New to ball pythons and need desperate help!

Hey guys so I'm new at being a snake owner and my new baby ball python was schedualed to eat today for the first time since the pet shop. I put the mouse in the cage, took off his hide and made it so the mouse was by him and he would not eat! I think maybe he is just stressed, I've been reading up on this snake since i got him and didn't realize how shy they are. When I first got him I had him on display in my living room and he didn't go into his hide at all for the first two days. So I decided to move him to another location that is a bit quieter and leave him alone. When I set him up in the other room he instantly went into his hide. I didn't handle him for a couple days and when I went to pick him up today I stroked him gentley and then he curled up and hissed at me. I need some help guys, I just want a healthy relationship with my new snake :(. Also I only have a half log as his main hide and a giant water dish, I have another hide that is like a cave that i just bought and want to put it in but I don't want to change his enviorenment again because he could get stressed again. What should I do?

Removing the hide will just further stress the animal..... Try not to disturb them untill they get settled.... If they are not interested just try again next week...

I'll get the ball started till some more experienced people can help out. A couple common questions theyre going to ask to help them better help you will be

tank size,
temperatures,
what type of heat are you providing and is there a thermostat?
Snake size vs prey size

That said, its generally a good idea to leave them alone for atleast a week after you first get them home. It's also not the end of the world if they dont eat right away, BP's are notorious for being flaky when it comes to feeding time.
Now Ill make way for someone who knows alittle more to help you :)

alright well heres what my setup is

10 gallon glass tank
one half log hide on the warm side
Big water dish on the cold side
using a 60w daylight from 8am to 8pm and a 50w infared at night
and I lined the tank with some moss that came with the tank
he likes the moss i can tell because he brought some into his hide :D
I keep day temps at 87-90 and night temps 85

anything else i can say to further help ?

oh and size of my prey is about the gurth of my snake

Tank size is good.
Toss the log. Get another cave identical to the one you have. Put one on the hot side, one on the cool. You don't want him not thermoregulating because he's only comfortable in one spot.
Scrap the lights if possible (see below). If ambient temps drop below 75, use the infrared over the water dish.
Moss is fine, just don't keep it WET or it could lead to scale rot.
Night drops are not necessary.
Prey size is good. 10-15% of his body weight up to 150g is another thing to use.

Get something to heat the tank from underneath. Ball pythons are nocturnal, so any light is just unnatural for them, and they use belly heat to digest. You can use the heat pads, but in my experience a product called Flexwatt heat tape is exponentially cheaper. I got it from http://www.reptilebasics.com. Get a piece that will cover 1/3 to 1/2 of the tank bottom. I'm thinking a foot of the 11" wide will do. You can cut between the black lines to fit. Get the clips and have them attach it for you (free). Get some foil tape to attach it (walmart probably). It's really sticky and holds up to heat better than duct tape or any other.

You also need a thermostat no matter what you're heating with. This is probably the best for the price. There is much better out there, but this should be fine for one snake. Place the probe between the Flexwatt and the glass with foil tape.

You need something digital and preferably with a probe to measure the temps. Dial gauges and stick-ons are useless. There's a common one called the AccuRite Indoor/Outdoor Weather Station. It's found around the lightbulbs/DIY section of walmart. Also found at Home Depot or possibly Lowe's. The alternative is a temp gun, which is probably more accurate, but you have to move the hide and substrate to measure the glass under it. Place the probe under the substrate under the hot hide right against the glass of the enclosure above the Flexwatt. Use this reading to set the thermostat. You want something in the low 90's.

I know I wrote a lot, but all I'm really saying is switch to belly heat and get a digital thermometer. :D

It's good you moved him somewhere quieter. Him hiding is a good sign. When you feed, don't remove his hide. Just drop it in and watch. NEVER leave a live rodent alone with him. Then leave him alone for two days or he might puke. :puke2: Yeah, not good.

I think you've done pretty well so far. One last warning: don't listen to petshops! They're notorious for giving out bad information. And ball pythons are notorious for not eating, so try not to let it stress you out. They can go up to a year if they're big enough.

Read the caresheet if you haven't. Man, I'm long-winded! :D Good luck and enjoy your cool pet.:salute:

Crap, one more thing. Change will stress him out to some degree no matter what. It's better to change everything for the better sooner rather than later, because the benefits of the change will alleviate probably more stress than the change itself causes.

Wow, thank you so much. All that information has become so much more helpful to me! I will be getting a digi thermo and a undertank heater ASAP. I actually had the under tank heater in my hands at the pet shop and the guy just told me to use the daylight and nightlight and it would be fine, and actually made be put it back! He also told me to handle him after a few days! I'm glad to have people who actually know what they are talking about helping me out aha. So my question now is, I plan on leaving him alone for a while but the thing is, the hide he has right now is the half log. I want to switch it to the cave but the thing is, the tank isn't big enough for identical caves or even another hide, I only have room for the water dish because it is so big. This is a list of things I could put in.

I have a small tree with plastic leaves
a small log
a half log
a cave hide
and a big water dish.

Also, I think I might take the moss out because I sprayed it with water the first day I got him, the pet shop guy told me that it would increase humidity and help him. I've been trying extremely hard but I think I am just listening to the wrong people.

Thank you for all your support :D

Well, just get rid of that big water dish, he doesn't need a swimming pool. Just a watering hole.

You can sometimes get away with only one hide, it depends on the snake.

I applaud you for trying to do right by your little guy by coming here, and for having the sense and the guts to realize those pet shop people are only concerned with one thing, making you spend money.

It will take a little tweaking, but you'll get there. In the meantime, try not to freak if he won't eat. I had a couple of new hatchlings that went 8 weeks without eating.:O

Gale

Yea, I actually just surrounded his tank in a grey towel to cover the openings in the glass too. I want him to be as comfortable as possible! :D Yes I am glad I came to this site, you guys have helped me so much. I am getting a smaller water dish as soon as possible probably the same time I go to get the heating pad. is it okay to check up on him often or should I just not go in the room at all for a week? and also I put the mouse on the cool side of the cage outside it to try to taunt him to come out and make him more hungry >:) I just wanna see him outside his hide tonight

just go in to check his temps and humidity and for poop or anything. try to be as quiet as possible too.
when u feed him just place it in front of the hide or its head just inside. he will eat better if he feels safe and secure.
u dont want to see him out of his hide, that means he is stressed and isnt happy, or just testing the limits of his new home. the less u see him the better. these snakes are solitary animals, they like to hide. if u want to see ur snake all the time, you got the wrong kind my friend. i only see mine when cleaning, feeding, or handling once or twice a week

so when i go to handle him if he is in hiding should I just take his hiding off and try to pick him up? I just dont wanna stress him anymore, I plan on leaving him alone and not handling him till his first meal next week since he didn't want to feed today. thanx for all the advice this has really really helped me !

I have no clue if this has been mentioned. But what I do/heard is that don't feed your BP in the cage you keep him in because it will eventually get used to it and then when you reach into the cage to handle him, he might mistake your hand for food. I feed mine out of it on my rug.
I'm new to this whole thing too lol

I've been handling mine everyday since I've owned him. He's about 6weeks old I believe. I remove the hide, pet him? I guess, then wait for him to move so I know he's awake, after that I pick him up.
Mine was really shy and scared too when I started doing this. I just held him in my hand when he was wrapped in a ball then waited until he got comfortable and he eventually started unwrapping/moving around.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bRy

I have no clue if this has been mentioned. But what I do/heard is that don't feed your BP in the cage you keep him in because it will eventually get used to it and then when you reach into the cage to handle him, he might mistake your hand for food. I feed mine out of it on my rug.
I'm new to this whole thing too lol

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NO, NO, NO, that is not accurate. Please don't listen to that, for it is completely inaccurate. It can be much more stressful to feed out of cage, and increases the chance of regurgitation!

Oh snapsssssssss... I'll stop doing that Lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bRy

I have no clue if this has been mentioned. But what I do/heard is that don't feed your BP in the cage you keep him in because it will eventually get used to it and then when you reach into the cage to handle him, he might mistake your hand for food. I feed mine out of it on my rug.
I'm new to this whole thing too lol

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Feeding on the rug, what a novel way to throw your snake off feed :P

Feeding in the enclosure is what most people do, they will not bite you because you feed in their enclosure.

If there isn't enough room for two hides just add some fake vines for him to hide under, cover 3 sides of the tank and get some belly heat, your snake will love you for it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bRy

I have no clue if this has been mentioned. But what I do/heard is that don't feed your BP in the cage you keep him in because it will eventually get used to it and then when you reach into the cage to handle him, he might mistake your hand for food. I feed mine out of it on my rug.
I'm new to this whole thing too lol

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This is a myth, at least with ball pythons. I feed all my snakes in their home enclosures and not once have I been bitten. If your hand is never present during the feeding process, how can they ever mistake it for food?

i feed both my BP's inside their enclosure. all i do is stick the rats warm head in the entry to the hide and they strike immediately. when i put my thumb in to take the hide off they dont even bother with me. its all false. do not handle everyday. give them 2 days after eating

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Marley

so when i go to handle him if he is in hiding should I just take his hiding off and try to pick him up? I just dont wanna stress him anymore, I plan on leaving him alone and not handling him till his first meal next week since he didn't want to feed today. thanx for all the advice this has really really helped me !

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once he is adjusted, just open the enclosure and pick him up. dont be too fast or rough or u might get hissed at or even struck at.

I'm so glad that I found this site. Thank you guys for all your help. I'm going to do this actually, I'm going to give him a while to settle in then i'm going to replace his hide with the cave, move all the moss to the cool side and make a lil bed for him, he loves the moss. do you think that I should just make changes today? or just leave him alone?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Marley

I'm so glad that I found this site. Thank you guys for all your help. I'm going to do this actually, I'm going to give him a while to settle in then i'm going to replace his hide with the cave, move all the moss to the cool side and make a lil bed for him, he loves the moss. do you think that I should just make changes today? or just leave him alone?

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Get every thing set up properly today and then do not disturb him or handle him for a week. And then try feeding AFTER that week is over. THis should have been done right from the start but you got some bad advice from the pet store, so not your fault. WHen you get a new reptile always wait at least a week before handling it so it can settle in and for bp's it is also best to get it feeding before you handle it as well. Because he didn't have the proper set up when you first got him just treat it like you got him today, get everything set up properly and then wait that week. I know it will be hard and you will want to handle him and might get worried about him but jsut leave him be.

Make sure the hides are as small as they can be. Snakes like to feel a tight space when they hide, it makes them feel more secure.

Make sure you get rid of the lights (they just dry out the tank) and get a UTH to warm the tank and have a thermostat or rheostat to make sure you can control the temperature and have a proper thermometer with a probe to make sure you are accuratly reading the uth temps. Place the probe directly over the UTH. If you don'tsecure it down she might also push it off the uth so watch for that. ANd don't secure it with tap as that could get peeled off and stick to your sanke no matter how well you stick it too the tank.

ANd abouty the eatting, bp's are naortious for going off food. Don't freak out if he doesn't eat right away. Just leave the mouse or rat in the tank over night and if it is still there in the morning throw it out and don't try again until the next week. If it isn't eatting and you try feeding it too often that will jsut put it off food even more.

I assume it is a hatching if it is only in a 10g tank. Is that trure or did the pet store get you to buy a tank for a snake that might be too big for it?

Well, today I feel a little more confident about the terrarium. I went to my local petsmart to check out some things and setup the tank a little better, not perfect but better. I have two hides on each side now, hotside with the cave and the cool side with the half log and mossbed with a tree. I also purchased a smaller waterdish as suggested to create more room. I am still using lights because for now its all that I can afford. The temps on the stick on gauge is reading about 87-92 during day (with 60w daylight) and about 85-87 at night(with 50w infared). Using my best judgement I also picked up a 50w moonlight blue bulb, I was reading that these are much better than infared (oppinions?). All in all I think hes going to like his new setup alot better! As soon as i get my next check I can purchase a thermometer and homometer and the UTH. I'm hoping he will be okay using lights untill I can purchase the tank heater?

Thanx again to everyones help! I feel alot more confident and secure about Marley and his current terrerium. :)

I'm also not sure how much he weighs or how long he is as soon as this week quarentine is up i'll get his measurements and put up pictures to fully determine my type of bp :D

"I was reading that these are much better than infrared (opinions?)."

I have a blue "moonlight" bulb. It's garbage. The red infrared bulb generates more heat.
But I don't have mine on a 10 gallon tank so maybe its fine for you. In my opinion, infrared is much better.

Hi,

You really need to get the acurite digital thermometer rather than the stick on ones - to be blunt using those bits of junk you really have no clue what the temps are where your animal is spending its time. :(

And that's where it matters.

I take it you cannot return the lights for store credit to pick up a reptitemp 500 and a UTH?

I hate it when stores sell people the wrong stuff. :mad:


dr del

Yea the tank came with the lights and everything. How much do the reptitemp 500s cost? like I said I will be purchasing the thermo and hermo next week when i feed him and hopefully the UTH untill then I'll just have to use the lights, I'm sure a 60w and 50w nightlite will be fine untill then?

Yea this pet guy gave my snake such a rough start and I feel so bad for him :( but hopefully after this week he will be a lil settled in and learn I love him :D

Reptitemp 500r is about the same as the one I suggested, but much harder to use and not really as trusted.

Use whatever light you must for now. Less visual light at night, if possible. Pet store might have a Ceramic Heat Emitter bulb, which uses no visual light, just infrared.

Heck I'd use the dimmer night light all the time if I could. I just don't think constant, direct, bright light, even if it's daytime is good for them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stevepoppers

Reptitemp 500r is about the same as the one I suggested, but much harder to use and not really as trusted.

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I trust it just fine.. It is just harder to dial in the temp since there is no digital read out.

Yes, it's quite difficult to get it set right. I'm still pretty iffy about it. PurplePython has his fail and made a big stinkoo, and it's just got that reputation, y'know? I'd definitely have liked something even a little bit better.

Incidentally, I narrowed down my odd temp issues to substrate thickness and different hides, which held more heat. All's stable.

Its not the best thermostat. The hydrofarm would be a better choice. But it isn't a total waste of money. Its better to have some sort of thermostat then none at all.

Wow, I just went to check up on Marley and I'm glad I did. The moonlight bulb I bought today did not create less heat at all, in fact my thermometer went up by several degrees! So I turned the light on and looked at the temp and it read over 90! So freaking out that my snake will fry I put back on the infared light I was using before because that seems to keep the heat around 85-88 at night. I am just going to go to the store asap and get a thermostat and weather station and a uth as soon as I can. Also my snake hasn't moved from his half log hide since he went in two days ago! I moved the heat side to the cave today when I made the adjustments to his Terrerium and im hoping by morning he will move to his other hide. I'm just worried that he's okay. When are ball pythons most active late at night? Or do they usually stay in thier hides? I'm thinking he doesn't want to move because he is stressed. We will see tomorrow morning...

Hiding is a good thing. Pacing and roaming are signs of stress. At night they will roam around and that is normal. They are nocturnal. Some won't even come out at night though.

You don't need to change the temperature from day to night. A constant 88-95 is fine.

If he's hiding, be it day or night, he's good. They can and do spend days at a time in one place (or appear to). They do tend to be more active at night than day.

Thanx :D everything posted here has helped me tremendously! I'm glad to be a proud owner of a ball python now :D I can't wait till this quarentine period is over and I can start picking him up!

I am going today to get a weatherstation because everyone was right, that thermometer is garbage, it reads over 90 ever since i put in the moonlight and usually only reads between 85-90

I know alot of this has been covered but here is my rehashing of it.

Thermometer:
http://willowtreehome.com/Merchant2/...01/00891A1.jpg
Other brands are fine it just should have a temp and humidity reading as well as an outdoor probe for temp. You place this inside the tank and put the probe under the warm hide. That way you know the ambient temp the ambient humidyt and the temp under the warm hide all with a glance. This will cost 10 to 15 dollars, I got mine at Walmart.

Under the tank heating pad:
http://www.petsmart.com/product/inde...ductId=2752652 about 20 bucks at petsmart. You stick this to the bottom of the warm side (under the tank, this does not go in the tank)

Hides:
Get a smaller hide is usually great advice. Your snake wants to cram itself in its hide. If you think its right its most likely to big. What I usually recommend for a baby ball. Is the bottom of a terracotta pot. Basically you find a something that your snake will just barely fit in. Make an opening if there isn't one already and you are all set. Do some searching on this site and you will find many great ideas. Key is to have two identical hides so that your snake can choose the right temp. If you give your snake two different hides they will choose the one they feel safest in regardless of whether its healthy for them or not.

Bedding:
Often referred to as substrate. There are many good substrates out there. I have used aspen shavings they are cheap relatively bad at holding humidity and hard to spot urates sometimes. It comes in large bails or smaller ones. http://www.petsmart.com/product/inde...ductId=2755138
Cypress is my favorite right now. Its a little more expensive, easy to spot urates and holds humidity well. http://www.petsmart.com/product/inde...ductId=2752444
Coconut husk is more expensive yet but holds humidity extremely well. http://www.petsmart.com/product/inde...ductId=3092177

Water bowl:
Try and find something that is hard to tip over and about as big as the hide. Many people will say you can go smaller, and you can, but its nice to have something they can get all the way in if they want and a larger water bowl will help keep humidity up.

Thermostat/Rheostat:
This is the hardest part and most important. Your temperature should be controlled and constant. I know that sometimes you can find a thermostat or rheostat at petsmart but sometimes you can't and it will not be a good one. My recommendation is to buy one online. There are many places you can buy these. I got mine here http://www.reptilebasics.com/product...roductid=16172 they do offer a version of that model that is 20 dollars cheaper but you have to wire it yourself. If you or someone you trust can do that its a good way to go. Reptile Basics also sells great hides and lots of other things you might need/want.

On a final note. You are already better than most owners of Ball Pythons. You came to the right place to get the knowledge you need. Don't worry to much about not having the money to get things perfect. Do the best you can and have a plan to get where you want to be. Good luck and stay calm. My snake has gone months without eating. I can't say I wasn't stressed myself but I know that I had the support of this forum and when she was ready she ate.

they already got you covered on what to do but I must add, the CARESHEET is your desperate answer! :D

Well guys, I have some bad news. I purchased a stick on gauge for hermit crabs today that measures temp. and humidity. I found out that with the lights being run so often the tank I found was getting almost no humidity! :O So I sprayed it with some water to regulate the humidty to about 55-60. Question now. Is my snake possibly sick from being so dry? He hasn't moved for a few days and I've been pretty worried. I am getting a UTH as soon as humanly possible but untill then to keep the gauge reading 55 and above I have to spray down his cage every few hours...also I have moss setup in there and I was told its bad to spray it. :(

Hi,

Your missing the point.

Stickons give inaccurate readings - you just wasted money and still do not have a reliable way to know what either your temp or humidity is. :(

Seriously the digital acurite is $12 - how much did you waste on this hermit crab thing?


dr del

My girlfriend talked me out of getting the digi cuz it was too big. and it was like 30 dollars for a good one, I paid 9 dollars for the hermit one, I just wanted an Idea of the humidity, she paid for the gauge but I plan on getting the digi at petsmart for 24.99 when I get paid.

Hi,

I really wouldn't get one from there if you can avoid it - it would be much cheaper to buy one online (ebay etc ) if there is no wallmart or such near you.


dr del

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Marley

My girlfriend talked me out of getting the digi cuz it was too big. and it was like 30 dollars for a good one, I paid 9 dollars for the hermit one, I just wanted an Idea of the humidity, she paid for the gauge but I plan on getting the digi at petsmart for 24.99 when I get paid.

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Don't let her talk you out of something that your animal NEEDS. If it isn't digital, it is junk. It is a waste of money. Do yourself a favor and return it.

You should be able to find the accurite weather station with a wired probe at home depot for $12.

You may have spotted the wrong unit, as some are quite big and expensive. It should be about 2"x3". Certainly small enough to fit in there.

Also, I wouldn't buy anything that's marketed for animals, since they tend to be more expensive, yet cheaper made.

The digital thermometers/hygrometer is really the best way to go. As for your snake not moving. Thats what ball pythons do. If you want a more active snake you would be far better off getting a corn snake. Ball pythons curl up in a nice safe warm place until they get hungry.

Here is a list of place I found online that sell what we are talking about. This or something similar should be able to be found at Walmart or Lowes or Home Depot.

http://www.google.com/products?q=Acu...0891&scoring=p

Well I have awesome news today. Now that have the temp and humidity going good now and found out why Marley wasn't moving a whole lot. I found out that today he has his first shed! I'm so glad I over did the humidity last night, this morning I found him in his other hide(the cave) on the cool side. He has seemed a lil more active this morning but I think hes going to sleep now that its daytime. Thanx everyone for all the help! I'll be getting all the right supplies this weekend and hopefully he eats!

If you haven't gotten a proper thermometer/hygrometer yet you have no idea if you have the proper temps and humidity. The stick on ones are no good. You must get rid of them and get the digital one with a probe. And don't buy one from a pet store. Got to a hardware store. It will be much cheaper buying one form them.

Aslo you really need to get rid of the lamps and get a UTH ASAP. The lamps are no good for BP'S then get their warmth from their belly, but lamps provide back heat. That's why you need the UTH, it gives the belly heat.

PS
If this post comes off a little rude, I don't mean it too, I am just trying to quickly give off the advice, so it might be a little blunt.

I wouldn't waste my money on overpriced thermometers/hygrometers in pet shops. Just go to Walmart, Lowe's, Home Depot, etc. and look for an indoor-outdoor themometer/hygrometer. I found them at Walmart for $7 or $8, I think?

Ditto on nixing the lamps, too. Lamps suck moisture out of the air and lead to humidity-related shed issues.