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Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
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thats a one bad rifle i was thinking of picking one up!
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Nice:gj:
Always love a good bolt over an auto, Just not fond of the ported barrel.
Low light shots will be a little blinding.
.308 is a great round for anything but squirrel LOL
Was your panther a .308 or .223?
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Nice! All I have is a 1911, but I'll definitely be sniping some stuff one of these days.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl
Nice:gj:
Always love a good bolt over an auto, Just not fond of the ported barrel.
Low light shots will be a little blinding.
.308 is a great round for anything but squirrel LOL
Was your panther a .308 or .223?
It was also a 308. Its my favorite round.:cool:
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Would I be in trouble if I said they look the same....:P Sorry...my husband would be so disappointed in me right now. :rolleyes: I am soooo not a gun girl but my hubby is. A few months ago he stated he needed a rifle....I was like....you have one honey. No thats a shot gun. (I think that is how it went or vice versa):please: I just know one carries 1 bullet...the other goes chi chick before you shoot it...and the last one is a pistol.:rofl:
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uhm besides a terrorist attack on the presidents daughter like that game i use to play *can't remember the name right now :(* but where can you use that? or what would you use it for?
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dembonez
uhm besides a terrorist attack on the presidents daughter like that game i use to play *can't remember the name right now :(* but where can you use that? or what would you use it for?
Target practice:rolleyes:
I liked the old Panther but I gotta say that REMINGTON is pretty sweet! and look at the scope on it!:O Glad to see that BP money is going to good use;)
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BPelizabeth
Would I be in trouble if I said they look the same....
:banned1::banned1::banned1::banned1::banned1::neener::neener::rofl:
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dembonez
what would you use it for?
The better question is, What CAN'T you use a .308 for?:gj::gj:
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by RhacHead
Target practice:rolleyes:
Glad to see that BP money is going to good use;)
I had to sell the panther so i could buy it. They both cost about the same. Wife wouldn't let me get a new rifle unless i sold my other one. I'll never understand her logic. Guns aren't like women. You can have more then one.
:cool:
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
I sold my DPMS panther because it wasn't all that accurate at 1000 yards. My new one? Gigidy gigidy.
I've talked about this in the past, so it's not surprising I'm going to bring this up again.
Please be careful when posting pictures of your firearms. With the world being a crazy place, there are many reasons to not post pictures of your firearms.
I'm not telling you not to, but remember, nothing on the internet is secure. So now there are hundreds of people that know you have these firearms. With a little bit of searching, they can find where you live. There are also people that say it's not good to let Big Brother know what firearms you own.
Regardless of choice, I don't know if it's a good idea to post pictures.
Just one man's opinion,
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BPelizabeth
Would I be in trouble if I said they look the same....:P Sorry...my husband would be so disappointed in me right now. :rolleyes: I am soooo not a gun girl but my hubby is. A few months ago he stated he needed a rifle....I was like....you have one honey. No thats a shot gun. (I think that is how it went or vice versa):please: I just know one carries 1 bullet...the other goes chi chick before you shoot it...and the last one is a pistol.:rofl:
I'm so confused. You say you don't know anything about firearms but with that description, I can't believe you. Then we have the statment that your husband is a gun girl.
Help me understand Michelle.
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
I've talked about this in the past, so it's not surprising I'm going to bring this up again.
Please be careful when posting pictures of your firearms. With the world being a crazy place, there are many reasons to not post pictures of your firearms.
I'm not telling you not to, but remember, nothing on the internet is secure. So now there are hundreds of people that know you have these firearms. With a little bit of searching, they can find where you live. There are also people that say it's not good to let Big Brother know what firearms you own.
Regardless of choice, I don't know if it's a good idea to post pictures.
Just one man's opinion,
Jim Smith
A little history on me. I spent a long time in the Marines shooting every kind of gun there is. My job requires that i carry an AR-15 and a HK USP. Big brother needs to watch out for me.
This is me at work hehe. I think i'll be ok.
http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r...r19/work-1.jpg
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
A little history on me. I spent a long time in the Marines shooting every kind of gun there is. My job requires that i carry an AR-15 and a HK USP. Big brother needs to watch out for me.
This is me at work hehe. I think i'll be ok.
http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r...r19/work-1.jpg
Good, I'm glad you know your way around firearms, but that doesn't prevent someone from stealing your firearms. I stand by my statement that it's not a good idea to post your firearm collection.
BTW, since you've shot EVERY kind of firearm, why would you buy a VTR? Not your best choice for a "Sniper Rifle". Even the Savage 10fp is a better "Sniper Rifle". Oh, you may want to rethink that scope too. At 1000 yards, you might as well have a NcStar.
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
Good, I'm glad you know your way around firearms, but that doesn't prevent someone from stealing your firearms. I stand by my statement that it's not a good idea to post your firearm collection.
BTW, since you've shot EVERY kind of firearm, why would you buy a VTR? Not your best choice for a "Sniper Rifle". Even the Savage 10fp is a better "Sniper Rifle". Oh, you may want to rethink that scope too. At 1000 yards, you might as well have a NcStar.
Jim Smith
I chose the VTR because it was in my price range. I also chose the scope for its bullet drop compensation rings on the retical up to 600 yards. I will be hunting with this rifle so it had to be light. The VTR is perfect for that. Of course there are better sniper rifles out there and they also cost more. I'm not loaded and this is what i can afford. I'm sorry it's not up to your standards. It must be lonely up on your know it all high horse.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
I sold my DPMS panther because it wasn't all that accurate at 1000 yards. My new one? Gigidy gigidy.
OLD panther.
Image Removed
NEW REMINGTON 700 VTR-308
Images Removed
So you sold the Olympic Arms for a Remington VTR to be used as a 1000 yard sniper rifle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
A little history on me. I spent a long time in the Marines shooting every kind of gun there is. My job requires that i carry an AR-15 and a HK USP. Big brother needs to watch out for me.
This is me at work hehe. I think i'll be ok.
Hehe, cool picture. Hehe, I'd remount that EO Tech before it gets ripped off of the rifle or at the very least, lose your Point of Aim. Hehe, trust me Big Brother has nothing to worry about, even with that VTR in your more than capable hands.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
I chose the VTR because it was in my price range. I also chose the scope for its bullet drop compensation rings on the retical up to 600 yards. I will be hunting with this rifle so it had to be light. The VTR is perfect for that. Of course there are better sniper rifles out there and they also cost more. I'm not loaded and this is what i can afford. I'm sorry it's not up to your standards. It must be lonely up on your know it all high horse.
Is it a 600 yard hunting rifle or a 1000 yard sniper rifle? I'm confused. Did you buy a scope built for the 7.62 x 51 or the .308? You do know they have slightly different ballistic characteristics. I believe it's chambered for the .308, do you know if it's safe to shoot 7.62 x 51 in it? The more accurate match grade ammo is only chambered for the 7.62 x 51. Make sure your rifle is safe to shoot the 7.62 x 51 before you hit the range.
If you're buying this rifle to hunt, then you have a nice rifle, but it's probably not a 600 yard rifle without a bit of work and it's far from a 1000 yard "Sniper Rifle".
I don't ride a high horse, but I do know my firearms. But at least I don't think I'm going to take on Big Brother and win. Know it all, no, know enough, yes.
If you can't afford that 1000 yard rifle, that's fine. Many people can't, but don't call a VTR a 1000 yard "Sniper Rifle". BTW, a good piece of glass is going to cost you 3-4 times the cost of that rifle. We both know that without the proper glass, there's no "Sniper rifle" that's going to do it's job.
Enjoy hunting them squirrels.
Jim Smith
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BTW the name of the game was sniper scope! LOL loved that game and closest i ever came to shooting a real gun! :rolleyes:
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Jim, bit sandy? Or did your cheerios taste a bit funny this morning?
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
So you sold the Olympic Arms for a Remington VTR to be used as a 1000 yard sniper rifle.
Is it a 600 yard hunting rifle or a 1000 yard sniper rifle? I'm confused. Did you buy a scope built for the 7.62 x 51 or the .308? You do know they have slightly different ballistic characteristics. I believe it's chambered for the .308, do you know if it's safe to shoot 7.62 x 51 in it? The more accurate match grade ammo is only chambered for the 7.62 x 51. Make sure your rifle is safe to shoot the 7.62 x 51 before you hit the range.
If you can't afford that 1000 yard rifle, that's fine. Many people can't, but don't call a VTR a 1000 yard "Sniper Rifle". BTW, a good piece of glass is going to cost you 3-4 times the cost of that rifle. We both know that without the proper glass, there's no "Sniper rifle" that's going to do it's job.
Enjoy hunting them squirrels.
Jim Smith
It's a DPMS not an Olympic arms. Contrary to your thinking the DPMS quallity has improved greatly in the last few years. I would trust my life to one.
I bench shoot to 1000 yards all the time and this rifle will do it no problem. I also hunt. The 308 round is the perfect all around hunting ammo.
This rifle is chambered for 308 that means i can also shoot 7.62x51 which has thicker casing and Lower PSI. Sometimes it will cause extraction issues but thats only in automatics. This scope is perfect for both hunting and bench shooting at long range.
Right now im just waiting on my Mcmillan stock. The only thing lowering my accuracy right now is the cheap stock it came with. Remington chose it to keep the costs down. With the stock upgrade this will be a great 1000 yard rifle. If it wasn't 5 degrees outside i woud be shooting right now.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Nice rifle, hope it knocks the heck out of them pie tins!
Quote:
Originally Posted by dembonez
uhm besides a terrorist attack on the presidents daughter like that game i use to play *can't remember the name right now :(* but where can you use that? or what would you use it for?
Paper! Evil PAPER!!!
I have many rifles and I have never shot anything but paper.
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
Please be careful when posting pictures of your firearms. With the world being a crazy place, there are many reasons to not post pictures of your firearms.
Just one man's opinion,
Jim Smith
I have stopped putting up pictures of my new firearms because of big brother and it only makes me a target (pun intended) for thieves.
It may only be one mans opinion but he is quit opinionated today ;)
Mike
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I'd be more careful putting up pictures of $5000 snakes than I would my $500 rifle.
just sayin..
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainbutter
I'd be more careful putting up pictures of $5000 snakes than I would my $500 rifle.
just sayin..
But that only holds true if you only have one gun. Many here have a collection worth many thousands of dollars. I'm sure there are a few that their gun collection is more valuable than many breeder's stock. Remember, one class III M16 has a cost of $12k to $20k, then if one would happen to have an M60, they could sell for more than $40k. One may have a scope that cost somewhere in the $2k to $4k range. So, as you can see, a gun collection could easily close in on $100k or more. But losing a $3000 gun collection is devastating since many homeowner/renters insurance policy won't cover anything but a minimum without a rider.
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that remi 700 puts mine to shame what a beauty. . . .
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camarokidz28
Jim, bit sandy? Or did your cheerios taste a bit funny this morning?
No, not at all. But when someone posts a message saying that he's bought a 1000 yard rifle and then shows a Remington 700 VTR, I've got to say something.
Kind of like a few years ago, when people were trying to pass off a regular albino for a lavender albino.
I've got a 1974 Nova, but I don't tell people it's a Yenko. Anyone with obvious knowledge will certainly tell me I'm full of it.
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
VTR = Varmint Target Rifle :D
Good for sniping coyotes or deer or even the elusive paper backed silhouette...
Mike
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
I'm so confused. You say you don't know anything about firearms but with that description, I can't believe you. Then we have the statment that your husband is a gun girl.
Help me understand Michelle.
Jim Smith
:O:O:O Holy crap...I did call him a gun girl! :O Ok Jim its official...you can NEVER meet my husband. The two of you would have a field day with my blondness..:rofl:
Ya know....if he wants it....I don't care just buy the stupid thing....you dont have to justify it with me. But he feels the need to go on this rant as to wwwhhhhhhhhhhhyyyyyyyyy he needs it. :rolleyes: Blah blah blah. I can rant all day as to why I need this animal or that reptile or why the size of my diamond DOES need to increase on a bi-yearly basis....lol:please:
On a serious note Jim actually sounds paranoid but its for a good reason!! You never know what will happen in the future especially with our right to bear arms. The less big bro knows....the better!! The same goes with our snakes....I have been told by more than one big breeder in the industry, don't talk about what you have as you will become a target. For me Im like...cmon. Get past the locks, the security system, the two large dogs, the hubby that could snap your neck in a second, and then the chi chick gun. lol:P But seriously you do have to be careful.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BPelizabeth
:O:O:O Holy crap...I did call him a gun girl! :O Ok Jim its official...you can NEVER meet my husband. The two of you would have a field day with my blondness..:rofl:
Ya know....if he wants it....I don't care just buy the stupid thing....you dont have to justify it with me. But he feels the need to go on this rant as to wwwhhhhhhhhhhhyyyyyyyyy he needs it. :rolleyes: Blah blah blah. I can rant all day as to why I need this animal or that reptile or why the size of my diamond DOES need to increase on a bi-yearly basis....lol:please:
On a serious note Jim actually sounds paranoid but its for a good reason!! You never know what will happen in the future especially with our right to bear arms. The less big bro knows....the better!! The same goes with our snakes....I have been told by more than one big breeder in the industry, don't talk about what you have as you will become a target. For me Im like...cmon. Get past the locks, the security system, the two large dogs, the hubby that could snap your neck in a second, and then the chi chick gun. lol:P But seriously you do have to be careful.
Oh no, the hubby and I have way too much in common for us not to meet one day.
Careful, they're listening. Be careful what you type too, they record everything you type on your keyboard. :taz: :gj: :D
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
No, not at all. But when someone posts a message saying that he's bought a 1000 yard rifle and then shows a Remington 700 VTR, I've got to say something.
Kind of like a few years ago, when people were trying to pass off a regular albino for a lavender albino.
I've got a 1974 Nova, but I don't tell people it's a Yenko. Anyone with obvious knowledge will certainly tell me I'm full of it.
Jim Smith
Have you shot a 308 VTR or is all your info second hand? When the VTR first came out it was a just ok rifle. Mainly because the faulty trigger. It got some bad rep because of that. They have redesigned it and now its a perfect working weapon.
Another thing about this rifle which i'm sure you don't know about is that its picky with ammo. Any ammo over 175 grain it instantly becomes a sub moa gun. I shoot my own 180 grain hand loads. When it warms up i'm going to take this to a 1k yard range and we will see how it performs.
The fact that you think 7.62x51 is more powerful than the standard off the shelf 308 showed me that you know absolutely nothing about this kind of ammo.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
Have you shot a 308 VTR or is all your info second hand? When the VTR first came out it was a just ok rifle. Mainly because the faulty trigger. It got some bad rep because of that. They have redesigned it and now its a perfect working weapon.
Another thing about this rifle which i'm sure you don't know about is that its picky with ammo. Any ammo over 175 grain it instantly becomes a sub moa gun. I shoot my own 180 grain hand loads. When it warms up i'm going to take this to a 1k yard range and we will see how it performs.
The fact that you think 7.62x51 is more powerful than the standard off the shelf 308 showed me that you know absolutely nothing about this kind of ammo.
Yeah, you're right, I know nothing. You go ahead and shoot that VTR on the 1000 yard range. BTW, which range do you shoot at?
You also don't know what I meant about being safe for 7.62mm, oh well, that's something else I don't know.
I hope you enjoy that perfect working weapon. BTW, have you ever seen this rifle used or recommended by anyone that knows what a shooting jacket is? I think not.
I know, it must be the shooter. You're shouting all of these accolates and you haven't shot the rifle. Where have you been getting your information?
BTW, what manufacturer of spotting scope do you use? Where did you buy your shooting jacket?
What's your best groupings at 1000 yards?
Have you done any competitive matches? I guess you're an old pro at the 600 yard matches. Camp Perry any interest to you? John C. Garand Match? Maybe I'll see you there next year, or maybe Knob Creek.
Jim Smith
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Ohhhhh a shooting match!
:D
Jim you go to Camp Perry?
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BPelizabeth
Ohhhhh a shooting match!
:D
Jim you go to Camp Perry?
Been there a few times. Lately I like Knob Creek, I don't need great eyesight to shoot class III weapons. I can't get enough of sending gobs of ammo down range. Gotta love the Big Dogs and their firearms. I have personally seen one guy bring $30k worth of ammo and had to buy more while he was there.
As far as Camp Perry, it was a good time. Since my diabetes has gotten worse, I don't have the eyesight to shoot any longer than 200 yards. I got started years ago when I met Gunny Hathcock in Virginia. His boy is just like him, a real gentleman. I wish Carlos had more time on this Earth. He was a unique guy.
I also know Orest Micheals, COO of the CMP. Why is it that there are so many great guys representing the shooting sports.
I also like to go to bowling pin shoots. I also teach. I'm a lifetime member of the NRA as well as a few other groups that represent the shooting sports and my 2nd Amendment rights.
Other than that, I don't know much about firearms.
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
Been there a few times. Lately I like Knob Creek, I don't need great eyesight to shoot class III weapons. I can't get enough of sending gobs of ammo down range. Gotta love the Big Dogs and their firearms. I have personally seen one guy bring $30k worth of ammo and had to buy more while he was there.
As far as Camp Perry, it was a good time. Since my diabetes has gotten worse, I don't have the eyesight to shoot any longer than 200 yards. I got started years ago when I met Gunny Hathcock in Virginia. His boy is just like him, a real gentleman. I wish Carlos had more time on this Earth. He was a unique guy.
I also know Orest Micheals, COO of the CMP. Why is it that there are so many great guys representing the shooting sports.
I also like to go to bowling pin shoots. I also teach. I'm a lifetime member of the NRA as well as a few other groups that represent the shooting sports and my 2nd Amendment rights.
Other than that, I don't know much about firearms.
Jim Smith
If your so well trained and an instructor why do you need to jump down my throat and belittle my rifle when its what i can afford. If i were rich i would buy a CheyTac 408.
Yes there are Way better long range rifles out there and no my wife will not let me have them. I have to make due with what i have. And No my rifle would not shoot accurately at 1000 yards out of the box. But it will when i'm done with it. As for the competitions i only did them while i was in the Marines. My 1000 yard groupings were all done with a 50 and that's a different animal.
I've come to the conclusion that you are just a mean person with an overinflated sense of accomplishment and nobody can do anything as good as you.
I just hope you dont troll your students like you troll this forum. If you do i fell sorry for them.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
I sold my DPMS panther because it wasn't all that accurate at 1000 yards. My new one? Gigidy gigidy.
OLD panther.
Image Removed
NEW REMINGTON 700 VTR-308
Images Removed
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkice
If your so well trained and an instructor why do you need to jump down my throat and belittle my rifle when its what i can afford. If i were rich i would buy a CheyTac 408.
Yes there are Way better long range rifles out there and no my wife will not let me have them. I have to make due with what i have. And No my rifle would not shoot accurately at 1000 yards out of the box. But it will when i'm done with it. As for the competitions i only did them while i was in the Marines. My 1000 yard groupings were all done with a 50 and that's a different animal.
I've come to the conclusion that you are just a mean person with an overinflated sense of accomplishment and nobody can do anything as good as you.
I just hope you dont troll your students like you troll this forum. If you do i fell sorry for them.
So, which is it? Did you shoot the AR at 1000 yards or not? Seems like you said in one post your AR didn't shoot well enough at 1000 yards, then you say you haven't shot anything but the 50 bmg at 1000 yards and that was while you were in the military. So which is it?
Your rifle will never be a 1000 yard shooter, no matter what you do to it. It's just not that type of firearm. It's a hunting rifle and a good 100 yard shooter, maybe 200 yards with the right kind of work done to it. It takes a lot of money just to make a decent 600 yard rifle. Open sight shooting at 200 yards is tough enough, 600 yards is a great deal harder, but at 1000 yards, you've got to be a special shooter and have a great rifle and even better glass.
You do realize that a 1000 yards is 3000 feet? More than a half of a mile. Actually .568 of a mile. That's a half of a mile, then add another 120 yards. You want me to believe that a $600 gun is capable of shooting 1000 yards?
Sorry but it's just not possible,
Jim Smith
ps To everyone reading this thread. I'm sorry, but the fabrication of his story isn't realistic.
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Camp Perry is just a few miles away from where I did most of my vacationing in Ohio. Right on the lake....its beautiful there. I use to live there when I was a little girl and then we bought the ranch in NE Ohio.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BPelizabeth
Camp Perry is just a few miles away from where I did most of my vacationing in Ohio. Right on the lake....its beautiful there. I use to live there when I was a little girl and then we bought the ranch in NE Ohio.
That's cool. It sure can get windy there. I've seen a calm day turn into a gale force wind. Crazy weather to be sure.
Small world!
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
So, which is it? Did you shoot the AR at 1000 yards or not? Seems like you said in one post your AR didn't shoot well enough at 1000 yards, then you say you haven't shot anything but the 50 bmg at 1000 yards and that was while you were in the military. So which is it?
Your rifle will never be a 1000 yard shooter, no matter what you do to it. It's just not that type of firearm. It's a hunting rifle and a good 100 yard shooter, maybe 200 yards with the right kind of work done to it. It takes a lot of money just to make a decent 600 yard rifle. Open sight shooting at 200 yards is tough enough, 600 yards is a great deal harder, but at 1000 yards, you've got to be a special shooter and have a great rifle and even better glass.
You do realize that a 1000 yards is 3000 feet? More than a half of a mile. Actually .568 of a mile. That's a half of a mile, then add another 120 yards. You want me to believe that a $600 gun is capable of shooting 1000 yards?
Sorry but it's just not possible,
Jim Smith
ps To everyone reading this thread. I'm sorry, but the fabrication of his story isn't realistic.
Some info on the standard off the shelf 308 federal.
308, Federal GM308M, 168 gr., 2600 ft/s, 4988 yards, 81 ft-lbs
So what your saying is that a round that normally goes about 5000 yards on its own nobody in the world can hit a target at only 1000 yards?
And one of your questions was about competition shooting. I have only shot the 50 in competitions. And that was at 1000 yards.
I just don't understand why you have to attack me because i'm building a 1000 yard gun out of a VTR.
Just because it's not the gun you would have chosen because your overburdened with money doesn't mean it wont work. I say it will and i'm willing to prove it
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
That's cool. It sure can get windy there. I've seen a calm day turn into a gale force wind. Crazy weather to be sure.
Small world!
Jim Smith
Yea try being out on the lake when that happens. Its called chummin ew...:oops:
Sorry for the thread jack.
If I may step in here.....I don't think Jim was at all trying to attack you. I think he was wondering why you chose that paticular gun when there are others out there that might do a better job. And you answered .....its the money...and I totally get that as well as I think Jim does too. I think you both need to be nice to each other and stop saying mean things before I get the chi chick gun out. :rofl: Totally kidding you guys. Just be nice and realize you both have a passion for at least a couple of the same things.
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
I'm a lifetime member of the NRA
Not to jump into ya'lls :groinkick lets see whos bigger competition BUT this is something I would NOT be proud to shout out anymore. They are not and do not represent what they use to be. Was a member for over 15 years then I had my eyes opened a little;) Wouldnt surprise me if you didnt have you 2nd by the end of this term:rofl:
Distance shooting is nice but I stick with the real world and close quarters combat. I'm just fine with my 9mm, 12ga, or 7.62x54r. Yes I did type that right, 7.62x54r.
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love the .308s. good luck with her and update us on how she does.
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First of all I looked at these weapons back last year, the only reason I passed is that at the time .308 was the largest cal. they were chambered for.
Some pros I noticed
- weight: seemed to be a nice heavy gun made for the bench and not an offhand shot
- action: 60 degree throw on the bolt was a welcome sight
Cons
- Muzzle Break: while reduceing the felt recoil it also decresses the muzzle velocity which in turn alters your bullet drop and spin drift. It also increasses the over pressure felt by to operator so while the recoil is less the shock wave made by the barrel pressure will be greater.
- Largest chamber was a .308; while a good round I was in the market for something else
- width of "Fore grip": while wide and very stable there are some bi pods that don't seat well with this stock
I look forward to seeing how you work with this system to reach your target yardage. Nothing wrong with starting with a good base and building up from there..
If I might make a suggestion, if you don't already invest in a chronograph..Fire 3-5 rounds and figure your drop comp from that velocity. If you're buying off the shelf rounds do this anytime you open a new box, while some rounds are very consistent like Nosler Custom which are hand loaded or Hornady Trophy others like Federal or Winchester can have differences of hundreds of FPS difference between boxes..
P.S.. I like the optics..Target turrets are a good thing to have..
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth
Yea try being out on the lake when that happens. Its called chummin ew...:oops:
Sorry for the thread jack.
If I may step in here.....I don't think Jim was at all trying to attack you. I think he was wondering why you chose that paticular gun when there are others out there that might do a better job. And you answered .....its the money...and I totally get that as well as I think Jim does too. I think you both need to be nice to each other and stop saying mean things before I get the chi chick gun out. :rofl: Totally kidding you guys. Just be nice and realize you both have a passion for at least a couple of the same things.
Sorry, but what I was saying is that he sold an AR because it didn't shoot well enough out to 1000 yards, then he goes out and buys a VTR. A rifle that isn't capable of shooting that distance. He could have spent far less money on the AR and had a better shooing rifle than he will be able to do with the VTR. His first post states that he sold the AR because it wasn't good enough at shooting out to 1000 yards, so he bought a $600 Remington 700 VTR, making us all believe that that was a better 1000 yard shooter than the AR. I call Bull on his story.
How do you build a 1000 yard shooter from a hunting rifle? Build a better trigger? How about $300-$700. Free float the barrel? $100-$300. Even if it can be done. The shape of the barrel tends to make me think it would be difficult. Oh, then you have the barrel. The existing barrel is a hunting barrel, could not be made to work out to 1000 yards. It was never built for that kind of accuracy. Never happen. First the triangle barrel will cool more on the tips of the triangle, never allowing consistant shots. The dimension of the barrel will never allow for consistant shots. Not to mention the built in brake. If he changes the barrel, will he be able to find a barrel maker that can make this type of barrel with the proper twist rate? Maybe, but I bet you it would cost an arm and a leg.
He's got less than $1000 into his new rifle and scope. I'm saying that shooting out to 1000 yards would encompass buying scope which would cost much more than his total cost for his present rifle and scope, not to mention the cost rebuilding of the firearm.
Remember, 1000 yards is a half of a mile PLUS another 360 feet or 120 yards.
He could have bought a Savage 10 fb and had twice the rifle for about the same price. A little polishing of the trigger along with the factory adjustable trigger, he could have had a 1.5 lb trigger with a pretty clean break. The savage already comes with a nice heavy bull barrel, one that shoot out to 600 yards straight out of the box. The barrel is free floated right out of the box too.
For $2000, he could have had a pretty nice 600 yard gun. 1000 yard guns cost much more than that. The scope for a 1000 yard gun cost 3 times what he paid for his entire set up, so what make him think that a $600 gun is going to shoot accurately that far. The physics don't lie. The VTR is in fact a hunting rifle that can be used for target shooting. well so can a Marlin Model 60. So can any rifle, but to claim that it's going to be a 1000 yard shooter is not realistic.
For this gun to be considered a decent 1000 yard shooter, the gun would have to be considered an moa (minute of angle) rifle, which means every shot would land within an than 1 inch of each other for every 100 yards. So at 1000 yards he'd have to get every shot within a 10 inch circle. Agains, that one half mile, PLUS an additonal 360 feet or 120 yards.
Kind of like saying a Piper 182 is your new super sonic airplane or that you can build it to be that fast. or a Wellcraft cuddy is your new off shore speed boat, or that you're going to build it to go that fast.
Sorry for the rantings,
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl
Not to jump into ya'lls :groinkick lets see whos bigger competition BUT this is something I would NOT be proud to shout out anymore. They are not and do not represent what they use to be. Was a member for over 15 years then I had my eyes opened a little;) Wouldnt surprise me if you didnt have you 2nd by the end of this term:rofl:
Distance shooting is nice but I stick with the real world and close quarters combat. I'm just fine with my 9mm, 12ga, or 7.62x54r. Yes I did type that right, 7.62x54r.
How about JPFO? Maybe not as mainstream, but still a cool organization.
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
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Originally Posted by j_h_smith
For $2000, he could have had a pretty nice 600 yard gun.
Not saying I dont have firearms in that price range but you would be surprised at what can be done to an out of the box cheapo!!
This was shot with a Marlin V17, all I had to do was float the barrel (just because I like to on a wood stock) but I also polished the trigger, sear, and bolt.
http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h1...2-10154042.jpg
http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h1...2-10154052.jpg
Yes, that is a V17.....................17 Mach 2, one with Remington Premier and the other with Hornady. The 17 mach is a necked down 22 long rifle with only a 17 grain ballistic tip.
These were at 500 yards, in a canyon, on a day with no wind and high heat. It did take me about 10 rounds with 6 spotters to get my elevation right:oops:
Wanted to try for 600 but I couldnt get the elevation right and gave up.
Also have a Rossi Gallery 22lr that I can stack at 100 yards on iron sights.
Sure with I still had that deer lease, I love just going out to shoot but everything around here is 100yd so now I stick with the real world (crazy in my head) defense shooting. Close enough to look the intruder in the eye.:rolleye2:
I will be building a .308 Vanguard as soon as I can get the funding to do so because I have always wanted a Weatherby. I only have about $350.00 in the Marlin total, including the varmint scope.
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Dont forget to count the holes, the mag holds 7;) and they are all paper:gj:
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
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Originally Posted by Darkice
Some info on the standard off the shelf 308 federal.
308, Federal GM308M, 168 gr., 2600 ft/s, 4988 yards, 81 ft-lbs
The ammo is by far the least of the equation. Custom made ammo is still only as good as the rifle and the person squeezing the trigger.
Your facts listed does not assume the round will be aimed and shot at a target. This is the effective range. How far it will go down range before gravity acts on the bullet to pull it to the gound. Plus we're talking about the round and not the rifle. BIG difference.
Okay, maybe you won't listen to me, but how about a group of long range shooters that do this kind of stuff every weekend.
http://www.snipercentral.com/308.htm
How about 230 inches of bullet drop when using the current US military sniper ammo-M118? That's almost 20 feet of bullet drop.
More so, 108 inches of wind drift with a 10 mile per hour breeze using the same ammo listed above. That's 9 feet of drift.
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So what your saying is that a round that normally goes about 5000 yards on its own nobody in the world can hit a target at only 1000 yards?
Where did I say that no one could shoot that distance? Sure it can be done (albeit from a very small percentage of the worlds population)
But imagine, they're using a custom rifle, not a Remington VTR. They started with a much more expensive rifle, put thousands of dollars into the rifle with upgrades and custom parts. Added a $2500-$3500 scope. Then the shooter himself has to do their part, shoot under MOA. They train for months at a time and shoots these distance for years with a rifle that if bought in the real world would proably cost $10k.
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And one of your questions was about competition shooting. I have only shot the 50 in competitions. And that was at 1000 yards.
Where and when would you shoot a 50 bmg in a competition while in the military?
The only place I know of is at the Top Sniper competitions, then you would have to be a qualified sniper and I know that's not true by your selection of the VTR.
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I just don't understand why you have to attack me because i'm building a 1000 yard gun out of a VTR.
I'm not attacking you first off. I'm calling you out on your first post where you say that the AR wasn't good enough for you to shoot out to 1000 yards, so you go out and buy a Remington VTR. You indicate that this is your new 1000 yard shooter, you didn't say that this was the platform to build your new 1000 yard shooter. Neither of your guns are capable of hitting cloth out at 1000 yards accurately, particluarly with the glass you have mounted on either of the firearms. You probably couldn't see the target at 1000 yards with either scope.
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Just because it's not the gun you would have chosen because your overburdened with money doesn't mean it wont work. I say it will and i'm willing to prove it
This statement is tends to make me think that you've never shot anything at 1000 yards. I can build a skateboard to break the sound barrier at Bonneville too. Just because I say I can, doesn't make it a true fact. Your rifle is incapable of shooting out to 1000 yards accurately.
If you don't mind, tell me what parts you're going to use and what modifications your going to do?
If you could, tell me what scope you have on this rifle at this present time?
Also which scope will you be installing on this rifle to make it a 1000 yard shooter?
When your wife gives you permission to buy a real target rifle, at least start out with a Savage 10fb. Oh wait, you could have bought that rifle instead of the VTR. Never mind!
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl
Dont forget to count the holes, the mag holds 7;) and they are all paper:gj:
But you're not claiming an out of the box VTR is capable of shooting 1000 yards accuartely. If you know firearms, you'll realize what it takes to shoot out to 1000 yards. I've shot a properly prepped Garand out to 600 yards, but that was for fun and we were happy just to hit cloth.
BTW, good shooting.
Jim Smith
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Re: Out with the old / in with the new. (Sniper Rifle)
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith
But you're not claiming an out of the box VTR is capable of shooting 1000 yards accuartely.
I believe he said he is gonna be building it to a 1k shooter.
I wouldnt try to pull distance with any auto OR ported barrel.
Though, I bet I could make that thing shoot sub 6" at 1k
Also bet I could do it for under a grand, though I would have to use my own optics and it nice to not have to pay anyone for my smithing, just gotta buy myself a bottle of booze LOL
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