Raw wooden rack...

If I built a rack using pine, would I still have to seal it if I where to leave the lids on the 6qt. tubs? This is going to be a small hatchling rack.

just wondering,

Dave

Personally I would seal any bare wood that is a functional part of a snake room. If you ever get mites having a smooth surface to clean would be much easier than bare wood :O. I personally would advocate no bare wood just to look to cleaning anyway painted is much easier to clean and generally you may not clean the rack every month but are likely to every now and again.

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Originally Posted by kitedemon

Personally I would seal any bare wood that is a functional part of a snake room. If you ever get mites having a smooth surface to clean would be much easier than bare wood :O.

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What do you seal it with?

When I use lids, I simply paint the wood I build with.

I'm not sure about pine, I know its a big no-no as far as substrate because of the phenol that is dangerous to your snake. It might be ok for a rack, but I'd look into something else myself, maybe Pvc.

I'd use some sort of deck sealer or laquer to seal it...pine is a no-no...

ive used contact paper with great success. i'd seal the wood with a deck sealer let it dry then apply the contact paper.

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Originally Posted by cecilbturtle

ive used contact paper with great success. i'd seal the wood with a deck sealer let it dry then apply the contact paper.

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thanks for the tip, I thought about contact paper. I may just use Melamine.
How's Southern Tier treating you these days.

quite well thanks! how have we been treating you? ;)

Personally I'd use a good polyurethane paint dilute the first coat 20% with thinner or add a penetrating paint addiditive (penetrol) this will generate a better bond allow the paint to cure TOTALLY before using it. The best is to 'bake' it. If you can place it in a warm (100º) area with really good ventilation that will force the thinners out faster and more efficiently. The best test is your nose if it still smells 'painty' it isn't done. It will take awhile 5-10 days. I would not use a floor product as they are designed in many cases to hold elasticisty and the often out gas for a longer period of time. NEVER use a spar varnish they are very soft (boat masts move a lot) and never completely out gas.

Kiln dried pine has most of the phenols baked out of it. Use your nose if it is very piney smelling pick a different bit. But in any case polyurethane cured is plastic if you paint the whole rack it is encapsulated in plastic. The phenol gas will not penetrate the plastic. There is also debate about pine anyway so as I feel it isn't worth the risk to use as a substrate there are very respected keepers whom use kiln dried pine as substrates. The only wood I would not use is cedar. As it isn't a good choice anyway it makes no difference.

You can also sometimes find poplar boards in some lumber yards it is very soft wood but works like pine. It is an odd look greenish brown and is never found very large so it means lots of glueing. It has almost no phenols. (is also know as Aspen)

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Originally Posted by kitedemon

You can also sometimes find poplar boards in some lumber yards it is very soft wood but works like pine. It is an odd look greenish brown and is never found very large so it means lots of glueing. It has almost no phenols. (is also know as Aspen)

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Poplar and Aspen are two different woods, both are reptile safe too.
Lowes sells both of them, also they have Aspen in "planks", furniture grade.:gj:
Neither of these are cheap by any means but they will last forever if properly sealed. ;)

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Poplar and Aspen are two different woods, both are reptile safe too.
Lowes sells both of them, also they have Aspen in "planks", furniture grade.:gj:
Neither of these are cheap by any means but they will last forever if properly sealed. ;)

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I would agree that aspen is a great choice. I would however avoid using poplar for a rack. Although it is a great wood and I in fact use it for all of the paint grade moulding we use every day, it is an interior product and typically does not respond well to high moisture environments. Also I would not recommend any lacquer based sealer for a rack. It can be difficult to work with especially if you are not familiar with applying it and it again does not hold up very well in high moisture applications. I would recommend using a high quality Varathane and as previously stated make sure that it is well cured before putting any animals into the rack.

Did you mean that Populus tremuloides (Quaking Aspen) Populus tremula (Common Aspen) are not part of the Populus family (poplars). Well that is news to me...

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Originally Posted by kitedemon

Did you mean that Populus tremuloides (Quaking Aspen) Populus tremula (Common Aspen) are not part of the Populus family (poplars). Well that is news to me...

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I am not going to argue with someone that has nothing better to do that try to belittle people and is too long winded to read most of his postings.
They have different purposes of use is what I meant. Then again I forgot you like to over evaluate anything and everything posted. Then again all metals and wood are the same too, right. They just have different uses.
There are those of you on the board that are "*smart*" and then there are those of us "blue collar" workers that know the differences beyond what you can see, search or read in a book.
end of my :pee:ing match

I would strongly recommend against any deck sealer most I know of have fungicides and insecticides in them that are designed to out gas. In fact most common anti fungal additive is Diuron3 - (3,4-dichlorophenyl) which is a phenol base chemical.

Pit I am sorry if I was short. I have a wacky background I am book smart but also worked for many years (18, as a professional boat builder). I understand wood fairly well. Locally we have while poplar shivering poplar and rain poplar all the same tree, the local mill shreds for the pet industry. They call it white aspen, I actually don't know about your area but here everything in that family of trees is called poplar in my area. It is used with aspen back and forth. If you look at trembling aspen there are two trees typically called the same common name. Latin clarifies the issue. I believe that the toxic contents of phenol for the north american Populus family is similar and that is low so it is irrelevant.

It is not a great building wood but if people are super concerned with pine and phenols it is about the only alternative. Hardwoods have other toxic issues panel boards have formeldahydes and phenols. There is no end to it. My point is paint the wood problem solved if there is a problem to begin with personally kiln drying bakes out most of the phenol anyway unless there is a big resin pocket.

Thanks for all the input with great information everyone, but I think I'm going to take the easy route and make it with melamine. Thought it would be easier and cheaper to go the way I was thinking. But with all the input, I realized that it wouldn't. Melamine seems just a safer way to go, and easier!

thanks,

Dave