Feeding Technique????

Hi, I was just wondering - when I feed live to my snake I always remove his hides and water bowl to keep the rat from hiding in these areas of the tub - is it okay to remove this stuff or does this add stress to the snake??

How do you all feed live.

Thanks.

Personally I don't feed live but the removing of the hides is making sense to me so that if the snake is in the hide it can't get cornered by a defensive rat. You might want to get opinions from others on this one though considering my lack of experience with live. I don't think you'd need to remove the water bowl though, that could stay in without a problem.

It really depends on the snake. I have some that need their hides, and get stressed when I remove them. Others, could really care less. Just remember, if your sticking your hands in his cage on feeding day, and a mouse is close by; you're asking to get bit. Lol. Some of my power feeders can smell the rats at the pet store and know when it's feeding day. You couldn't pay me enough to stick my hand in there. Lol.

My thoughts in doing this was because the tubs are quite cramped with the two hides, water bowl, and moss tray - there would be no room to capture their prey - so I remove everything except the aspen.

Mine are currently fasting and I assume it is just the season - but wanted to be sure it wasn't tied to the fact that I was removing everything from their tubs at feeding time.

I just got a new baby bp that is currently eating live and I was instructed to continue with live for a bit - she is sooo small - do I just drop a small rat/mouse in her tub or should I also empty things out. I've never raised a baby up. Or do I dangle a live prey on tongs - I just don't know??

Thanks

You can try the tongs. Or, just drop it in there. The little one will know what to do. They can miss sometimes too. Lol. It takes a few feeding to get it right.

I only keep one hide in my tubs, and the balls move them around like turtle shells. Are you sure you need the moss tray? Tubs should hold pretty good humidity on their own. But, i understand some places are pretty dry.

I think with it being a newbie, I would try and leave as much in there as possible. Try it with the other snakes too, just to make sure they aren't eating because of stress.

I have one really shy one that will not eat unless he thinks I have left the room and turned the lights out. He is a pain in my....shoe.

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Originally Posted by L.West

I just got a new baby bp that is currently eating live and I was instructed to continue with live for a bit - she is sooo small - do I just drop a small rat/mouse in her tub or should I also empty things out. I've never raised a baby up. Or do I dangle a live prey on tongs - I just don't know??

Thanks

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Congrats on the new baby! And if she was on live before, its definitely best that you keep her on live for a while. As for the technique, I know people who just toss them in and I know people who hold the animal by the scruff with their tongs. It's just a matter of personal preference, but you might want to find out how they were doing it where you got her from, so that you'll be sure that she'll understand what's going on a little more.

If it's a baby, and since she's new, you might want to keep her hides in there because she'll still be feeling a little insecure. Maybe to give her some space you could remove her water dish instead of her hides until she's settled in.

Great ideas/suggestions everyone - I will try it.

Oh the hoops we jump thru for our precious babies.
:):):)

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Originally Posted by L.West

Great ideas/suggestions everyone - I will try it.

Oh the hoops we jump thru for our precious babies.
:):):)

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Haha tell me about it! Good luck with her :D

This is what I do I remove the hide befor I even think about touching the mouse. then I touch the snake to wake it up then I remove the water bowl. then I go and get the mouse from the cage. I might have been stupid for this part but it work for me I would hold the mouse by the tail and let the snake hit it. only becouse he hit the side of the tank and it scared him off of food for 2 weeks. He was scared of the mouse. He would see it and try to clime out of the tank or the tub that he was in. It was crazy. He would hit it at the same time I would let it go. Never been bit.

As with everything else - there seems to be many "right" ways to offer the prey - I guess it boils down to what works for you and what you are comfortable with.

I had a system in place that worked well for me for over 1.5 years and then all of a sudden one went off feed and I began trying other tactics to get her to eat. I am beginning to think that these fasts are simply a seasonal thing and not something that is necessarily wrong in their environment.

I know most people don't do this, but I feed in a large box, separate from their living enclosure. I put a towel on the floor, and lay the box out with the bottom flaps to the side (so you may lift the box up off of the snake after feeding, and approach from the rear to put back in habitat). I just leave em in the box for about 10 minutes with the top shut then check on em and if they're waiting for food I drop in the live. I also use my snake hook to pin back the rear legs once it's being constricted to minimize the amount of scratching that goes on. Once they've eaten, I leave em alone for about 20 minutes, then take the box off, pick em up, and put em back. Works like a charm, every time, and mine have never missed a meal or regurgitated or had an impaction. This isn't really feasible if you have more than a few snakes, though

I feed live. Been feeding live since 2008. I usually feed in a different container. My enclosures are decked out in "grandeur". It's not easy to take things out and put things back in. And I don't want rat poop inside the enclosure.

So, on feeding day, I put the snake in a different container, put a lab block (I feed the rats lab block) on one corner and put the rat in there too.

When I produced baby snakes, I started them off by feeding in their enclosure. They were on paper towels, so it's easier to clean. I leave everything - hides and water bowls - and put the rat in with a lab block. The snakes wait for the rats to get closer to the hide and they strike. Sometimes they sneak half-way out of their hides to strike. From my observation, the rats can tell there's a snake in the hide, because they haven't tried to go inside the hide.

But, I've only done this for the first few months, then I moved the "kids" to their "decked out" vivs and now they feed in a separate container.

Wow, that sounds interesting - maybe I could try that with my two finicky eaters - they have both been off food for months now. Sounds like a good plan.

Thanks

I wouldn't try feeding outside of the enclosure until you get them eating. That can be stressful on a snake, and the first thing is to get him to take a meal. You want him in his comfy enclosure. Some where he is used to being.

Sorry, but i don't see the advantages of handling before and after a meal. That's just me. :)

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

I wouldn't try feeding outside of the enclosure until you get them eating. That can be stressful on a snake, and the first thing is to get him to take a meal. You want him in his comfy enclosure. Some where he is used to being.

Sorry, but i don't see the advantages of handling before and after a meal. That's just me. :)

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I agree, and from all I've read I am very fortunate to have such good eaters. That aside, advantages are: no risk of impaction from ingested substrate, no rat contamination in enclosure, I can observe the feeding and make sure my snake isn't being hurt, and since my box is cardboard, there is no risk of a missed strike resulting in a broken jaw.

It's so hard to know what is the right way to go. Seems like so many people have such different methods.
:confused:

I think it just boils down to what works for you and your snakes...the most important thing is their well-being. I've heard of snakes going off feed for 6+ months... if they're not eating, I can't really give you much advice, but it doesn't seem best to change up anything during a hunger strike... they'll decide to eat one day, so as long as they're not rapidly loosing weight, I think time is your best friend

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Originally Posted by gardenfiend138

I agree, and from all I've read I am very fortunate to have such good eaters. That aside, advantages are: no risk of impaction from ingested substrate, no rat contamination in enclosure, I can observe the feeding and make sure my snake isn't being hurt, and since my box is cardboard, there is no risk of a missed strike resulting in a broken jaw.

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Ok. I use paper towels, so there is no ingested substrate. My tubs are clear so I can observe everything at eye level. My balls are used to there tubs, and it is where they feel safe. They aren't stressed by a new place, and I don't handle before or after eating. My rats aren't in there long enough to make a mess until they are constricted, unless they aren't eaten. In that case, they get new towels. Which is so much easier to clean than an type of loose bedding.

The top priority is getting them to eat, so feed them where they are comfortable. Then you can decide what is best for your snake. To me there are more advantages to you feeding outside, than the snake. A snake can digest bones, substrate is no issue. I'm telling you the wild is not clean. Lol. I'm pretty sure they could care less of a few mouse droppings are in there.

And, although I haven't seen any proof of handling after feeding leads to regurgitation. It's still frowned upon. Is it worth the risk?

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

Ok. I use paper towels, so there is no ingested substrate. My tubs are clear so I can observe everything at eye level. My balls are used to there tubs, and it is where they feel safe. They aren't stressed by a new place, and I don't handle before or after eating. My rats aren't in there long enough to make a mess until they are constricted, unless they aren't eaten. In that case, they get new towels. Which is so much easier to clean than an type of loose bedding.

The top priority is getting them to eat, so feed them where they are comfortable. Then you can decide what is best for your snake. To me there are more advantages to you feeding outside, than the snake. A snake can digest bones, substrate is no issue. I'm telling you the wild is not clean. Lol. I'm pretty sure they could care less of a few mouse droppings are in there.

And, although I haven't seen any proof of handling after feeding leads to regurgitation. It's still frowned upon. Is it worth the risk?

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When you're moving a snake from his feeding box to his enclosure, you are moving the snake - not "handling" the snake. You make it so that it would be as close to the same amount of movement as if the snake was moving from outside his hide to inside his hide after eating.

If you have an enclosure like this:
http://i314.photobucket.com/albums/l...photo-36-1.jpg

You can't really feed inside the enclosure because a rat can hide in areas that are in-accessible to the snake and taking apart the enclosure for feeding is not practical.

So yes, it is completely dependent on your set-up and your snake.

Either method is fine.

Put it in a separate tub so the rat doesnt poo all over...

I tried to feed again last night. The two stubborn live eaters refused again. My othe two are on ft - I got lucky with one. Since they are all kept in the same rack with everything else the same - I have to assume it isn't stress since one ate just fine.

I just have to wait them out. My non eaters are not losing any weight so I think they are ok

I am going to the Taylor mi show today - looking forward to it

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Originally Posted by anatess

When you're moving a snake from his feeding box to his enclosure, you are moving the snake - not "handling" the snake. You make it so that it would be as close to the same amount of movement as if the snake was moving from outside his hide to inside his hide after eating.

If you have an enclosure like this:
http://i314.photobucket.com/albums/l...photo-36-1.jpg

You can't really feed inside the enclosure because a rat can hide in areas that are in-accessible to the snake and taking apart the enclosure for feeding is not practical.

So yes, it is completely dependent on your set-up and your snake.

Either method is fine.

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I would never have something like that, because you would have to clean it at least once a month. Who knows where that ball has peed, and that would take forever. And, yes the definition for handling is touching, grasping, use of the hands.

Lol. You do realize we sound like an old couple at the grocery store.

Don't worry OP there is no right/wrong answer when it comes to where to the subject of feeding in a separate enclosure or not. It's a highly debatable subject. Which is awesome! Without debate the world would be boring. :)

When my balls are coming off a fast, I feed mice. They have a stronger scent and usually it's enough to get your ball back in feed mode. And, it's still winter, so just be patient. I had a girl go on a 6 month fast. Had a few feedings with two mice each. Then tried a rat, and she about took my freaking hand off! Good luck with them, and keep us updated.

And ana, that setup is gorgeous! But, we need a better shot of bight yellow creature I see inside. :)

Something I just thought of... do your non eaters seem uninterested when you present food? Or do they seem scared and defensive? If it is the latter, and if you give mice a try next scheduled feeding and they don't take it, maybe try P/K?

PS- Have fun at the show today! I'm jealous!

To gardenfiend138 - when I put a live rat in the tub they both move to the opposite end of the tub and appear to hide. So you think live mice might work

The show was rather crowded but I managed to get the supplies I needed - no more bps for me right now - I've got 5 now.

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Originally Posted by L.West

To gardenfiend138 - when I put a live rat in the tub they both move to the opposite end of the tub and appear to hide. So you think live mice might work

The show was rather crowded but I managed to get the supplies I needed - no more bps for me right now - I've got 5 now.

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That's good the show worked out or ya! When you say 'both', do you mean the rat and the snake move to opposite sides? At first read I took it as two snakes in same tub.. A mouse might work, someone else posted that it has for them. I was just thinking pre-killed might work if the snake is seeming scared? Could be wrong, it was just a thought.

I only keep one snake per tub. What I meant was that the snake would hide towards the back of the tub away from the rat.

I have left ft in overnight with no luck

Well if a pre-killed prey item doesn't work then it's probably just the season...