Beginning of our 1st clutch ever! :'(

Well, we were expecting eggs any day now, and this morning, I looked in on her. She had laid a 63 gram slug. At least it looks like a slug to me. She still has a bunch in her that I hope aren't slugs.

How long do they take to lay all the eggs?

She's 11+ years old, 2900 grams, and as far as we know, her first clutch ever. Pairing is Mojave X Normal.

I'll post pics when I figure out why they're not showing up on my computer. AAARGH!

No idea how long it will take, but I wanted to wish you good luck on them! Did the slug candle with veins?

How soon do you candle? I thought candling for veins only works a few days after they were laid...

Anyway, here are a couple pics.
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0494.jpg


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0496.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ClarkT

How soon do you candle? I thought candling for veins only works a few days after they were laid...

Anyway, here are a couple pics.
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0494.jpg


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0496.jpg

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Looks like slug. I would candle it just to be sure. I'm fairly certain you can candle right away. Looking at that momma's face though, I wouldn't reach in there until she was done. Yikes!

I'm sure she has some healthy ones just waiting to come out. She's a big girl.

Big girl is an understatement! She is gigantically beautiful! :) There's gotta be more eggs in that girl. I'm sure soon she'll be wrapped around a big beautiful clutch of nice eggs.

I would get it out of there and candle it. If its rock hard it could be a giant urate (looks like she just peed too). I've seen some big, egg shaped ones! If its a slug then its up to you if you wan to incubate it (just then remove it if/when it goes bad). Just put a small towel over her head when you go to get it out.

Good luck and like others said, there are probably a bunch of good eggies in there ;). From my experience if they are going to completely slug out then they lay around day 22-25.

I'll try to find pictures of a slug I candled so you can see what it would look like.

Slugs

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...28-093comp.jpg


Bad/infertile egg. Like a slug, it candled yellow with no veins.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...egg_2_comp.jpg


Good egg, pink with veins.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...egg_1_comp.jpg

Your post makes me chuckle. She's nowhere near ready to bite. Maybe that'll change when she lays the rest, but I've had my hand in there and she doesn't even follow it... Anyway, I hope things come out right, with good eggs!

it can take them hours to lay them all and what weird they seem to know the bad ones mostly and will separate them from the clutch.

Thanks for the replies and help! It's very much appreciated! Wow, I can't believe we're finally actually to this point! :please: :gj:

At least you planned this lol my corn snake cluth I have now is my first and wasn't planned nor were the sexes of the snakes identified prior lol.
http://i1018.photobucket.com/albums/...s/IMG_0013.jpg
20 of my
greatest mistakes lol

Unplanned pregnancy, huh. "20 of my greatest mistakes" hahahahaha! :rofl:

She's looking like she might be starting to lay the rest...this is agonizing! (the 60 day wait will be more agonizing!)

My first clutch ever was all slugs :(. She laid them over two days too, it really sucked, haha. I wish you better luck! Here's hoping for a bunch of healthy eggs!

Cheers,
-Matt

Well? Where are the pics of some eggs?

They still haven't come. It's been about 26 hours since she laid the first one. I sure hope they're not all slugs. :( :please:

At what point should I worry that she hasn't laid them yet? (obviously I'm already worried...) She definitely has more in her. How long do good eggs take to be laid?

Oh, I wanted to mention that the first one candled as a slug. It's yellow with no veins... :(

:please: :please: :please: :please: :please: good eggs!

Best of luck to you on the remaining eggs! How many more eggs should she have (I'm assuming she was palpated)?

Well, she was palpated but I don't know how conclusive we were. We're new at the BP breeding. I felt eggs, but never got a count. Would it be a good time to do it right now? Or should I just leave her alone?

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread about them laying a whole clutch of slugs at day 22-25. With that being the case, do you think, since the 1st one was a slug, that it just came earlier than the others, and that the rest would then be ok? The slug was laid on day 28 from shed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ClarkT

Well, she was palpated but I don't know how conclusive we were. We're new at the BP breeding. I felt eggs, but never got a count. Would it be a good time to do it right now? Or should I just leave her alone?

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread about them laying a whole clutch of slugs at day 22-25. With that being the case, do you think, since the 1st one was a slug, that it just came earlier than the others, and that the rest would then be ok? The slug was laid on day 28 from shed.

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This is my first year breeding too. I actually have a girl due on the 30th (w/ 6 eggs).

I don't think I would palpate her again quite yet. Give her a little more time to lay. Being this close it may be more uncomfortable for her? Maybe others will have some better advice for you? Hopefully she lays some good eggs for you soon!

What date is day 30?

Do you see a huge bulge at her vent? If so, how long has it been that way? If your girl is trying to lay the rest but has a large egg blocking them you should be able to tell. If there is, you might want to call a vet and tell them your situation. Or if you know a breeder with experience ask them if they can help get the egg out. If the eggs haven't dropped down her tail she might not be ready to lay the rest quite yet. However, if NO eggs have come within the next few days, I would bring her to a vet, she could have a twisted oviduct preventing the eggs from dropping.


Here is a pic of a girl an hour or so before laying. The eggs have moved down her tail and you can see an egg right at her vent.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...25-102comp.jpg


Also, keep your humidity up. Or even provide her a lay box with damp moss. Keeping her hydrated is important and if the environment is too dry some think they will hold eggs because it isn't the proper conditions for them.

Yesterday (3-3-11) was day 28.

I'll take some more pics and post them later. Maybe you can advise me further. As for vets, I'm in a very rural area that doesn't have herp vets available.

As far as the look, right after the slug came out, it looked like more were going to come. It looks to me that half of the eggs have moved down, but it doesn't look like she's about to pass them, like your pic.

What range of humidity am I looking for? It's pretty high humidity in there right now (80%-85%).

I sure hope that it's just a matter of me not having the patience, and that I just need to wait til day 30. :please:

I'll go get some pics and post them soon.

The humidity is good. And since you're not quite at day 30 I would just keep an eye on her with out disturbing her too much. Keep us posted.

Here are a couple of pics. Her tail doesn't have the same look it did when she laid the slug...


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0505.jpg


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0508.jpg


I know, at this point, patience is key. The toughest part is trying not to worry that something's wrong... Here's hoping and praying! :please:

Thanks again for all the replies and support.

I know that I've read about females sometimes laying slugs days before laying the rest of her clutch. I wouldn't worry yet.

But when she is in egg binding she could die when she is holding her eggs inside her!!!

Good luck Clark!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ClarkT

Here are a couple of pics. Her tail doesn't have the same look it did when she laid the slug...


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0505.jpg


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0508.jpg


I know, at this point, patience is key. The toughest part is trying not to worry that something's wrong... Here's hoping and praying! :please:

Thanks again for all the replies and support.

---

With these photos I would say you have a few more days. You will see the tail suck like in the pics posted earlier.

So at the end of day 30, still no eggs. I'm going on the assumption that because the first one was a slug, it just came early, as someone mentioned a slug clutch does...and further assume that the rest of the clutch (or at least some of it) is healthy, and just not time to come out.

At what day would you start worrying, instead of just being impatient (like I've been...)?

I've seen on this forum that some say up to 45 days after shed. Is that how long I should expect to need to wait?

Yeehaw!!!!!! She laid them today!!!!!

She had 8 more in her. 5 are great looking, one not so great looking, but has veins, and candles good. Another looks worse, but has veins. We'll see on that one. And the last is a slug.

:please: Mojaves!!!!

Thanks all for your encouragement, advice and support!!!!!

Oh yeah, 773 grams of 8 eggs, (another 63 grams from the first slug would make a total of 836 grams...).

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0509.jpg

She was wrapped tight, but never hissed or struck at us. Great Mom!

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0/dscn0512.jpg


Now I'm not clear on one more thing. Do we lift the press n seal every few days to give the eggs air? Thanks all!

Yay eggs!!!!!! :D I'll be crossing my fingers and toes that you get some mojaves!! Good luck! I have no clue on the egg/air thing, but I'm sure someone will come along to help!

Congrats!!! Here's to some Mojos!

I have a girl due to lay on the 30th and I am already going out of my mind...This is going to be a long few months! :rolleyes:

Great news!! As far as lifting the press-n-seal, I lift it every few days then around day 45/50 I keep a corner pulled back until they pip or I cut. I know others don't lift it at all until the last few weeks of incubation with no issues.

Congrats! Hope you get your mojos! :)

Congrats! Nice to have a happy ending to this story! :)

Gratz on the eggs! Good luck on the babies.

Day 59. :(

We decided to cut the last 2 remaining eggs. One was still full, with no room to pinch a spot to cut. Candling showed good veins, but only showed a blob in there--which is what made the decision to cut. It turns out it was majorly deformed. There was no way it would ever be able to live. Major kinks, a blob for a mid-section, and more kinks. I can't believe it was even still alive. It was a mojo.

The other is just fine. It looks to be a mojo, too. Hope it comes out of the egg soon.

After all this waiting and waiting, I had to wait some more. I can't take it! I sure love BPs, but I hate this waiting. We have 12 other eggs in the 'bator, and they're all looking great. One more girl due to lay this weekend.

If you want pics of the little deformed snake, I can post them, but they're obviously kinda graphic...

Happy Herping, all.

Sorry to here about the clutch and the deformed baby :( Hopefully the other one comes out soon and is nice and healthy...

Yeah the hardest part is waiting and you definitely do a lot of it.... Lol at least you have eggs already I'm still waiting on my 1st clutch to hit the ground(and the many more to follow)... :rolleyes:

Ahhh, :(

Sorry to hear that.

Fingers crossed for the little fighter. :please:


dr del

Here are some pics. Being our first clutch ever, first snake ever, I'm not sure if it was a normal or a mojo. My friend is saying mojo....not sure.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file..._snake_017.jpg


[http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file..._snake_016.jpg


http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file..._snake_019.jpg


Poor little guy...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ClarkT

Here are some pics. Being our first clutch ever, first snake ever, I'm not sure if it was a normal or a mojo. My friend is saying mojo....not sure.

Poor little guy...

---

Looks like a normal to me personally.

It wasn't alive in that picture right? I hope you have put the poor thing down :/
Can't wait to see the healthy baby though. :]

Yes, it was still alive. That was right after we took it out. Yes, I put it down quickly.

The healthy one finally pipped yesterday at noon. Still waiting for it to come out of the egg. It's definitely a mojave! At least we hit the odds with the single one that was left. Now if he'll just come out of there...

Thank the gods at least one little guy made it. <3 And hooray for mojo!

How did you incubate. This can be helpful for preventing eggs from diminishing like that and or deformities.

They started out in a small incubator where the temp could only maintain them at 86-87.

Half way through, we got our upright freezer incubator up and going, where inside the tubs, now, it maintains 88.2-89.6.

The last one seems to be doing fine. He's just taking his time to absorb and emerge. It's day 64 now...Patience, grasshopper....

How were the tubs setup.

Well, now I wonder about patience vs. actively doing something...:(

The last one didn't absorb the yolk and died. He pipped on day 63. We removed the top of the egg. It looked just fine. the umbilical cord was not twisted at all. It just didn't absorb. :( :mad: :tears:

Should I have taken it out, cut the cord, and force fed it some yolk? How would I have known it was going too long without absorbing? What do you do when they don't seem to be absorbing the yolk? How long do you give them?

Btw, it was a smokin little mojo. Had some really unique pattern on its back. No, I didn't get pics of it. I should have, but I'm just too bummed.

Heckuva first clutch. It really discourages me to keep going with it. We have another due anytime to lay. She's on day 32 from POS. Another 3 girls are still locking up and have follicles...

The tubs are substrateless. I have easter egg halves holding up the egg crate. Humidity is 90%-100%. Water never comes in contact with the eggs.

Our other 2 clutches are doing just fine. Temps are good, they have been very steady. Humidity looks great. They candle great.

:hug:

Don't beat yourself up over this as there may very well have been nothing you could have done. :(

There are many developmental problems that would only be a problem when the snake reached the stage of pipping and breathing on its own.

The mention of the unique back pattern might hint that is suffered a lesser form of the problem the other one did. :(

Tying off the umbilical can be done successfully ( see Muddoc's threads for info on these things ) but I wouldn't have tried to force feed the yolk I don't think.


dr del

Sorry about the clutch. Unfortunately these things happen. My first clutch was kinda like yours. She laid 6 eggs, all but two went up to hatching. One was so kinked it died in the egg and the other died 3 months after hatching because it couldn't eat. Sometimes things just happen. Don't let it discourage you though. You have plenty more chances at babies this season!

Another question I have now...

The other clutches we have were sired by the same male as this clutch. Does that lead to believe that the damsel was likely a culprit in bad eggs? If so, how likely is she to produce good healthy eggs next year?

We picked her up as a rescue. She's at least 11 years old now, as the people we got her from had her 10 years, and didn't know how old she was when they got her.

She is 5-1/2' long, and weighed close to 2900 grams just before she laid. When we started pairing her, she was in the 2400 gram range. She gained weight well, and seemed to be very healthy.

Anyway, just wondering if I should expect the same results from her next year. She never had been bred before we had her.