps,make sure hides are snug so the fella is comfy. And wait a week before trying to feed again.

Well medium rats are too much for ball pythons unless you have a massive 3000g+ female.

Try live rat pup over night and check back in morning. Be sure you wait 5-7 days between refusals. If he has size on him dont worry. My mojo male went off food 3 months ago once he stopped breeding.

Is he in a rack tub the same size that he was use to where he came from? If not, then be sure he has tight fitting hides and you leave him alone for a week. Breeders that feed FT usually just put the rodent in the tub or lay it in front of the hide at dusk and check back a little while later.

Many FT eaters are shy eaters.. That's the one problem with FT feeders. They become the snakes that don't want food that moves and so they usually only eat when it's dark and still.

So give it another few days at least, make sure the enclosure is right, and try again. Also make sure the rat you're offering isn't too big.

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Well medium rats are too much for ball pythons unless you have a massive 3000g+ female.

Try live rat pup over night and check back in morning. Be sure you wait 5-7 days between refusals. If he has size on him dont worry. My mojo male went off food 3 months ago once he stopped breeding.

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Oh well I was just using the "girth" test, and was reccomended by many keepers and have been doing that with my normal female for a while :X! But I'll take your word for it and try something smaller, maybe hes just shy/intimidated? But he is a hefty boy, and seems alright, Im just real particular about that kind of stuff ;D!

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

Is he in a rack tub the same size that he was use to where he came from? If not, then be sure he has tight fitting hides and you leave him alone for a week. Breeders that feed FT usually just put the rodent in the tub or lay it in front of the hide at dusk and check back a little while later.

Many FT eaters are shy eaters.. That's the one problem with FT feeders. They become the snakes that don't want food that moves and so they usually only eat when it's dark and still.

So give it another few days at least, make sure the enclosure is right, and try again. Also make sure the rat you're offering isn't too big.

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Hes in a 32 quart tub with a hide and large water bowl. But yeah thats kind of what I thought of , that he may just be shy. I guess I'll just leave him be for now ;]

I'd get a weight ASAP, and watch for any weight loss. Maybe contact the breeder and find out what he was eating and how often before you got him.

How long have you had him? If you just got him he may not eat for a few weeks until he feels secure in his new environment. Don't worry about the not eating thing so much.... Yes it's never good but unless he's losing weight or shows signs of being sick then I'm sure he's ok. They all go off feed.....That's just what they do. Plus if hes a proven breeder then he may know the routine and he may know it's getting to be about that time of the year lol. Don't stress over it. Give hime a week of no feeding attempts and no handling. Just some time to settle in.

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Well medium rats are too much for ball pythons unless you have a massive 3000g+ female.

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I disagree. My 700 gram male is almost needing to be moved up from small rats. I like a little lump in my snakes bellies, and my friend's adult balls all eat mediums to larges.

Now, as for the OP. If he is a breeder male... It's still breeding season. Males go off feed for anywhere from 2 to 8 months. It's completely normal unless he starts to lose weight. My little 700 gram guy even went off feed this year. I keep offering him one every week, but he only eats about every 5-6 weeks. Enure that your husbandry is proper, and if he still does not eat and is not losing weight... he just wants a girlfriend

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Originally Posted by AliCat37

I disagree. My 700 gram male is almost needing to be moved up from small rats. I like a little lump in my snakes bellies, and my friend's adult balls all eat mediums to larges.

Now, as for the OP. If he is a breeder male... It's still breeding season. Males go off feed for anywhere from 2 to 8 months. It's completely normal unless he starts to lose weight. My little 700 gram guy even went off feed this year. I keep offering him one every week, but he only eats about every 5-6 weeks. Enure that your husbandry is proper, and if he still does not eat and is not losing weight... he just wants a girlfriend

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Congrats Feeding that large of meals to BPs is Overfeeding :gj::gj:. Just cause they can eat it dont mean they have to eat it. And 700g snake eating mediums is over kill and not needed.

But what do I know...

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Congrats Feeding that large of meals to BPs is Overfeeding :gj::gj:. Just cause they can eat it dont mean they have to eat it. And 700g snake eating mediums is over kill and not needed.

But what do I know...

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WOW! tone it down a touch! Most people agree that 10% of the body mass is the correct size so at 700gm about 70 should be correct that at least to me is that line between small and medium rats. Depends on whom breeds them. I guess everybody to his own but I'd assume a breeder is at least 1000 gm and likely 1200+. I'd figure that around the 90-120 gm range would be fine (if the breeder is as big as I'd guess.) and my rodent supplier calls 70-150 medium rats.

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

Breeders that feed FT usually just put the rodent in the tub or lay it in front of the hide at dusk and check back a little while later.

Many FT eaters are shy eaters.. That's the one problem with FT feeders. They become the snakes that don't want food that moves and so they usually only eat when it's dark and still.

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Not to hijack but...

Come to my place on feeding day, most of our snakes fly out to get there meal :P. We have both been tagged multiple times. I feed 40+ snakes F/T and have for years. They never were or became shy eaters because of it. I doubt they'd eat if I just left the rats in the tubs.

And OP, trying a smaller rat may help. If your husbandry is good and he has settled in for a while he may have just been nervous about the big meal. But like others have said, if he's in breeding mode he might not eat for months. Keep an eye on his weight and body condition, keep him hydrated, and offer a meal every week. He'll come around.


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Originally Posted by kitedemon

WOW! tone it down a touch! Most people agree that 10% of the body mass is the correct size so at 700gm about 70 should be correct that at least to me is that line between small and medium rats. Depends on whom breeds them. I guess everybody to his own but I'd assume a breeder is at least 1000 gm and likely 1200+. I'd figure that around the 90-120 gm range would be fine (if the breeder is as big as I'd guess.) and my rodent supplier calls 70-150 medium rats.

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The 10% rule is an opinion started years ago. Sorry but ball pythons do NOT do well on large meals. And those who feed large meals with the mythical 10-15% rule will have snakes going off feed to catch up and come posting why are they not eating.

Ive never had a snake go off feed unless was breeding and even then its slim.

But you feed that 10% rule to them and see how well it works. I couldnt imagine someone feeding a 200-300g rat to a ball python.

Rich,
There are a lot of myths in the hobby some well understood some poorly. I have not heard of 10% being too much before. It is actually interesting that I feed all my smaller snakes quite close to 10% a meal but the adults get a about 5-7% typically. My 3600gm girl usually gets 125-200 gm rats, She will take bigger but I just don't usually buy them. No particular reason.

I found your previous post a bit reactionary rather than informative. I get what you are saying and in some ways practice it sort of anyway. I know you have lots of valuable information if you could just take the time to explain why you dod what you do then maybe the op and everybody else can learn from your experience.
Alex

I feed my snakes rats that are as big around as their widest point--that means the really big girls get large rats, and most of the girls (and a few big boys) get mediums, while the juveniles get smalls. My 2010s are eating hopper rats.

I do keep an eye on female weights coming into the breeding season. If they're getting too hefty, they either get downgraded to a smaller rat, or I feed them every 2 weeks. I don't have to do that very often--usually only when a female skips a season and doesn't lay eggs, so she doesn't lose the extra weight.

My snakes go off feed when opaque, apart from that. I have not experienced many of these 'mysterious hunger strikes' that folks talk about. If I did, I would take the snake to a vet and have a fecal screening run.

So, ball pythons can do perfectly well eating larger prey. Whether you feed bigger prey less often, or smaller prey more often, is more a matter of preference on your part than anything else. The end result should be a snake that is neither obese, nor thin. If that's what you have, then you're doing it right.

I see the pros and cons of both sides. I personally go by the mid section test. None of our big girls get large rats. They get good sized mediums but not adult rats.The only ones to get large in our house is the big boas,the burm and our big carpet. I don't think it's bad to see a lump when they have just eaten. I do however thinks it's bad to see a giant bulge. But if you think about it, in the wild I doubt they see a rat and say " oh that rats to big for me to eat, it'll leave a bulge ..."

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Congrats Feeding that large of meals to BPs is Overfeeding :gj::gj:. Just cause they can eat it dont mean they have to eat it. And 700g snake eating mediums is over kill and not needed.

But what do I know...

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Yes, so I am to assume the breeder I got these guys from who produces thousands of ball pythons a year is incorrect.. From what I have been told, you are supposed to feed a prey item that is the same width around as the thickest part of your snake. If i were to have followed what you are saying, then my snake would probably be under weight. When he was eating hopper mice he would be starving by the end of the week, so he was boosted up to two week old rats. He is now eating 3 week old rats, probably has to be boosted up from that as well.
So all my snakes must be over fed then, even the boa who leaps out of his cage at the smell of a mouse after a week. But, what do I know. :colbert:

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Originally Posted by ScottNBecky

I see the pros and cons of both sides. I personally go by the mid section test. None of our big girls get large rats. They get good sized mediums but not adult rats.The only ones to get large in our house is the big boas,the burm and our big carpet. I don't think it's bad to see a lump when they have just eaten. I do however thinks it's bad to see a giant bulge. But if you think about it, in the wild I doubt they see a rat and say " oh that rats to big for me to eat, it'll leave a bulge ..."

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x2

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Congrats Feeding that large of meals to BPs is Overfeeding :gj::gj:. Just cause they can eat it dont mean they have to eat it. And 700g snake eating mediums is over kill and not needed.

But what do I know...

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

The 10% rule is an opinion started years ago. Sorry but ball pythons do NOT do well on large meals. And those who feed large meals with the mythical 10-15% rule will have snakes going off feed to catch up and come posting why are they not eating.

Ive never had a snake go off feed unless was breeding and even then its slim.

But you feed that 10% rule to them and see how well it works. I couldnt imagine someone feeding a 200-300g rat to a ball python.

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Surely you way is the only right way eh Rich? Oh wait, THOUSANDS of people keep ball pythons, many keep them in different styles and methods. I know of several big breeders who feed 10%, or based on animal width etc. You have an opinion, I have an opinion, everyone has them.

Get off your arrogant high horse and unless you can provide some legitimate proof with scientific data- don't come acting like a know-it-all. ;)

This forum is really getting nuts lately...

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Originally Posted by Foschi Exotic Serpents

This forum is really getting nuts lately...

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:gj::gj: People take offense to everything... Seems ill have to soon walk away and be done here.

Never stated my way was the only way. I give out what has worked for me for YEARS. Its your job to fine tune it. Care sheets are Opinions and are NOT to be followed like a bible to keeping reptiles.

Ill be done here.. Unsubscribed.

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Care sheets are Opinions and are NOT to be followed like a bible to keeping reptiles.

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X2. There is a lot of good information on this site, but sometimes a little common sense can be helpful when applying it towards your own situations.

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Originally Posted by RichsBallPythons

Congrats Feeding that large of meals to BPs is Overfeeding :gj::gj:. Just cause they can eat it dont mean they have to eat it. And 700g snake eating mediums is over kill and not needed.

But what do I know...

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I think you know a lot and I agree with you.
My 2,450 gram female eats one small rat aprox. every 2 weeks.

Harry