Help! My Municipality has passed a bylaw BANNING EXOTIC ANIMALS.

I am not sure what to do. I have lived in this town my whole life and have owned 2 bearded dragons and a Ball Python for quite some time. The town council has banned all types of exotic snakes, lizards, aracnids, etc...

To obtain a copy of the bylaw and a list of the banned animals, or to request an exemption I have to go to the municipal office...forget that - it's a setup.

My current feelings are to just ignore it and hope my reptiles are not found, and if they are fight it with legal action or move.

Has anyone been through this before, or can anyone give me some advise?

Here is a link to an article: http://www.intelligencer.ca/ArticleD...=true&e=891261

Id think youd get Grandfathered in

Go down there and get the paperwork

Saying your going to just IGNORE it can make reptile people look like were not law abiding citizens.

GET A COPY OF THE BYLAW!

I'm guessing they're banning VENOMOUS reptiles (and maybe large constrictors.

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Originally Posted by 2kdime

Id think youd get Grandfathered in

Go down there and get the paperwork

Saying your going to just IGNORE it can make reptile people look like were not law abiding citizens.

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I understand your point, however I am worried that If I go down to get an exemption they will simply deny me and then I will have to get rid of them. If I do not go down they will never know I have them. Furthermore, it is important to note that the council has been proven ignorant on the issue, they very much lack knowledge and the Mayor came right out and said that as long as he is living in this township there will be no snakes or anything like them.

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Originally Posted by eracer

GET A COPY OF THE BYLAW!

I'm guessing they're banning VENOMOUS reptiles (and maybe large constrictors.

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I will be getting a copy of the list, however I already know that it goes much further than just venomous snakes, lizards, and aracnids...it even includes Water Buffalo and Alpacas. Basically If its not a dog or a cat it will be on the List.

Here is another article:
http://www.intelligencer.ca/ArticleD...aspx?e=2746514

Pay a homeless guy $25 to get the paperwork for you. (I'm serious...)

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Originally Posted by eracer

Pay a homeless guy $25 to get the paperwork for you. (I'm serious...)

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Thanks,

My friend is going in to get the info, he is from out of town and has nothing to worry about.

This is so frustrating. :mad:

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Originally Posted by Savage420Siege

Thanks,

My friend is going in to get the info, he is from out of town and has nothing to worry about.

This is so frustrating. :mad:

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Yes it is. The combination of fear and ignorance, and the poor judgement of a few individuals, leads to this kind of overbearing regulation.

I am very conflicted about this kind of thing, because I am a libertarian at heart, yet I believe that there are too many stupid people in the world (like the idiots who released Burmese Pythons in S. Florida) to have freedom without regulation.

The problem is that regulation all too often leads to over-regulation.

We need to regulate the regulators. Elections are supposed to do that, but the problem is that so much damage can be done in a single political term of office.

Ok, so I have the information in my hand. You would not believe all that is listed on here..on second thought, you would!

Included in the ban is ALL species of Boidae and Pythonidae. That's right, my absolutely harmless Ball Python which is responsibly housed and cared for is not allowed to be in my posession. My Bearded Dragons are not affected.

If you have read the articles in the links I posted you may realize all of this came to be when someone coming from a large city who owns a fair amount of aracnids, snakes, etc... inquired about the local laws (Big mistake). Turns out this Bylaw has been around since Feb. 2008. Noone ever heard of it until now. Unless anyone here has a better idea for me I'm thinking the best thing to do is just play dumb and keep the snake on the down-low, I mean they never cared before, until these guys tried bringing all of these species down this way. I don't think I will be bothered, but if I were to go in front of the commitee and state that I own a species that is banned in this municipality and ask nicely for a exemption I will get handed an order to get rid of it within a given time frame.

Moving is not an option, and I do not want to give up the snake as I am quite attached to her.

What would you do in this situation?

Let your pythons chill.

eracer: No irresponsible people released the pythons that have naturalized in the Everglades. That happened when an importation holding facility full of Burm hatchlings was destroyed and blown into the swamp by Hurricane Andrew. There is no evidence a breeding population existed before then, and the genetics of the wild snakes point to a single population of normal-type animals as the origin. It was a natural disaster, not dumb keepers. Should South Florida be an importation hub for tropical exotics? Probably not, but that was a decision that Florida should have made a long time ago, and they still haven't made it. No one broke the law. As far as I'm concerned, Florida is responsible, if the blame can be laid anywhere. It certainly can't be laid at the feet of private snake owners.

Savage, in that situation, I would prepare to move, then request an exemption. If denied, I would move out of the affected area, and write a scathing mockery of the people who passed the law, and send it in to the local paper, along with the fact that the law made me move. It may or may not achieve anything, but I would certainly feel better after publicly humiliating them.

I would keep them on the down low personally. If you think they are going to come into your home busting through the door with a warrant, probably not. However if you are in fear, you may want to look at moving.

It's pretty easy to keep animals on the down low. That's all I'm going to say.

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

eracer: No irresponsible people released the pythons that have naturalized in the Everglades. That happened when an importation holding facility full of Burm hatchlings was destroyed and blown into the swamp by Hurricane Andrew. There is no evidence a breeding population existed before then, and the genetics of the wild snakes point to a single population of normal-type animals as the origin. It was a natural disaster, not dumb keepers. Should South Florida be an importation hub for tropical exotics? Probably not, but that was a decision that Florida should have made a long time ago, and they still haven't made it. No one broke the law. As far as I'm concerned, Florida is responsible, if the blame can be laid anywhere. It certainly can't be laid at the feet of private snake owners.

Savage, in that situation, I would prepare to move, then request an exemption. If denied, I would move out of the affected area, and write a scathing mockery of the people who passed the law, and send it in to the local paper, along with the fact that the law made me move. It may or may not achieve anything, but I would certainly feel better after publicly humiliating them.

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Come on donna, where DO you get your facts.

Savage, there have been many pythons released into the wild in Florida. Some by accident, some intentionally.

"genetics of the wild snakes point to a single population of normal-type animals as the origin." Again donna, where do you get this information?

Put down the chronic, put away hooka, open a window, turn on a fan and READ what's been proposed, passed or is currently pending.

Then decide whether to do something or not.

Humiliating someone when you don't have the weaponry to do so sounds all nice and romantic and all, but the truth is, you'll probably wind up shooting yourself in the foot, as donna well knows, if you try. Be armed or be quiet.

Whatever you do, take you advice with a good dose of caution. Not matter who you listen too, think before you act.

I am a firm believer that what I do in my home is no ones business, most people that come to my home are not even aware that I own over 30 reptiles, or rats. My animals have their own room which is locked at all times. I would look into getting that bylaw petitioned & changed if possible. Just my :2cent:

I would start a petition as well and would also attempt to file for the exemption. I understand you're nervous about the possibility of losing your snakes but I think that if you go about this responsibly they will grant you it. I would take pictures of your enclosure making sure to point out the security features like locks and whatnot and also take a video of you handling your ball so they can see how tame they really are.

I requies an premit to be exempted since you had your pet before th bylaw was passed. I got exempted for the first new premit when delaware changed their extoic animal permits requirements. I have to have a sales permit to prove out my hets. I would need a seller permit if I sold to th public.( reason I do adoptions if they have a permit) I also have to update it each year ( 25 bucksa year is better than 25 per snake every 3 years).
In the long run I may just reduce my numbers and keep just a select few.

Fight the power.

Crap...

I'm kind of freaking out. I live about 2 hours away from your area, give or take.

I'd say fight the power. But until you have the arsenal to do so, lay low and stock up with information and people and other things you will need.

Is that for the entire GTA or just the area around you? Because the reptile expos haul in hundreds of mixed reptiles and I've never heard any troubles with it in the news.

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Originally Posted by jbean7916

I would start a petition as well and would also attempt to file for the exemption. I understand you're nervous about the possibility of losing your snakes but I think that if you go about this responsibly they will grant you it. I would take pictures of your enclosure making sure to point out the security features like locks and whatnot and also take a video of you handling your ball so they can see how tame they really are.

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Thank you for your advice, however...in case you did not read the entire thread and the articles posted:
- Two people who wanted to move to the area were denyed the right to bring reptiles
- They made several attemps to educate the ignorant people behind this decision including dropping off large amounts of information and doing a powerpoint presentation
- This was all ignored and they are trying to fight this with legal action
- The Mayor of the township came right out and said "there will be no snakes in this township as long as I am living here"

This is what I am facing, I am a pretty good gambler - I know when the odds are stacked against me.

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Originally Posted by LP.

Crap...

I'm kind of freaking out. I live about 2 hours away from your area, give or take.

I'd say fight the power. But until you have the arsenal to do so, lay low and stock up with information and people and other things you will need.

Is that for the entire GTA or just the area around you? Because the reptile expos haul in hundreds of mixed reptiles and I've never heard any troubles with it in the news.

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I am not sure where you are from but you should not have much to worry about. Stirling is a small town north of Belleville (two hours east of toronto). This would never happen in a larger community for several reasons, but mainly because the people who have done this are uninformed/uneducated/ignorant on the issue. They have banned not only small constrictors but basically everything that is an exotic, wild, or undemesticated animal.

"Included on the list of prohibited animals are all venomous arachnids including tarantulas, and all venomous reptilia, including venomous snakes and lizards. Large cats are also on the list."

None of your reptiles are venomous, so you should be all set. You shouldn't panic. I don't think they're banning ball pythons and bearded dragons. No where in the article did it say ALL exotic animals. Just venomous.

x nicole

Please be very careful when offering advice which would in fact be illegal. This board has a bylaw itself that this is not acceptable. I have an active infraction for telling someone to bend the law, you are telling this person to break the law.

I wouldn't want anyone to be found guilty of breaking this bylaw like I did.

All of you should get 20 lashes with a wet willy for giving advice that would cause the OP to break the law. :colbert::colbert::colbert:

Shame on you!;)
Jim Smith

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Originally Posted by nicolexdisaster

"Included on the list of prohibited animals are all venomous arachnids including tarantulas, and all venomous reptilia, including venomous snakes and lizards. Large cats are also on the list."

None of your reptiles are venomous, so you should be all set. You shouldn't panic. I don't think they're banning ball pythons and bearded dragons. No where in the article did it say ALL exotic animals. Just venomous.

x nicole

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The article is incomplete, it does not include the list. I have all the paper work including the Bylaw itself along with the list of banned animals, the list is huge. The list includes "ALL serpants of the species Pythonidae and Boidae".
My Dragons are fine, my Ball is illegal.

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Originally Posted by j_h_smith

Please be very careful when offering advice which would in fact be illegal. This board has a bylaw itself that this is not acceptable. I have an active infraction for telling someone to bend the law, you are telling this person to break the law.

I wouldn't want anyone to be found guilty of breaking this bylaw like I did.

All of you should get 20 lashes with a wet willy for giving advice that would cause the OP to break the law. :colbert::colbert::colbert:

Shame on you!;)
Jim Smith

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I am only asking what you people would do in my situation, I am not asking you to tell me what to do. I am in a real snag here. I wish I could post the Bylaw and the list for you people to read, it is outragous and the council is showing no sympathy for our interests. These people don't care to know how wonderful it is to own such a creature, they dont want them in their neighborhoods because they are "big slimey man killers", not harmless pets.

I've heard rumors of people who have many snakes that no one knows about. They don't advertise that they have them.

Maybe this is a course you should look closely at following.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

I've heard rumors of people who have many snakes that no one knows about. They don't advertise that they have them.

Maybe this is a course you should look closely at following.

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I have already begun this process because as best I can tell I don't stand a chance getting an exemption or anything like that (for reasons already discussed in this thread). I have deleted all pictures of her from Facebook, have been telling my close friends and family who know about her what is going on and will not be showing her to any new people or talking openly about it in public. Also, anyone who knows who may ask about her who I do not know well will be told I lost interest and sold her to a friend who lives out of town.

I dont see any other option. I am a responsible owner so there should be no reason for a problem to arise. She's not going to be roaming at large, she's not bothering anyone, therefore there should be no reason for anyone to report me and that in my eyes is the only thing that would cause me trouble. They are not actively looking for these types of things, going door to door, or offering rewards for information or anything, and I imagine a lot of people who know people who have reptiles aren't even aware of this bylaw.

Hi,

Sorry guys but this has passed beyond discussing a law and the legal ways of doing anything about it.

As a result I'm afraid I'm locking this down as per the following rule in the FAQ.

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Originally Posted by Site T.O.S.

8. No posts promoting illegal behavior will be tolerated, including but not limited to warez/pirating of copyrighted material, illegal drug or alcohol usage, and illegal ownership or trafficking of species.

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dr del