Dragon Shaking,...

my juvinile male breardie tends to shake when held its not a lot but i wasnt sure if it was something to worry about or him just being nervous??? he also hasnt eaten since i got him last friday???

I have never heard of that. What is your set up like?

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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth

I have never heard of that. What is your set up like?

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he's in with a slightly larger female,... but he's on calci sand about an inch and a half deep through out the 30-35galon tank and there is a large rock that looks like it used to double as a hide plus a log that is proped in the corner as a second basking space they are fed seperately and are given basking light 12hrs out of the day i turn the light on when i get up with my son at 9am then it gets turned off when he goes to bed at 9pm the thermostat in the back of the tank reads between 80-90 without light and between 95-110 with the light

Is his whole body shaking or just like a leg or back legs or what?

He might not be eating because the female is stressing him out. Bigger dragons will establish dominance over smaller ones and the stress can effect the little ones. I've read about smaller beardies not eating because they were housed with a larger beardie that stressed them out.

How big are the dragons? Depending on their size, 30-35 gallons is small for two dragons especially when they get bigger. Also, when they're bigger, they're going to need to be separated or the male will overbreed the female and it will affect her health.

Sand is bad for juvie dragons. They can lick or eat it with their food if it falls out of their bowl or if you feed live crickets in the tank. Tile or laminate is waaaay easier to clean and way cheaper. Trust me. I got bad info and had our beardie on sand and we recently switched to slate tiles and OMG it's soooo nice. We don't have to trim her nails or worry about her eating the sand inadvertently. It's a one time cost. We got "expensive" slate tiles for $19 rather than spend $30 on two bags of sand every six months.

Basically, split them up in two tanks [when they're full grown 40 gallon breeder minimum], and put them on tile or laminate.

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Originally Posted by maverickgtr

Is his whole body shaking or just like a leg or back legs or what?

He might not be eating because the female is stressing him out. Bigger dragons will establish dominance over smaller ones and the stress can effect the little ones. I've read about smaller beardies not eating because they were housed with a larger beardie that stressed them out.

How big are the dragons? Depending on their size, 30-35 gallons is small for two dragons especially when they get bigger. Also, when they're bigger, they're going to need to be separated or the male will overbreed the female and it will affect her health.

Sand is bad for juvie dragons. They can lick or eat it with their food if it falls out of their bowl or if you feed live crickets in the tank. Tile or laminate is waaaay easier to clean and way cheaper. Trust me. I got bad info and had our beardie on sand and we recently switched to slate tiles and OMG it's soooo nice. We don't have to trim her nails or worry about her eating the sand inadvertently. It's a one time cost. We got "expensive" slate tiles for $19 rather than spend $30 on two bags of sand every six months.

Basically, split them up in two tanks [when they're full grown 40 gallon breeder minimum], and put them on tile or laminate.

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alright the sand is what the female was on when she got here she was abandoned by my friend that also left me a bp that had a 3rd degree burn,... i understand the seperate tanks i have to go get my 20 long out of storage this week thats why they were together i didn't think he deserved to sit in a tiny box with no light till i could get the tank,... i have had beardies in the past and always used the sand i didn't know it could cause so many problems he has now asked for his dragon back anyway so i will be getting the tank in the next day or so what should i keep him in till then,... also there is only about an inch difference in thier lengths but thats the only noticable size difference thats why i thought he would be ok but its an all over shake is there anything other than the tiles or slate that you would recomend,...?

I will bet money he is like that because he is with the other. Who knows what she is doing to him when you aren't looking. Also mav is right about the sand. Be sure that he is pooing. Also be sure to give him a bath every other day right now till he eats. Probably a little dehydrated as well. In the interim....do you have anything that will double as a little tank or a critter carrier you could put him in? My concern is she will kill him. They will eat another beardie if they can.

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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth

I will bet money he is like that because he is with the other. Who knows what she is doing to him when you aren't looking. Also mav is right about the sand. Be sure that he is pooing. Also be sure to give him a bath every other day right now till he eats. Probably a little dehydrated as well. In the interim....do you have anything that will double as a little tank or a critter carrier you could put him in? My concern is she will kill him. They will eat another beardie if they can.

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the only thing i have is an under the bed storage box till i can get the tank i will soak him and let you guys know what happens thank you for your time and addvice

ok i just soaked him away from her and he didn't go poo while he was in there like she usually does,... and when i took him out i looked a little closer at him and noticed that its just his head that shakes not his whole body

i'm offering him some greens now and he wont touch them he just looks at them and she's not in the tank its her turn to soak

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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth

My concern is she will kill him. They will eat another beardie if they can.

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Now that would be just aweful!

I dont knwo much about beardies but I wanted to say good luck with the little one.

Gosh I just don't know what to tell you. I am sorry that I don't know what is wrong.

You might go over to beardeddragon.org and ask why her head is shaking. There are a lot more ppl over there that beardies is ALL they do.

The breeder I got my beardie from kept all his beardies on sand with no problems. But they were born on sand so they were used to it. Some beardies like to lick things to get used to them. Isis is a poster child of this. When she first encountered carpet she licked it and I had to run over to make sure she didn't get any stray fibers in her mouth. :rolleyes: Sometimes they're just going for a cricket and they get sand too. If they get too much sand, it can cause impaction which if not noticed or addressed, can be deadly for dragons. Paper towels, tiles, laminate flooring, etc. It's incredibly easy to clean and spot poos or if anything is abnormal about the poo. And it's a one time investment. If you're keeping the little guy, coming from someone that's switched from sand to tile, it's a worthwhile investment.

If all you've got is one tank, can you maybe get/make a divider or something until your friend can get the female again? It'll be easier to see if he's not pooing or not eating if they're separated. And I'm not sure who it was here, but I read about one guy's/girl's bigger beardie dragging a smaller one around by it's head. So like BPEliz said, you can't know what she's doing to him when you're not looking. I understand having an animal thrust on you, so just try to get that spare tank as soon as you can.

Is it kind of like an up and down shake? Beardies will bob their heads sometimes. But this sounds like a dog shaking when they're cold type of thing... I've never heard of an actual shake... It could be stress, new environment with another beardie, it's cold out, etc.

Oh and the not pooing, it could be impaction, it could just be because he hasn't eaten. If you hold him on your hand across your fingers, just gently "wave" your fingers across his belly. Massage his belly basically. I did this to Isis once when she had pooed in a while and almost immediately she pooed, so make sure he's over like a paper towel, or the bath tub or a toilet. If he is impacted, you should feel bumps kinda like pebbles in his stomach.

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Originally Posted by maverickgtr

The breeder I got my beardie from kept all his beardies on sand with no problems. But they were born on sand so they were used to it. Some beardies like to lick things to get used to them. Isis is a poster child of this. When she first encountered carpet she licked it and I had to run over to make sure she didn't get any stray fibers in her mouth. :rolleyes: Sometimes they're just going for a cricket and they get sand too. If they get too much sand, it can cause impaction which if not noticed or addressed, can be deadly for dragons. Paper towels, tiles, laminate flooring, etc. It's incredibly easy to clean and spot poos or if anything is abnormal about the poo. And it's a one time investment. If you're keeping the little guy, coming from someone that's switched from sand to tile, it's a worthwhile investment.

If all you've got is one tank, can you maybe get/make a divider or something until your friend can get the female again? It'll be easier to see if he's not pooing or not eating if they're separated. And I'm not sure who it was here, but I read about one guy's/girl's bigger beardie dragging a smaller one around by it's head. So like BPEliz said, you can't know what she's doing to him when you're not looking. I understand having an animal thrust on you, so just try to get that spare tank as soon as you can.

Is it kind of like an up and down shake? Beardies will bob their heads sometimes. But this sounds like a dog shaking when they're cold type of thing... I've never heard of an actual shake... It could be stress, new environment with another beardie, it's cold out, etc.

Oh and the not pooing, it could be impaction, it could just be because he hasn't eaten. If you hold him on your hand across your fingers, just gently "wave" your fingers across his belly. Massage his belly basically. I did this to Isis once when she had pooed in a while and almost immediately she pooed, so make sure he's over like a paper towel, or the bath tub or a toilet. If he is impacted, you should feel bumps kinda like pebbles in his stomach.

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ok thank you for the addvice i will try to divide the tank tonight,... would that stress him more than just using the tub with some paper towels cuz of the sudden shrink in space,...? and yeah he kinda looks like he's shivering but its just his head its really strange and i will try to rub his tummy the way you suggested or at least feel for an impaction and update once these thing have been tested i'm starting to wonder if i smell a vet visit coming cuz this is just so strange is there anything else i could try feeding him i've been offering greens but havent had a chance to finish setting up my mealworm breeder and or to purchase crikets,...

If you feel more comfortable putting him in a tub, then go for it. If you can get the lights he needs on the tub then it'll be the same as dividing the tank.

If he keeps the shaking up after you get them separated, I'd definitely take him to a vet. It could be stress but it could be something more serious if it keeps up. He might have neurological problems if it isn't stress. It doesn't sound like too big of an issue and he could live a normal life. A vet could tell you more though.

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Originally Posted by maverickgtr

If you feel more comfortable putting him in a tub, then go for it. If you can get the lights he needs on the tub then it'll be the same as dividing the tank.

If he keeps the shaking up after you get them separated, I'd definitely take him to a vet. It could be stress but it could be something more serious if it keeps up. He might have neurological problems if it isn't stress. It doesn't sound like too big of an issue and he could live a normal life. A vet could tell you more though.

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alright thanks for the help and i'll let you know what happens

If it isn't the typical head bobbing seen during sexual displays or territorial disputes, then it is most likely (not a diagnosis, but a possible cause) related to dietary issues. The important thing is not only correcting the problem, but also getting at the source of the issue.

Shaking in dragons is common (though not always the cause) when they are not getting enough calcium. Calcium is used for muscle contractions and spasms are not uncommon when calcium levels are low.
Common remedies include calcium supplementation.

Common issues that lead up to issues with calcium:
Improper husbandry is the biggest problem. If the lizard is too cold, too dehydrated, too stressed, too impacted, too anything else that may hinder the consumption of food, the ability to properly digest food, or the ability to attain the proper temperatures. It could also be an improper diet in general that led to this so even though it is eating well, if it isn't eating the right foods the problem can manifest itself. Shaking is also common in females that cycle but are not given the proper diet/calcium levels. There are a number of possible causes for shaking. None of them are good but some are quite easy to remedy.

Definitely separate the lizard from all other lizards (potential causes of stress). Make sure the cage is set up properly. Put it on newspaper so that you can easily see if it is pooping and peeing as it should be. Make sure it is eating, and above all if you're not sure why it is shaking take it to a vet.

J.....she stated that its not eating therefore not getting calcium. In these cases I know a vet can give a calcium shot....but what about giving it a bath and putting calci drops in the water so that its absorbed?????

If a calcium deficiency is deemed the problem the concentrations the vet will give will far surpass the amount that may be ingested during a soak. That method is not controlled enough to ensure they're getting the levels they need. (Though with reptiles I'm not sure if enough data have been gathered to determine what the "normal" amounts are). But if it is a calcium problem the solution given there will be better than the home remedies that can be offered.

The vet will also be able to rule out other issues including impaction, parasites, injury, etc. If it turns out calcium isn't the issue, then the calcium supplements won't be of much use.

just wanted to check in on you....any changes??

I got him to eat crickets but he wont touch greens at all,... ans he still shakes i dono what to think right now i'm going to call the place i bought him from in the morning to find out what his exact environment was before i got him including what type of greens i'm thinking he's just a picky eater

Baby beardies don't usually like greens. That's normal. You should offer anyway because sometimes they'll snack on them. Just dust the crickets with calcium and a multivitamin. As for the shaking, I'm stumped if it's not a calcium deficiency like J suggested.

Did your friend get his/her beardie back?

Do you have a UVB light on him and is it more than 6months old? Is the lamp no more than 12inches away from him? Dust the crix with regular calcium at all feedings,and then once a week feeding dust with calcium with D3. Make sure that both types of calcium doesn't have phosphorus in it. The shaking is more than likely a calcium thing. But if his calcium regimen is good it could be neurological. Beardies under a year want more protein than greens. As they get older they become more interested In the greens. Do you see any kinks in his tail? That would indicate mbd, gut load any feeders with either the calcium rich cricket diet or laying hen mash to enrich the actual feeder with ca as well. I would still check with a vet but because beardies are diurnal they need a really good calcium and UVB regimen. UVB should be changed every 6months to a year. The amount of UVB put out by the lamp decreases over time. I hope this helps.
Morgan

I'm glad that someone brought up the UVB point. You can feed a beardie as much calcium as you can, and it won't do a lick of good without providing proper UVB lighting. What does your lighting set-up look like, and how old are all of the bulbs?

That is absolutely correct. Ca does nothing with no UVB. I suggest if the op doesn't have UVB they go get one asap.

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Originally Posted by Cheshire_queen

my juvinile male breardie tends to shake when held its not a lot but i wasnt sure if it was something to worry about or him just being nervous??? he also hasnt eaten since i got him last friday???

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Beyond time for a professional to diagnose the problem. Time to find a vet in your area.