Eye caps (sorry to post another thread) HELP! HELP!

On my ball python Nergal, I haven't been able to see his pupils since we got him from Petco. His eyes were too cloudy looking, and NOT because he was in shed.
I'm very worried he may have several layers of stuck eye caps, because when he was in Petco he had quite a bit of stuck shed on his head. It doesn't go away when he sheds now, and he has shed 3-4 times with us.
One of his eyes looks a LOT like this:
http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/...ge/eyecap1.jpg
It has the dent in the middle of the eye where his pupil should be, and the rest is thick looking and full of dents/scratch looking things.
His other eye looks similar but is a little clearer, with less dents.
What should I do? I tried gently rubbing a wet Q-tip over the top of his eye using the roll-back method on Youtube, and applied no pressure, after I had soaked him for a good 30 minutes. I did not want to touch his eye, so I just rubbed around the top of his head where the eye caps start.
Nothing happened, nothing came off.
I've raised his humidity, nothing. He's shed--didn't change. He has clean water to drink, and I see him drink it--nada.
What do I do? Should I bring him to a vet? I'm worried he may have layers of eyecaps on there.
I just want to see his beautiful snakey eyes that I know are under there SOMEwhere. :(
Please help!

Also, on one eye he has white skin in one of the edges of his eye. Could this be some skin he didn't shed off?

The easiest way to remove retained eyecaps is to put a little drop of mineral oil on your finger and rub it over his eye....it doesn't hurt, just let that soak in good....I usually wait overnight. Then take a damp Qtip and it should roll right off. Be sure to coat the eye pretty good, especially if you think he has more than one eyecap retained. You may have to do this a couple of ties to remove them all. I have never had this not work. Good Luck!

That picture you posted doesn't look at all like a stuck eye cap. They look like they have a silvery film over them. That snake looks like he's had injury to his eye. It looks like some one removed the protective layer of scale from the eye itself. If that's what your snake looks like, leave him alone and stop play with his eyes. They may or may not ever be normal again. I don't know if they can regrow that layer of scale or not, but in the mean time take anything sharp or rough out of the enclosure and give him newspaper or paper towel as substrate so nothing is irritating that skin. If your snake is having rapid sheds, then I can pretty much guarantee that he's trying to form a protective layer of skin over his eyes, don't remove it. Make sure your humidity is correct and just leave it alone.

http://www.joecompelreptiles.com/bal..._cap/index.asp (Sorry if posting that link isn't allow mods)

That is what a retained eye cap looks like. When a ball sheds its eye caps they all come off at once, not one at a time.

Were it me, I would make sure the humidity stays relatively high (in the 60% range or a little higher) AND I would get the snake to a vet with experience in dealing with snakes. I would NOT physically mess with the eye itself without knowing precisely what I was dealing with.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sarahlovesmiike

http://www.joecompelreptiles.com/bal..._cap/index.asp (Sorry if posting that link isn't allow mods)

That is what a retained eye cap looks like. When a ball sheds its eye caps they all come off at once, not one at a time.

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perfectly acceptable ;)

This is a picture of what his eyes look like (I'm sorry for the bad quality).
I got some Zoo Med Shedding Aid, and it says you can use it for snakes with retained eye caps by just spraying it on. Could I try that--would it serve the same purpose as the mineral oil?
Thanks.
http://i1028.photobucket.com/albums/...gal/eyeone.jpg
http://i1028.photobucket.com/albums/...gal/eyetwo.jpg

Try to get closer pictures, it is hard to tell from so far away.

I really think, since you don't KNOW it's a retained eyecap, that you shouldn't mess with it at all. Let a vet evaluate it and help you. Even with known eyecaps...one retained after a typical shed is fairly simple to remove with a number of different gentle remedies....but multiple retained caps after many months of bad sheds is something else entirely, and again, should be evaluated and dealt with by a pro.

You run a high risk of causing more and possibly permanent damage to the eye.

I haven't been messing with him or his eyes--that's why I was posting here to see if there was something I SHOULD be doing. I really don't feel comfortable touching his eyes.
He usually sheds once a month...is that too often? Could he have physically injured his eye?
The main point of the pictures ( I have a few more I will post in a sec) is to show that his pupils, or eye in general, are not visible. It looks too cloudy in there. :( And dark. Whereas on my other snakes, even BP's, their eyes are a noticeable color--very green, with the pupils being easy to locate. (center position of the eye).
Anyone know of any exotic vets in Spokane, WA, or any sites that can help me locate one via a search engine? I think I'm going to take him in ASAP.
I want my little snakey to be ok. :(
Pics (the quality just keeps getting worse, I'm sorry guys.)
http://i1028.photobucket.com/albums/...ergal/eye1.jpg
http://i1028.photobucket.com/albums/...ergal/eye2.jpg
Again, I haven't been messing with his eye. I'm not comfortable doing that at this point. Maybe somewhere down the line if I become a breeder, but not now. :oops:

Try this link...

http://www.anapsid.org/vets/index.html#vetlist

shellie: this is not about helping with the eye caps but rather help you with getting clearer picture. :) use the 'macro' setting in your camera, its the one with the flower icon. it will then focus on what's near and not the background :D

hope this helps

lol I would do that if I had a nice camera. I use the crummy 2 mp one in my phone. -.-
I need to invest in a camera. ;-;

that's a really clear picture for a camera though! very nice. i'm sorry getting Off Topic here. i'll shut up now. haha

It sounds like he injured his eye to me, if he's shedding that often. Though I've never had a young snake so I'm not sure about the shedding rate for anything but an adult. From those pictures his eyes look normal. I can't see my males pupils either, but that doesn't mean there is something wrong. Usually you can see the pupils in a snake with light colored eyes. Green eyes are consistent with pastels :) Don't mean to get your hopes up, but what did you buy it as?

Got the baby one with green eyes from Northwest seed and pet...they were just labeled normals, 'cause I saw they had a pastel for sale at their other location in Spokane, didn't buy him though. Did you see the pictures of them in my thread under BP pictures? I don't think my phone captured the green but it is pretty. :]
Maybe I'll get lucky but like you said, not gonna get my hopes up XD

Hi shellie, it's hard to tell from those pics, but neither eye looks as bad as that picture you included in your first post. I'm going to second the suggestion that you bump his humidity next shed--maybe put him in a tub if he's normally in a tank?-- and also repeat the suggestion to stop messing with his eye and take him to a good herp vet.

I've had a couple of scares with my black pastel male because he's had dimpled, crusty-looking eyes after a shed. I rubbed at them for a while---but there was no extra eyecap, he just had a dimple from the low humidity and rubbing his head.

It's happened twice, and it's scary, because I could have blinded him if I'd kept it up. Now I put him the tubs whenever I see he's in shed.

Get your Nergal to a vet. And don't poke at his eyes in the meantime!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by loonunit

Hi shellie, it's hard to tell from those pics, but neither eye looks as bad as that picture you included in your first post. I'm going to second the suggestion that you bump his humidity next shed--maybe put him in a tub if he's normally in a tank?-- and also repeat the suggestion to stop messing with his eye and take him to a good herp vet.

I've had a couple of scares with my black pastel male because he's had dimpled, crusty-looking eyes after a shed. I rubbed at them for a while---but there was no extra eyecap, he just had a dimple from the low humidity and rubbing his head.

It's happened twice, and it's scary, because I could have blinded him if I'd kept it up. Now I put him the tubs whenever I see he's in shed.

Get your Nergal to a vet. And don't poke at his eyes in the meantime!

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This is actually an old thread who's problem has been resolved. It got bumped to the top with a new question about eyecaps. I've gone ahead and split out the new question into its own thread to avoid this kind of confusion.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...tiple-eye-caps..

:)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JLC

I really think, since you don't KNOW it's a retained eyecap, that you shouldn't mess with it at all. Let a vet evaluate it and help you. Even with known eyecaps...one retained after a typical shed is fairly simple to remove with a number of different gentle remedies....but multiple retained caps after many months of bad sheds is something else entirely, and again, should be evaluated and dealt with by a pro.

You run a high risk of causing more and possibly permanent damage to the eye.

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I agree, you should really see about finding a good vet with reptile experiance. Pet stores are not known for taking very good care of their animals in general, especially reptiles and amphibians who require special light or temps. It's very possible that your snake has an injury to it's eye do to bad care from the store. If that's the case a vet should look at it to make sure no further injury is caused. Snakes rely on their eyes very, very much, and it could be devestating for them to lose their sight.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dante's_Girl

Snakes rely on their eyes very, very much, and it could be devestating for them to lose their sight.

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While I can't speak for all species, I know that eyesight is just one of the senses that ball pythons rely on. They use smell and infrared sensors as much, if not more, than their eyes. While it would be very sad for any ball python to be blind, I know of several that get along just fine without their eyesight.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JLC

While I can't speak for all species, I know that eyesight is just one of the senses that ball pythons rely on. They use smell and infrared sensors as much, if not more, than their eyes. While it would be very sad for any ball python to be blind, I know of several that get along just fine without their eyesight.

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Oh well that's good to hear. Sorry if I mis-guided anyone on that :redface:, I had just been told by several people that they only use their eyes. I though it kinda seemed extreme, and it's nice to hear that they can continue to get around good without it. Thanks for the correction, I love learning all I can :D