Wrinkly skin?

Hi, I'm new to this forum (and to ball pythons!). I've only had my baby girl for about two weeks now and she's pretty obviously starting to shed. Her eyes went cloudy about 4 or so days ago, and now her skin is really wrinkly. There's a picture below, and i was wondering if this is normal, or if there is something i need to do to adjust the humidity. The hygrometer has been steady since i got her, at about 55%. Help would be greatly appreciated :D

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/9981/dscn1165b.jpg

might just be me but she looks really skinny.

There is a great thread on shedding that walks you through it step by step in the forum section. I'd put the link here but I'm not sure how. :)

Now that is one crazy stuck shed!

What appears to have happened is, when she released fluid under her top layer of skin (what causes the cloudy eyes), the top layer of skin somehow got stuck to the bottom layer, causing her to be unable to peel it all off. This may be caused by lots of handling while she was in the cloudy phase (or even after her eyes cleared), too-low humidity (55% is much too low for a snake during shed, also what sort of hygrometer are you using?), or a combination of the two.

Don't worry, though, there's an easy fix to stuck sheds. Get a small Rubbermaid tub (be sure it's ventilated!), fill it with lukewarm water (around 85*F), put a wet washcloth inside, and leave her in there for 30 minutes. Do this daily, and she should be able to work off the skin. Also be sure to bump up the humidity in the cage until she gets it all off.

Its under General BPs and the sticky titled The Shedding Process. She looks pretty young and a little on the thin side. Is she eating for you yet? You haven't had her for long- has she settled in well for you?

She's been a great little girl so far. She's really friendly and is very happy to slither around my hands when i hold her. When i saw her in the cloudy eye phase, i didn't touch her at all until her eyes went back to normal. She has eaten 1 live mouse so far (this past friday), but i think the mouse gave her mites, because a day or two afterwards, i saw them on her. I immediately took her into the vet, where they gave her an imovec (i think it's called) shot, and i cleaned out her cage completely, baking everything, etc. I haven't seen any more on her since. I am not sure if i should feed her while she's trying to shed, or wait. I also went out and bought frozen mice to avoid the mites issue.

[EDIT] Also, i am just using a basic hygrometer that i bought at petsmart. along with 2 thermometers on the ambient and heated sides of the tank, with the hygrometer in the middle.

Mites came from where the snake came from, not from the mouse.

The shot wasnt necessary, it only benifited the vets pocket.

Get the snake soaking once a day in warm water to help the shed stay moist and allow for easy removal. Also keep the cage misted till the shed is off.

I've been dealing with the place i got her from for years, i know how well they take care of their animals, i would be incredibly surprised if the mites came from the snake. But the only reason i say from the mouse is because i got it from petco, and not a privately owned place. And as far as the shot... it was $16, and it's better safe than sorry as far as i'm concerned. So say i see more mites on her in a few days... what would i do then?

Mites are specie specific and wont feed from rodents. Without a food source they die fairly quickly. Which is why the mites came from either where the snake came from or they hitched on your clothes when you were at the pet store.

Order can or Provent a Mite and that will solve your issue.

Well, if you got the mouse from PetCo, maybe you carried the mites home from PetCo on your clothes...?

x2 on Provent a Mite. You can buy it from Pro Exotics. It's excellent stuff, works wonders.

Unless the Petco is so gross that they straight up have mites jumping around the whole store, i don't think so. I literally walked in, bought the mouse, and left. But should i feed her today? Or wait till i get all the skin off of her? Or what. I'm kinda at a loss here.

Honestly I don't consider the way you got her to be excellent care of an animal. I'd classify that as a negligent store. I can almost guarantee that if that snake looked like that when you got her that's where the mites came from. If they weren't paying enough attn to bump her humidity or give her a humid hide at least, they certainly wouldn't notice teensy tiny mites crawling around. Just a thought. Anyways regarding your q. She's had a lot of handling so far so don't take it personally if she refuses but if her eyes and head are at least done or mostly done I don't see the harm in offering. She looks like she needs a few good meals.

No, no she didn't look like that when i got her. Her colors were rich. I went in there with the knowledge of what to look for in a snake, i looked at her and saw no mites or anything. Their tank was more humid than mine is, for sure. The issue i guess was that i didn't know you were supposed to increase the humidity when she's shedding. The skin on her face is finally starting to come off, so it's just a matter of time. I went and got a squirtbottle so i can mist the cage down.

Ya the mites are from the petstore where you got her, the mites will hide under the edges of the snakes scales, and under the edges of the eye socket as well as the thermal pits on the snakes lips. Im sorry to tell you but that petstore is very obviously infested with mites, they are not easy to see and will go unnoticed if people do not look for them very hard. They will not come home on a mouse thats for sure. I guarantee most of the reptiles in the store will have the mites on them and in their cages. Plus the stuck shed in the picture looks bad enough to actually be two stuck sheds, meaning the petstore probably neglected the snake during its last shed as well... Besides which a ball python should be misted daily to maintain the humidity in the enclosure, not just during the shed...

I read that 50-60% humidity was fine... Mine is at 55%, which is right in the middle. I live in texas, and it's really damn hot right now, and probably will be for a while. Should i switch to a better substrate? Which should i use? I'm using aspen right now.

Misting is only necessarily if your setup doesn't hold humidity well without it. And obviously, the OP's setup does not.

When Homegrownscales was referring to how your snake looked when you got it, I don't believe he was referring to the colors. I think his reference was to the fact that the snake appears to be pretty underweight, dehydrated and has at least one layer of stuck shed, but likely two layers.

And as everyone said, the mites were most likely there when you bought the snake. Even if they did some kind of topical spray like Reptile Relief, you're still going to have a mite problem. Those types of sprays only kill the mites on the snake at the time, but do nothing about the mite eggs. Very likely, your snake had at least mite EGGS when you bought it, which are now hatching and you are seeing them. Definitely look up Provent-a-Mite. That stuff is worth its weight in gold when it comes to dealing with mite problems. Just follow the directions on the can exactly. Don't spray it on the snake and make sure the enclosure is totally dry before you put the snake back in it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LoNeSt4r

I read that 50-60% humidity was fine... Mine is at 55%, which is right in the middle. I live in texas, and it's really damn hot right now, and probably will be for a while. Should i switch to a better substrate? Which should i use? I'm using aspen right now.

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You should bump the humidity up to 70% or so during shed cycles... 50% is ok for the day to day setup, but definitely needs to be increased when you notice the start of the shed cycle.

I totally agree with InknSteel, Provent-A-Mite is amazing, just be sure to follow the directions exactly. ( Dont spray the snake, dont spray the water bowl, let the spray dry 100% before putting the snake back into the enclosure, etc.)

I use cypress mulch instead of aspen, cypress mulch holds humidity better and is resistant to mold, if aspen becomes too wet or soaked it is possible it can become moldy.

Ham, that's what i initially was going to get. I'll be sure to get it from now on. I will definitely order some provent a mite. I checked out their webpage and apparently because our economy sucks they're selling it for like $3 cheaper (oddly enough jack daniels does the same thing, for you whiskey people out there). And the whole increasing humidity during shedding thing will be done from now on. I haven't seen any mites on her since the vet shot/baking/cleaning, though, but just to be sure i'll get some.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LoNeSt4r

oddly enough jack daniels does the same thing, for you whiskey people out there

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JD gets rid of mites? is this true? my snake doesnt have mites but if he did at least i know i always have the cure around lol

Haha no they sell a cheaper version of their regular whiskey. It's got a green label, and it says it's "sold in times of economic distress." AKA depression whiskey. And it's not bad, for whiskey anyways. But i digress.

Ummmm,

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scorpio

JD gets rid of mites? is this true? my snake doesnt have mites but if he did at least i know i always have the cure around lol

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He meant they sell it cheaper than retail from their website. :rolleyes:

Do not put Jack Daniels on your snake to try and cure mites kids. :colbert:

I wuz ninja'd :ninja:


dr del

How about if I just drink a bottle of whiskey? Then hold my snakes while running around naked in my neighbors front yard while screaming about the coming of the demon serpents? :rofl:

Might I suggest this also?
http://www.amazon.com/Chaney-Instrum...8163574&sr=8-6
Cheap and accurate. The stickie analog guages you are using to read temps and humidity are not accurate, and it may say 55 humidity and it's probably a lot less, same with the temps.

Also, here is the caresheet :)
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ius)-Caresheet

Heh,

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ham

How about if I just drink a bottle of whiskey? Then hold my snakes while running around naked in my neighbors front yard while screaming about the coming of the demon serpents? :rofl:

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I'm broadly in favour of this course of action ( mainly because I am a continent away and won't have to see it ) but I should warn you it probably won't cure the mites. :P

I also take no responsibility for the property values or legal ramifications. :P

Have fun though. :gj: :bolt:


dr del

What most of the people have been saying is a good idea: give her a nice soak for a couple minutes each day until she can get that shed off. When you take her out, let her crawl through a towel (use your hand and make a tunnel with it and apply LIGHT pressure) and see if that gets the shed off. When my girl had a bad shed I did that, and it worked like a charm, the shed came right off! Higher humidity in the enclosure couldn't hurt either. :gj:

BE CAREFUL with the water temperature though, what's mildly warm to us is hot to them, so a little hotter than room temperature should be perfect.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dr del

Heh,



I'm broadly in favour of this course of action ( mainly because I am a continent away and won't have to see it ) but I should warn you it probably won't cure the mites. :P

I also take no responsibility for the property values or legal ramifications. :P

Have fun though. :gj: :bolt:


dr del

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rofl!!

Alright, i soaked her, and now she's mostly shed (just a few inches at the end.) She's really picky, so after trying unsuccessfully to tempt her with a frozen/thawed mouse, i opted to go get a live one, and of course she went right for it, and ate it in half the time she ate her last one. Tomorrow should i soak her again if her skin hasn't come off? or should i give her a few days to digest her delicious meal.

Give her 2 days to digest, for sure.

I figured as much. Also, thanks for the thermometer suggestion, that little thing looks pretty badass, i'll have to get one ASAP.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LGray23

Might I suggest this also?
http://www.amazon.com/Chaney-Instrum...8163574&sr=8-6
Cheap and accurate. The stickie analog guages you are using to read temps and humidity are not accurate, and it may say 55 humidity and it's probably a lot less, same with the temps.

Also, here is the caresheet :)
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ius)-Caresheet

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I have 10 of these I purchased from Lowes for $8 each.
Just remember that the probe measures the "outdoor" temp and the display is the "indoor" temp so you place them on the opposite side of the cage. Im an idiot and placed the display outside of it and scratched my head a few times wondering why it was so cool! lol

Just thought y'all should know, after a few days she's back to her gorgeous, nonwrinkley self.

http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/1193/dscn1191vm.jpg

Congrats, she's pretty. Get some weight on that girl! :D

Should i feed her more often than once a week? Or what's the best way to get her to fatten up?

I'd feed her every 5 days, she's a very small girl...

When i took her to the vet, last thursday, we weighed her and she was 69 grams and she was 17 inches when i measured her. Is there a chart or something that can show what acceptable weights are?

I agree, every 5 days is great for hatchlings :gj:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LoNeSt4r

When i took her to the vet, last thursday, we weighed her and she was 69 grams and she was 17 inches when i measured her. Is there a chart or something that can show what acceptable weights are?

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No they all grow at different rates. I'd say give her an adult mouse or rat pup (preferably rat pup...she'll grow fast on those) every 5 days until she starts putting some weight on.

I'm just afraid to give her something that's too much bigger around than she is. The mice i am feeding her are a bit bigger.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LoNeSt4r

I'm just afraid to give her something that's too much bigger around than she is. The mice i am feeding her are a bit bigger.

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Are you feeding her adult mice now? You want to get some weight on her (+1 for starting her on a 5-day feeding schedule) but imo she's not thin enough to risk a regurge. You want to aim for something either slightly larger around than she is, or (if you have a gram scale) something that is 15% her weight. If she's feeding well on the mice you're giving her now, as long as they aren't too small I'd stick with that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LoNeSt4r

I'm just afraid to give her something that's too much bigger around than she is. The mice i am feeding her are a bit bigger.

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Are they adult mice?

Yeah they are.

I think the adult mice will be fine. I like to start my little ones on rat pups. Id rather not deal with mice at all. But mice work if that's what you can get. At least that shed is off of her. Oh man that was bad. If you do another soak ever 88.f is a perfect temp for soaks. I use an indoor outdoor thermom specific for soaks it works perfectly. Well looks like she's doing well congrats on getting that yucky shed off.


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